fulcizombieu said:
How about the fact that the best selling ps2 games (the GTA games) have HORRIBLE frame rates(GTA:SA had ..what(??) a 20-25 fps frame rate at best).I don't remember all these sony fanboys whining about it...
Oh you're dead wrong on that one. But if you payed attention, you might have seen that I even stamped on the mighty Metal Gear Solid 3 for its 30 Hz framerate in my longer rant - and MGS3 is arguably (IMO) the best looking game on PS2, and yet, MGS2 felt better in many ways due to the better framerate.
Then again, GTA isn't a racing game and it certainly isn't one that's trying to sell itself on being the most realistic one either. Why even bring it up?
-tkf- said:
No, this is where you go wrong, Forza isn't more right, it's a choice made by the developers. Most players want an aggressive AI so they feel like they are racing against other people, while in real motoracing most of the time the driver will be driving against himself trying to improve his lap time. And tight duels do sometimes end up with accidents, but also with penalties from the race officials
It's funny, I'm not sure why PCE even had to bring AI into this. The world already knows that one of the biggest flaws in GT is the AI - yet as you put it, the emphasis was never put on that.
K. Yamauchi (director and creator of the GT series) quite obviously made it to his goal to make the GT series all about the cars. Driving many different cars and loving them all for what they do best. It's not only about the cars though... but also about the tracks which are undoubtedly amazingly re-created in the game. Which brings me back to the Nurburgring, which is undoubtedly one of the most demanding race-tracks outthere. In GT4, they did an amazing job at re-creating the
feel of that track - the bumps, the way the cars react to them (accoarding to the suspension, downforce and other factors that you set), the way the weight of the cars shifts when you go over these bumps and that while cornering. Together with the Logitech DrivingForcePro and you're immersed onto that track in your car like in no other game. This is also where the framerate comes into play: immersion. Precision. Sense of fluid motion.
As I've said, I've seen a handfull of footages of Forza of cars doing the Nurburgring and it seems quite obvious that at least the tracks have not been modeled to that perfection as they are in GT4. If the cars really are that much more realistic - well, there's really no way to find out without playing the game - but even if the cars are more spot on, you still have the track to make it that bit better than GT4. And make no mistake, I'm not talking about visual aspects here - I'm talking about the tracks having all those bumps and information on them that make the cars react accoardingly.
At the end of the day; the car can only have that much of physics calculations attached to it - and seeing how many tuning options GT has, I doubt Forza would have more, simply because all those settings do make a difference when driving. In that, the tracks play a big role too and that's where I have my doubts. If my observations are correct, then I doubt that Forza feels more real. Heck, with the 30 Hz framerate, it's already at a disadvantage. And without the proper support of a wheel, how could it be better? GT4 was designed for the 900° logitech wheel and it shows.
Maybe, just maybe, the Forza devs were more actively concentrating on visual damage physics. Making cars react realisticly on a simple track (without actively modeling bumps) isn't hard once you've got all the formula's - it's about how well you can immerse the player into giving that feeling that you're there - even on a track as demanding as the nurburgring.
