Direct Feed Heavenly Sword Screens (E3 build).
- Thread starter Bad_Boy
- Start date
Yeah... seconded again, the toning down of the bloom/blur.
I got confused until I see the DOA4 reference. I actually wanted *more* cloth effects, as in the weapons can do damage to the clothings (until a minimum standard, of course). I never liked in-your-face bikini armor, but cloth effects should be good.
I got confused until I see the DOA4 reference. I actually wanted *more* cloth effects, as in the weapons can do damage to the clothings (until a minimum standard, of course). I never liked in-your-face bikini armor, but cloth effects should be good.
inefficient
Veteran
There was a rumor that they added blood to the game since the e3 06 build. Can one of the devs confirm?
I just watched the video Titanio posted and it looks amazing. But I saw no blood effects at all just a lot of white flashes. Maybe they are shooting for a T rating instead of M.
I just watched the video Titanio posted and it looks amazing. But I saw no blood effects at all just a lot of white flashes. Maybe they are shooting for a T rating instead of M.
Isnt the greater image just simply a gathering of all the minor details?
There are many things that bother me about visuals, this is why I'm a major image quality whore. That's why I hate my Nvidia card, it looks horrible because of a number of "minor" issues.
The hair is just down right annoying. The blade trails are down right annoying. The textures look flat, are low resolution looking, etc.
The first two I'll chalk up to my likes and dislikes of artistic styling, as that's what they are. But the textures are not great looking and the enemy models all look the same, those are things I very much dislike.
ihamoitc2005
Veteran
Great
Thank you for this link my friend, these pictures are great! Lighting and shadows are amazing with self shadow. This feature is rare for next gen games, no? Very amazing. Soon I will like to see outdoor levels. Also, animation is great. Only thing I wonder is what is polygons for enemy characters. If I guess I think maybe 1000-5000 (crazy guess?), I dont know, but not so much like VF5. Maybe this is because of outdoor scene with large number for characters. But characters still have great look because of lighting, shadow, good bump map, etc and also very nice movements. Also I think AF is not shown.
Thank you for this link my friend, these pictures are great! Lighting and shadows are amazing with self shadow. This feature is rare for next gen games, no? Very amazing. Soon I will like to see outdoor levels. Also, animation is great. Only thing I wonder is what is polygons for enemy characters. If I guess I think maybe 1000-5000 (crazy guess?), I dont know, but not so much like VF5. Maybe this is because of outdoor scene with large number for characters. But characters still have great look because of lighting, shadow, good bump map, etc and also very nice movements. Also I think AF is not shown.
When I view screens I attempt to do so in the context of the action taking place. The developer is putting together an experience that is really only meant to be experienced in one way and that's by playing it. I think NT is doing a bang up job in that regard. And I can see it partially thru these screens and I can see that it is good.
*Now I feel particulary silly trying to get into their head on this, because "they" are here, but bear with me. I appologize for that, Ninja Guys, but I'm really just want to illustrate my "method" here.
They are puting the game together - the imagery, the rythm, the animation and technology, the mechanics - and to do it in a holistic way they've got to put themselves in the player's shoes. They have some ideas about what emotion (it's art, thanks) they want to evoke in the player and getting the appropriate emotion is a craft.
... From a visual standpoint- "if I want to feel potentially unstoppable but precise and expressive, if I want to feel like a weapon; where are my eyes?" The eyes should be on the engagement. Nariko and her ass kicking. She: the weapon. Me: the weapon. I'm dispatching deadly thugs like the're flying out of a tenis ball launcher. I'm not missing a beat. I'm ferocious. Watch enter the Dragon? Remember the cave scene? Half those guys he whoops don't get a second of screen time. (And one is Jackie Chan!) They don't matter. Just like rapid fire tennis balls. It's all eyes on Bruce. Here; it's all Nariko. The hair, the skin, the face, the glow (bloom), camerawork, etc. Not the floor, the walls the goons circling around waiting to get served.
They've (NT) got a certain amount of resources and they have to smartly allocate them. Not just cycles and ram, but man hours and talent. Nothing is unlimited. When I look in the backround and see the wall texture that didn't need to be repeated so much or the soldiers who could have alot more polys I don't see flaws. I see a good interactive presentation. The hair is a perfect example. In the static shot it looks like there could be alot more hair segments. Even in the movie, you can sit and dwell on the hair and see the artifact of it's implimentation. But imagine the controller in your hand and play it. That hair works because your eye is traind on the space you want to control, which revolves around Nariko, who is persistantly a fluid, twisting ball of flowing cloth, weightless hair, soft skin and flashing metal.
She doesn't have any more triangles because she has enough triangles to express. I have full confidence that NT put the would-be superflous triangle to effective use somewhere else in the scene. If that triangle should have gone into making a soldier's hat rounder, then NT would have, carefully and lovingly, placed it there.
In total, here... I'm saying that I absolutly agree with what you are saying about the screens. It's true. But I look at the screen and to me the shit is nearly flawless because the art is not in the screen it's in the interaction. "See it in motion" is becoming a cliche already but that's what people are trying to say.
Hurray for HS' flawed screenies. Somebody at NT has got their eyes on the prize and it's not a still screen. It's a savage, meat-grinder bitch who I get not just look at, but become.
If it were a feast of bad details that made the game in total look bad I would have agreed with you. When I said minor I ment of minor importance or not important at all like the hair.
A bueatiful forest will remain beautiful even if there are a few dead trees. And no forest is "perfect" in that aspect.
The hair arent bad graphics, thats bad hardressing for some. I am not amazed by the hair either. But why should we expect uper perfection and extreme realism when we know we are controlling these graphics in realtime on a console not a CGI producing workstation?
The textures looked a lot better in the videos than in these shots.
I will only agree about the blade trails.
But annoying isnt the right word. Just nothing remarkable (refering to those specific point only)
Besides when the 2005 fotage was shown none of these were an issue at all. Everyone wanted to see how faithful the game would be to that video when it nears completion because it looked good as it were.
Besides visually there is no perfect game anyways. Everyone can find minor details in almost any game if not all and be annoyied even if that game belongs to the category of some of the best looking games.
I almost agree with the first paragraph.
But about about the games you listed?
RE5 which is probably the most impressive of the bunch was a target render and Capcom went as far to describe the extend of the detail they added on the CGI footage that may not make it ot the final product. No opinion on this since we have seen no gameplay footage.
UT2K ,Resistance and Assassins Creed also have many visual flaws and I am around just as impressed with these as I am with Heavenly Sword.
If you check every thread there will always be people being annoyied with the visual quality of any game and spot them for others to see. Whether it's Gears of War, Resistence, GT, Warhawk, Motorstorm, MGS4, F.E.A.R , Dead rising, Doom, Half life, Lost Planet or whatever
Until consoles are powerful enough to present perfect visuals of a supercomputer without any need of some visual sacrifices to achieve some other visual goodies I see no point in discussing these details.
We get enough impressive games already, but expecting perfection that so far has been only achievable in scripted, heavily corrected, with virtually no constrains to create quality CGI is not something I d call rational.
We sound like spoiled people. Even I fall to the trap and do the same sometimes
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guys, stop picking on the blade trails. that's an extremely transient and volatile topping fx. so stop looking at trails in screenshots and see how they look in the videos. if you don't like them in there then fine, but judging about the quality of weapon trails from screenshots is rather useless. i for one, have not seen a perfect blade trail effect *in a screenshot* to date. ever. and i've seen many of those in my favourite game genres. heh, i remember the first time i saw good screenshots of soulcalibur on the dc - man, did those trails look iffy when still! but guess what, that never occured to me in the game, and i have spent, well, time with it.
bottomline being, treat weapon trails like you would particle explosions or bullet trails - see their dynamics before you pass judgement on them.
bottomline being, treat weapon trails like you would particle explosions or bullet trails - see their dynamics before you pass judgement on them.
Sorry if I miss your "holy" representation of Heavenly Swords graphics. Your comments make me feel that I am backed up now in saying a lot of people here are jaded about the graphics for other reasons than that they look good.
The fact remains, at least to me, is that when I play a game for beyond five minutes that I start to see the little details that comprise the image. Things such as everything I kill looking the same, a very flat floor and wall, hair that is just giant blobs thrown together, etc.
All these issues are compounded by 10x because I've yet to see a real screenshot outside of the arena.
The hair animates wonderfully in motion. You may not like how it looks, it's quite stylised, but that's a matter of taste.
The floor is anything but flat, they're using parallax mapping on the floor to bring relief to its features, and it's quite obvious in videos. I'm not sure what about the walls would require similar mapping (there's no point in making bumpy walls for the sake of it!).
The enemies don't "all look the same" - sure, there is model repetiton, but there's at least 3 different types of enemy in the E3 demo. It's understandable when you consider that the enemy numbers scale into the hundreds at least. Maybe they could do more in terms of minor variation per enemy (a developer may be able to comment better on that), but you're going to have repetition of base models given the numbers they're ultimately talking about. Besides, when was the last time you played a game featuring a significant number of enemies where each and every enemy was hand-crafted and completely unique? Your complaint may be valid when considering what might be ideally possible one day, but compared to its peers, I don't see it as holding much weight.
inefficient
Veteran
Just curious. What was the last game you were able to play beyond five minutes without these ill feelings. What is your point of reference?
Can you PLEASE show me a decent shot of these thousands of enemies? There was one in here that hinted at it, but it did not look like a screenshot, nor was it very high in quality. I would GLADLY retake all of my ill comments in regard to model repetition if I was shown such a screenshot. What I've seen though is very unimpressive when it comes to the scale and the fact that that arena is all I've seen that looks like a screenshot.
Sadly, none.
I've certainly played games much longer than that, and play a game on a regular basis that is the worst offender on minor details gone terrible (BF2), but I've yet to find a game that didnt have certain issues that make me cringe.
Well, as long as NT is reading this thread, they will be able to sieve through the feedback and decide what to do with them (if they still have time !).
The perfect console game is not here yet. Hopefully some one will get there some day. Until then, we will always have people highlighting flaws in any game, including Heavenly Sword and Gears of Wars.
Personally, I hope developers can start to show us more than just pretty pictures. Best is if they can bring out emotions in the gamer (like MGS, Ico).
The perfect console game is not here yet. Hopefully some one will get there some day. Until then, we will always have people highlighting flaws in any game, including Heavenly Sword and Gears of Wars.
Personally, I hope developers can start to show us more than just pretty pictures. Best is if they can bring out emotions in the gamer (like MGS, Ico).
Then you need to stop being so nitpicky! I've played plenty of games with good and bad graphics, and I've noticed all sorts of faults in the good lookers, but that doesn't stop me appreciating them for looking great. CON on PS2 has a number of faults on occassion, but it still looks fantastic every time I see it. It sounds to me like you're analyzing the art to death, just as I explained to JigenD. You can probably take any great work of art and find fault with it. And you can find fault with movies, and books. And people. It's not a good habit to constantly focus on imperfections and letting them get in the way of seeing all the good bits.
Since the 05 trailer there has been no such media. But that's what the developers are working on.
Even if you want to take the 06 demo as is, can you think of a game that offers 30 or so pre-crafted enemies in such a small space with no model repetition?
I'm thinking you're looking for anything and everything to nitpick by comparing the game to an imaginary ideal (which will make any effort look inadequate). Sorry, but nothing is going to hold up to that, and it's patently unfair to hold this game against that. Not only is it unfair on this game, but also on yourself - you would never be satisfied, and forever jaded.
DuckThor Evil
Legend
I don't know to me the floor just doesn't look nearly as impressive as for example the floor in Kameo castle stages...
I wish scenes like that would have been included in the footage that has been shown, if that infact is true then the models look good. It's all about the scale...
My point is simply that the floor isn't 'flat', nothing more. I mean it's flat in the way you'd expect an arena floor to be, but it is mapped so the pattern in the floor appears to be carved out.