did Ken let slip that PS3 will have EE+GS in it?

[Shifty Geezer]

very much agreed london-boy.

I'm looking forward to playing PS2 AC4, AC5, ACZ in 720p with added AA.

I think FFX would benefit greatly from some form of AA and texture filtering. If Sony pull this off effectively I'll be very impressed. It'd also be nice if they could speed up some games. Starwars Battlefronts has a poor framerate. If such games could be got up to speed it'd give them a new lease of life in my eyes.

 

[speng]

I'm starting to get really aggravated by any and all announcements being accompanied with claims of being marketting spin and 'BS' and such. It's a growing trend in this forum that contributes nothing to intelligent discussion. If a company works hard to produce a product or service and outlines their hopes in that area, someone always comes along to decry them. .

[/rant]

You can get off your rant.

There are two reasons why Ken Kuturagi made those statements in that exact manner. To show that they are developing a quality product and to give the impression that what they are doing costs a lot and consumer may have to pay for it, or in the end feel like they got a bargain.

He could have simply said, we'll have complete backwards compatiblity to all software that followed the TRC and it was difficult to obtain, but we did it as we value our previous customers. "Expensive" is added in there for a desired effect.

How expensive and what amount quantifies as expensive is entirely up to Sony. So, that's how I see it.

Speng.

 

[ROG27]

I'm starting to get really aggravated by any and all announcements being accompanied with claims of being marketting spin and 'BS' and such. It's a growing trend in this forum that contributes nothing to intelligent discussion. If a company works hard to produce a product or service and outlines their hopes in that area, someone always comes along to decry them. If a deadline or somesuch is missed, it's instantly proof that a company never intended to meet that deadline in the first place and was knowingly lying from the outset. According to some people round these parts you'd think Sony aren't even making a console, PS3 is vapourware, and Sony are just pretending they're making a console to upset MS's plans!

Companies do and will talk about their products. No-one's going to spend millions/billions on developing things only to release them announced without telling people how good they are.

'Hey Kutaragi, let's add BC for PS1 and PS2 games that even improves over the original experience.'
'Good idea, but don't tell anyone because they'll think we only put it in as a marketting ploy.'

The fact that features are being added because the company believes they add to the product's value and will attract customers is a no brainer. The fact that these benefits and features will be marketted as such is a no brainer. It would please me greatly if instead of people pointing out the obvious that features are being marketted, and instead of assuming any deadline missed or target failed is a bald-faced fib, they would just talk about what's known, the actual features, and what they do or don't do.

[/rant]

Thank F'ing gawd someone finally had the balls to say that! I applaud you Shifty. The rampant cynacism which runs in this forum and blankets every thread now-a-days is downright aggrevating and childish. And this is one of the best places on the internet to avoid it! The attitude in this industry is just disheartening to say the least. I only have one word to say: JADED.

 

[superguy]

I believe one of Ken's PS event slides said "Final Cell/RSX" for dev kits sent out May 14.

The final final kit in June would just be adding Blu-Ray and such then.

 

[superguy]

http://www.watch.impress.co.jp/game/docs/20060315/psm12.jpg

According to that Final RSX Final Cell in April. Prototype controller and proto Blu Ray.

If I'm reading right..

Final controller+Blu-Ray in may.

Software SDK was a bit behind that..that's June..but to me the hardware is more important..

 

[mckmas8808]

I'm starting to get really aggravated by any and all announcements being accompanied with claims of being marketting spin and 'BS' and such. It's a growing trend in this forum that contributes nothing to intelligent discussion. [/rant]

Me and you agree with this. I truely hope we can get AA with our PS2 games. MGS3:Sub will look get with added AA.

 

[Mmmkay]

http://www.watch.impress.co.jp/game/docs/20060315/psm12.jpg

According to that Final RSX Final Cell in April. Prototype controller and proto Blu Ray.

If I'm reading right..

Final controller+Blu-Ray in may.

Software SDK was a bit behind that..that's June..but to me the hardware is more important..

I would think the details of the previous dev kit contents on that schedule would also be important. Developers have had CELL in its various iterations since ~Spring 2005, and RSX shares many design features with G70 so is unlikely to be too unfamiliar. Really it's the Flex IO component which is the key ingredient that has eluded devs thus far. Which is why I raised an eyebrow when they talked of Warhawk in the GDC presentation having a lot of CELL<->RSX interactivity, implying that at least those developers had some solid use out of it.

 

[superguy]

Sony shouldn't put the EE+GS in because it's expensive.

And who really cares about backwards compatibility. BC has always been one of the biggest farces in my opinion. I just dont think most people, or at least me, care. If you've got the old game, then you also have the old system. Novel concept, that.

And this applying a new coat of paint (720P upscaling, etc) doesn't help those now-ugly old games in my opinion. It just makes them blurry from what Xbox BC screens I've seen. I thin some people even prefer the look of the originals.

I've come around a little bit to where I now agree BC is a nice thing to have..but still hardly necessary.

Do like Microsoft and put it in slowly.

Although, I wonder how the cost of paying an ongoing BC team compares to the cost of putting the old hardware in? It might be less but not insignificant, if I had to guess.

If it's..30 guys (no idea) at 100K each..that's what, 3 mil per year. Still small, probably a very small price, even X360 will easily sell more than 3mil consoles per year, making it <$1 per console to pay the BC team.

 

[Megadrive1988]

You can get off your rant.

There are two reasons why Ken Kuturagi made those statements in that exact manner. To show that they are developing a quality product and to give the impression that what they are doing costs a lot and consumer may have to pay for it, or in the end feel like they got a bargain.

He could have simply said, we'll have complete backwards compatiblity to all software that followed the TRC and it was difficult to obtain, but we did it as we value our previous customers. "Expensive" is added in there for a desired effect.

How expensive and what amount quantifies as expensive is entirely up to Sony. So, that's how I see it.

Speng.

I would feel a lot better about PS3 and spending $500 on it, *if* it came with a hard drive and if the GPU was connected to graphics memory with a 256-Bit bus, which would save developers A LOT of headaches most likely, and potentially allow for more 60fps games.

just my opinion....

 

[superguy]

I would think the details of the previous dev kit contents on that schedule would also be important. Developers have had CELL in its various iterations since ~Spring 2005, and RSX shares many design features with G70 so is unlikely to be too unfamiliar. Really it's the Flex IO component which is the key ingredient that has eluded devs thus far. Which is why I raised an eyebrow when they talked of Warhawk in the GDC presentation having a lot of CELL<->RSX interactivity, implying that at least those developers had some solid use out of it.

Didn't final-final X360 kits not go out until like, September?

So, if that's right, I guess PS3 devs get a lot more time with the final.

Say everything's finalized in June (including the SDK as the other slide says)..

That gives them 4-5 months.

And if you consider April-May as close to final, 5-6 months.

 

[one]

And who really cares about backwards compatibility. BC has always been one of the biggest farces in my opinion. I just dont think most people, or at least me, care. If you've got the old game, then you also have the old system. Novel concept, that.

It's there not to kill the revenue from PS2 HW/SW product lines. Nintendo realized that, so they offer BC this time on Rev and Zelda. I'm still amazed at the fact that MS was not too keen at maintaining BC (well not really they paid NVIDIA for BC in 360 after all) since one of the biggest reasons of the success of MS Windows was the good backward compatibility with their older OSs that supports millions of legacy apps.

 

[mckmas8808]

Didn't final-final X360 kits not go out until like, September?

So, if that's right, I guess PS3 devs get a lot more time with the final.

Say everything's finalized in June (including the SDK as the other slide says)..

That gives them 4-5 months.

And if you consider April-May as close to final, 5-6 months.

Yes this statement is correct. Hopefully at TGS we will see some really great stuff.

 

[Sis]

It's there not to kill the revenue from PS2 HW/SW product lines. Nintendo realized that, so they offer BC this time on Rev and Zelda. I'm still amazed at the fact that MS was not too keen at maintaining BC (well not really they paid NVIDIA for BC in 360 after all) since one of the biggest reasons of the success of MS Windows was the good backward compatibility with their older OSs that supports millions of legacy apps.

I agree, but I don't know that MS was in the same position as, say Sony is or even the Windows.

I would put forth this argument with no basis to back it up other than my own reasoning: 100% emulation is only possible if a) it's done mostly in hardware or b) differences in machines are slight or c) there is a significant gap in time between when the software was released the machine attempting to emulate it. Given this reasoning, I don't see how Sony can promise 100% BC without some hardware support. And I don't believe MS was in a good position to offer similar support in the Xbox 360.

 

[Cobra101]

Sony shouldn't put the EE+GS in because it's expensive.

And who really cares about backwards compatibility. BC has always been one of the biggest farces in my opinion. I just dont think most people, or at least me, care. If you've got the old game, then you also have the old system. Novel concept, that.

And this applying a new coat of paint (720P upscaling, etc) doesn't help those now-ugly old games in my opinion. It just makes them blurry from what Xbox BC screens I've seen. I thin some people even prefer the look of the originals.

I've come around a little bit to where I now agree BC is a nice thing to have..but still hardly necessary.

Do like Microsoft and put it in slowly.

Although, I wonder how the cost of paying an ongoing BC team compares to the cost of putting the old hardware in? It might be less but not insignificant, if I had to guess.

If it's..30 guys (no idea) at 100K each..that's what, 3 mil per year. Still small, probably a very small price, even X360 will easily sell more than 3mil consoles per year, making it <$1 per console to pay the BC team.

BC wasn't a farce until MS dropped the ball with the 360.