Formula 1 - The Eco Friendly Motorsport!

[tongue_of_colicab]

Indeed it wasnt hamiltons fault. Besides it wouldnt have matterd as the macca's just are insanly fast (they prolly took a look at the Ferrari design book under the chapter how do I make a reliable fast low downforce car).

 

[DJ12]

Getting back to this spying business, am I the only one that finds it hard to believe that this wasn't an exchange of data (you show me yours and I'll show you mine type of deal)?

I mean, when the info was supposedly handed over McLaren were by far the best car and Ferrari were nowhere.

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

Why would either mclaren or Ferrari show each others data? thats stupid. Especially if you consider that this is the first season in quite some team mclaren actually has a really good car.

At the beginning of the season Ferrari was dominating (remember melbourne?) and around the whole spy thing mclaren was getting stronger and stronger. If they really spied or not, I dont know but its a fact the mclaren designer had the ''How to build a Ferrari'' book, thats what the motor council also said, mclaren has been found guilty of posession of Ferrari data however they couldnt prove it helped the mclaren car. However I find it very unbelieveble that if a higher up mclaren designer has a 780page book on the team that had a fast and reliable car for almost a decade he wouldnt take a look in it and what he read I think is almost certain influanced his work in some way or another. If it really influanced the car that much, I dont know.

 

[DuckThor Evil]

am I the only one that finds it hard to believe that this wasn't an exchange of data (you show me yours and I'll show you mine type of deal)?

Yeah you probably are... Really there isn't anything to back up that crazy stuff. Are you assuming that they made some sort of deal that if one gets caught they can't tell about the other...
Out of the conspiracy theories I have heard, this ranks about equal to Elvis still lives.

 

[_xxx_]

AFAIK it was not about the car but how they temper/prepare the tires for the race.

 

[DJ12]

Yeah you probably are... Really there isn't anything to back up that crazy stuff. Are you assuming that they made some sort of deal that if one gets caught they can't tell about the other...
Out of the conspiracy theories I have heard, this ranks about equal to Elvis still lives.

I like my conspiracy theories

Still, McLaren were well on top when they supposedly received the documents, Ferrari's domination lasted only lasted a single race.

 

[Bludd]

Thursday could make or break this championship. Will McLaren continue to work hard for Alonso and Hamilton if they lose all championship points gained thus far? FIA did promise the drivers immunity (meaning, most likely, they retain their driver championship points even if McLaren is penalised). Will the drivers change teams? This mostly applies to Alonso, I don't think Hamilton will leave since he is still a rookie, even if he has performed incredibly well this season and even if he's leading the drivers championship.

Ughhhhhhhh.....

 

[Bouncing Zabaglione Bros.]

Thursday could make or break this championship. Will McLaren continue to work hard for Alonso and Hamilton if they lose all championship points gained thus far? FIA did promise the drivers immunity (meaning, most likely, they retain their driver championship points even if McLaren is penalised). Will the drivers change teams? This mostly applies to Alonso, I don't think Hamilton will leave since he is still a rookie, even if he has performed incredibly well this season and even if he's leading the drivers championship.

Ughhhhhhhh.....

Problem is if Mclaren are still racing and winning, the championship would be a sham if they were coming first but not getting any points. Then you'd have an official winner and champion who got beaten by another team who should have won. It would be like pressing the self destruct button for F1.

Yet I don't see that Mclaren with an ongoing business could simply not race for a year.

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

Thursday could make or break this championship. Will McLaren continue to work hard for Alonso and Hamilton if they lose all championship points gained thus far? FIA did promise the drivers immunity (meaning, most likely, they retain their driver championship points even if McLaren is penalised). Will the drivers change teams? This mostly applies to Alonso, I don't think Hamilton will leave since he is still a rookie, even if he has performed incredibly well this season and even if he's leading the drivers championship.

Ughhhhhhhh.....

Well Alonso seems like he wants to leave no matter what. Mclaren is a team that really requires a driver that can adjust himself to the ''robot'' like person Ron Dennis wants his drivers to be. Thats why Kimi and Montoya never were happy at mclaren and alonso isnt either. They want to do their own thing more.

Hamilton has been Dennis' pet project for 12 years, he wont leave. That would be stupid to btw, bitting the hand that fed you for over a decade. He knows mclaren will give him all the support he want and wont kick him out easily even if he screws up a few times.

I dont think Mclaren will get (alot) punishment. Its been a very exiting season, atleast alot better than the last few years. You got a Rookie that is very likely to become WC and the fact that he's black also did alot for the marketing of the sport. There is so much money involved with Hamilton and what he can do for the sport that I dont think Bernie will allow anything that could screw up all that money. I think in the worst case they will get their points taken away from the constructors championsship but no tv watcher cares about that, they care about the driver. The CC is pretty much only for the engineers and for deviding the money gained from tv rights.

 

[Bludd]

I think in the worst case they will get their points taken away from the constructors championsship but no tv watcher cares about that, they care about the driver.

Yeah, but my point was that this might make McLaren to stop caring about this years championship and focus 100% on next years car. They may stop supporting their drivers as much as the drivers need them to because they can't win the constructors championship.

At least, that is what I am concerned about.

 

[Dave Baumann]

(they prolly took a look at the Ferrari design book under the chapter how do I make a reliable fast low downforce car).

Judging by Sunday's performances, you wouldn't have wanted that from Ferrari.

 

[Bouncing Zabaglione Bros.]

Yeah, but my point was that this might make McLaren to stop caring about this years championship and focus 100% on next years car. They may stop supporting their drivers as much as the drivers need them to because they can't win the constructors championship.

At least, that is what I am concerned about.

If Mclaren can't win the constructer's, they'll still try to win the driver's championship just to spite everyone. Two fingers up to everyone and all that.

 

[Bludd]

Judging by Sunday's performances, you wouldn't have wanted that from Ferrari.

Yeah, Hamilton passing Räikkonen after losing 2nd due to the pit stop was a beautiful moment of audacity, balls and just virtue of being faster. Wonderful stuff!

If Maclaren can't win the constructer's, they'll still try to win the driver's championship just to spite everyone. Two fingers up to everyone and all that.

One would hope so.

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

Not hope so, I know so. No supporting your drivers is the dumbest thing to do. You can focus on next year but you'll need those same drivers to drive your car that year to right? Besides they got all kinds of plans for when and how much time to spend on the current and next car. They wont suddenly change that if they dont get CC points anymore.

 

[Dave Baumann]

McLaren verdit: 2007 constructors points gone, $100m fine and they have to "submit their 2008 car for scrutineering before racing". Drivers points stand.

 

[Bludd]

Holy shit.

 

[Kaotik]

F#cking ridicilous, FIA again proved they have no balls at all, the drivers get to keep their points, driven with (partly) stolen car, and keep on driving with the said (partly) stolen car to keep more points

 

[Bludd]

FIA sent letters to all three McLaren drivers saying that they would be granted immunity if they came forward with any and all correspondence regarding Ferrari.

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

Which I doubt they did (given as alonso didnt even bother coming to Paris). But this is what I expected and when you think about it it makes perfect sense. You've got the first interresting WC since years and a worlds first black F1 driver is leading in his rookie year. Banning them from the WC would be financial suicide and we all know how much Bernie loves his money. If its fair? does it really matter? F1 (and other sports for that matter) have never been fair and in a sport like this you can expect teams trying to find out what others are doing (I honestly dont believe this is the first time spying happens, I think teams try it all the time one way or another) because its such a competative sport and team are also always pushing (beyond) the rules. There are a fair number of cases that you could ban a team/driver but which didnt happen. Benneton with its illigal TC to name one. Personally I think this punishment is enough, exluding drivers would be just to much and im saying that as a Ferrari fan.

From a Ferrari pov this might not even be that bad. Becoming WC is better ofcourse, but they will get alot of negative press because alot of people out there find that Ferrari and FIA are to much related with each other (Hench the FIA = Ferrari International Assistance) but this way the 2007 season will always be know as the season the rookie mclaren driver won the WC but did it in a car build with (possibly) stolen data from Ferrari. Its kinda like the WC soccer in '74, Germany won but the whole world knew The Netherlands was by far the best team

 

[Bludd]

The higher constructor championship placement you get, the more money you get from Formula One Management at the end of the season. It is a percentage from the advertising income etc.

I agree with you, tongue_of_colicab. Hamilton, being the first black driver, and one of the most successful rookie (no rookie has ever had as many podium finishes in a row as Hamilton). He is one of the reasons this year has been one of the better seasons in recent memory. If he wins the drivers championship, he will be the most successful rookie ever and it will be, albeit tarred by this spy scandal, one of my favourite seasons ever.

Does McLaren have any possibility of appeal?