Formula 1 - The Eco Friendly Motorsport!

[Bludd]

Avaya, nice emotional stuff there.

Hahaha

edit:

just re-read Avaya's post

That isn't even really a $100mn fine since it is less potential FOM income lost, so it equates to a possible $25mn only - total slap on the wrist.

The $100 million fine is less than McLaren would have gained from FOM if they had stayed on top of the constructors championship. Now they have lost their points and thus most of their percentage of the FOM income.

 

[dizietsma]

Some good posts on atlas F1 on the matter from both sides :-

http://forums.autosport.com/showthread.php?threadid=96788&perpage=40&display=&pagenumber=1

If you want to make it really spicy and relevant to us change the word McLaren for nvidia and Ferrari for AMD/ATi !



Good job Intel do not sponsor McLaren that's all a I can say!

 

[Kaotik]

If Bridgestone find that they run at a better angle then its beholden to Bridgestone to provide that information to all teams as the sole tyre supplier.

Bridgestone doesn't "find" these things, they only supply the tyres, give the specs on air pressure etc, the rest is up to each team

 

[JardeL]

Hahaha

edit:

just re-read Avaya's post


The $100 million fine is less than McLaren would have gained from FOM if they had stayed on top of the constructors championship. Now they have lost their points and thus most of their percentage of the FOM income.

They will lose any prize money for this season too, so that's a net $170 millon.

according to Eddie Jordan ...

BTW , Bridgestone can be the sole tyre supplier but we all know that they have a special relationship with Scuderia Ferrari and its a long relationship which resulted several world championships...

Mclarens were using Michelin last year and tyre/car adaption for Mclaren is not as easy as Ferrari this year ... So, I think those !stolen! datas are very useful for Mclaren ...

 

[dizietsma]

DR. EVIL
Right.
(pause)
Oh, hell, let's just do what we always
do. Let's hijack some nuclear weapons
and hold the world hostage.
(pause)
Gentlemen, it's come to my attention
that a breakaway Russian Republic
called Kreplachistan will be
transferring a nuclear warhead to
the United Nations in a few days.
Here's the plan. We get the warhead,
and we hold the world ransom...
(dramatic pause)
...FOR ONE MILLION DOLLARS!

There is an uncomfortable pause.

NUMBER TWO
Don't you think we should ask for
more than a million dollars? A
million dollars isn't that much money
these days.

DR. EVIL
All right then...
(dramatic pause)
...FIVE MILLION DOLLARS!

There is another uncomfortable pause.

NUMBER TWO
Virtucon alone makes over nine billion
dollars a year.

DR. EVIL
(pleasantly surprised)
Oh, really?
(slightly irritated)
ONE HUNDRED BILLION DOLLARS.
(pause)
OK, make it happen. Anything else?

 

[V3]

I think the inconsistency of this shows it is about politics, not about justice. If you take the view that what Coughlan (Mclaren) did was without sanction from the team (to the extent that he has been suspended/sacked), but that the whole of Mclaren must bear responsibility for Coughlan's actions, then both Alonso and Hamilton should also bear the punishment by having their points wiped. The fact they have been left untouched is purely the FIA trying to not completely press the self-distruct button, despite the lack of consistency.

The drivers are given immunity for giving up evidence. That's why they didn't get any point deduction. So whatever evidence those drivers gave up are damning.

I reckon spying is bad sportmanship, but its fair game. If you can't keep secrets, its your own fault.

 

[Bludd]

They will lose any prize money for this season too, so that's a net $170 millon.

according to Eddie Jordan ...

Yeah, that's what I meant. The $100 million is a fine on top of the lost income from FOM.

 

[Bouncing Zabaglione Bros.]

The drivers are given immunity for giving up evidence. That's why they didn't get any point deduction. So whatever evidence those drivers gave up are damning.

I reckon spying is bad sportmanship, but its fair game. If you can't keep secrets, its your own fault.

They drivers gave evidence, but no information. All reports said they simply told the committee they didn't know anything about the Coughlan/Stepney theft. Alonso wasn't even at the hearing on Thursday. You don't get immunity for saying "I dunno".

That's not exactly whistle-blowing, and was just a BS PR excuse as to why the drivers didn't lose all their points because that would have screwed up the championship and the money to be made off it.

 

[chavvdarrr]

thats funny.

If McLaren are guilty, they should be punished AND Hamilton/Alonso out of rankings too

IMHO, McLaren & Vodafone proposed to pay 100mln to keep Alonso and Hamilton in fight for the championship. Which likely they'll get - by cheating.
Who wants to bet that in one of next rounds Alonso will have "hardware problems" and won't finish, thus Hamilton will become "champion"

 

[avaya]

I'm not emotional about this just shocked.

The FIA has two choices, full 2 years ban or do nothing.

They chose a joke decision.

How is a team that is running an illegal car, not allowed to compete in the WCC still allowed to race in the championship, interfering with the races of other legal teams still competing in that championship?

How is it fair on other drivers that two drivers who have benefited from the illegal information are still allowed to race?

This is not the worst punishment ever handed out by the FIA. 1984 Tyrell were chucked out of the championship under similar accusations. They were banned for the remaining races and had all points in both championships removed and all results deleted for that season. The $100mn less FOM-I fine is effectively nothing to McLaren + Mercedes, anyone who claims otherwise is delusional.

The reason why Ferrari chose to go after McLaren with such tenacity as described by Sir Frank Williams, is because Dennis who has no sporting integrity at all, had the gall to initiate a peace pact with Jean Todt in March while fully aware that he had a mole within the Ferrari organisation. That lit the blue touch paper under Ferrari’s collective arses.

Upon the revelation that McLaren then decided to become the sporting authority and play whistleblower with Ferrari designs you can imagine the indignation.

This is why Ferrari’s civil action will not stop.

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

''How is it fair on other drivers that two drivers who have benefited from the illegal information are still allowed to race?''

Easy, money. Like I said, hamilton has a big chance of being a rookie WC, and he's the first black driver. There is so much money involved with that Bernie would never allow Mclaren to be banned.

 

[avaya]

The evidence is out.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/62348

If you are a McLaren apologist after that, you are a disgrace.

 

[RobertR1]

Now that the evidence is out, how in hell is Alonso able to keep this drivers standings!?

 

[DuckThor Evil]

DR. EVIL

I don't like that insulent tone number two and neither does Mr. Bigglesworth...

 

[Dave Baumann]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/62376

Ron Dennis was the tippee.

[Edit] LOL. It was on the morning of the Hungarian GP that he became aware. I wonder if that was in a rather heated conversation with Alonso following the prior day's antics and his subsequent penalty...

 

[Bludd]

Oh man, those emails are pretty damning.

 

[Zaphod]

So how much would you get for winning the constructors championship these days? Since McLaren is to pay $100 million sans what they'd get for placing in the constructors championship had they not been excluded, my guess is that the winner is getting just about $100 million.

 

[Dave Baumann]

Those figures are the best kept secrets, but people are suggesting that the payment may be down to about $30 in the end.

However, there are other issues - having no points means they will have to pay for all their travel next year. They will also be down the other end of the pits, which may mean they have less motorhome space (meaning the "Brand Center" may not fit where they will be positioned and they'll need another motorhome - presumably the previous "Communications Center" would also be too big).

Anyway, there's still more fallout to come. Evidently its actually Ron Dennis and Alonso that haven't spoken since Hungry. There's also supposedly a case McLaren want to go after Renault for with one of their departing engineers taking 3 disks worth info with him and it apparently being incorported into this years Renault.

 

[Bouncing Zabaglione Bros.]

Anyway, there's still more fallout to come. Evidently its actually Ron Dennis and Alonso that haven't spoken since Hungry. There's also supposedly a case McLaren want to go after Renault for with one of their departing engineers taking 3 disks worth info with him and it apparently being incorported into this years Renault.

That's the thing though, the FIA criticised Mclaren because Coughlan may have been influenced in some kind of undefined way by the information in his head, but isn't that the same for any person who moves from one team to another?

And why does the FIA allow all the teams to spy on each other and have spotters checking out each others cars? Surely the whole point of that is to try and glean information on each other's cars and then incorporate those innovations that work in their own teams?

There's a whole lot of really vague and subjective things in the full statement. Lot's of "it seems likely", "we don't accept" etc. All kinds of circumstantial stuff that would not meet the requirements for evidence in a court of law (a standard which the FIA don't have to meet anyway). Yet the Mclaren offices and factory were not searched in the same way as Coughlan's house was, even though that would prove if the final destination of that data was Mclaren.

However, given that the FIA have found Mclaren guilty of building and running a car influenced in some undefined way from the data stolen by Stepney to the extent the team has been excluded from the championship and fined massively, how on earth can they still allow Alonso and Hamilton to keep their points and continue to race in the very same car?

 

[Dave Baumann]

And why does the FIA allow all the teams to spy on each other and have spotters checking out each others cars? Surely the whole point of that is to try and glean information on each other's cars and then incorporate those innovations that work in their own teams?

Why did the FIA allow Benetton to get away with tampering with fuel rigs, despite being found guilty of it? Why did the FIA not react to Toyota when two employee's are currently being convicted of stealing, and implementing, data?