My understanding of the why not for SMT was that if code was very "branchy" (can you tell it's been 20 years since I did this stuff) the ratio between time spent doing work versus time spent waiting for memory fetches shifted to where the cost of switching between threads cost more time than the wasted time cost of a stalled thread alone. Typical examples of this were stuff like web serving or other INT heavy tasks, I'm not used to thinking of games as being in that mold or is it just that I took a simple example and span it out too far in my mind?
Current Generation Hardware Speculation with a Technical Spin [post GDC 2020] [XBSX, PS5]
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My understanding of the why not for SMT was that if code was very "branchy" (can you tell it's been 20 years since I did this stuff) the ratio between time spent doing work versus time spent waiting for memory fetches shifted to where the cost of switching between threads cost more time than the wasted time cost of a stalled thread alone. Typical examples of this were stuff like web serving or other INT heavy tasks, I'm not used to thinking of games as being in that mold or is it just that I took a simple example and span it out too far in my mind?
Yes. It's a bit different because the developers can select exactly what static clocks and features they want. They can opt for SMT @ 3.6 GHz or non-SMT @ 3.8 GHz. So it only changes on a game by game basis, but once the game is loaded its very static behavior. As you said, it's a "set and forget" approach.
Also, yes, Series S has the exact same CPU modes and clocks as the Series X according to insider rumors. It's only the GPU, Memory, and Bandwidth that scaled because of target resolution scaling.
Also, yes, Series S has the exact same CPU modes and clocks as the Series X according to insider rumors. It's only the GPU, Memory, and Bandwidth that scaled because of target resolution scaling.
Don't forget the dramatically reduced ram size. The real new next gen baseline.
If you're doing the quarter of the GPU work(1080p vs 4k), then 1/3 less RAM(10gb vs 16b) for GPU tasks then it's no big deal.They just need to keep the same amount RAM for CPU & OS tasks.
Tommy McClain
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Yes, I want all this. And I want it more than London-boy wants a price. I don't know why he wants a price because like me, he's knows he's buying it day one regardless.You want all the secret methodology behind the whole tech, how they ran their tests during years, the whole relationships between power, clocks and activities. And the power margins because of silicon lottery and local climate. Why didn't you simply ask ? I'll contact Cerny immediately using PSN PM.
Yes, looks fine to me. Obviously not all data in RAM is 4K GPU assets but a fair chunk is. I am more interested in the bus bandwidth than the RAM. That will be more telling. I am still expecting, given the 1080/1440p target, that Series S will be an abundance of bandwidth compared to both Series X and PS5.
I'd be interested to know how the Xbox OS CPU reservation is managed in SMT and non-SMT modes. I don't see a problem, it's just I think about sad things like this!
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If the price for the new consoles hit 899 would you really be in line for day 1?
I still think price matters, even if you're invested. There is a number for everyone that will make you think twice on when to get it.
And I want it more than London-boy wants a price. I don't know why he wants a price because like me, he's knows he's buying it day one regardless.
It's the difference between buying 2 on day one or buying 1 on day one and a second many months later.
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Without being an arse about it, yes. This is not a lot of money to me. Not only would I be willing to pay 899 to transfer overnight to a virtually loadless magic box of gaming euphoria, I'm also planning on dropping a solid amount of cash on a 4 to 6Tb SSD just to hang off the USB C port for my PS4 games - assuming the SDD performance is significantly better than a fast HDD. Time has more value to me than the type of prices we're talking about.
Aww you do follow!
Yes, I'm buying two of the f**king things. Which is still not really the issue.
I just WANT TO KNOW.
EVERYTHING.
Only if you think the Xbox series X will need 6GB in order to increase the resolution of the different buffers. I think 6GB just to increase resolution is way too much. Another way to look at it: On PS4 / XB1 games are made with 5GB. On next gen they will be made with 7.5 GB then they will up the resolution for PS5 and Xbox series X.
On current gen some games run at 900p on XB1 and native 4K on XBX (with better textures). XBX has 4GB more than XB1.
According to MS, Lochkart games will run at 1440p while Xbox Series X will run at 4K, but now those games will need as much as 6GB for the increased res from 1440p to 4K ? That's bullshit.
I was committed to a 3080TI at the time but looking at $2K+ CAD is just too out of range and I need to dial back looking at the 3070 or something now. Consoles are meant to be mainstream devices, so I don't think it should get that high but there are going to be more price minded people out there than us. If nvidia pricing is way out there, 1 of each console is still going to be cheaper than a single 3xxx card.Without being an arse about it, yes. This is not a lot of money to me. Not only would I be willing to pay 899 to transfer overnight to a virtually loadless magic box of gaming euphoria, I'm also planning on dropping a solid amount of cash on a 4 to 6Tb SSD just to hang off the USB C port for my PS4 games - assuming the SDD performance is significantly better than a fast HDD. Time has more value to me than the type of prices we're talking about.
The most basic things: does it do what we want it to do, does it fit where I want it to go, and can I afford it. All this run of the mill tech talk is really a fun distraction, but this is what next gen will come down to for a majority of players just looking to play more games. The first has been somewhat answered sufficiently, the last two people are still waiting.
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I assumed you've really seen the widespread rumour that it'll be limited to one console per household. To what extent Sony can/will really enforce this is anybody's guess. Do you need to buy separately from two different retailers or is card/postcode info shared with Sony when you pre-order? I typically always pre-order consoles in two places then cancel one a few weeks out and I must remember my Barclaycard expires in November so I must not use that. I don't know if it's still the case, but changing card/payment info on Amazon cancels a pre-order as I found out with my Switch pre-order.
I'm also planning on dropping a solid amount of cash on a 4 to 6Tb SSD just to hang off the USB C port for my PS4 games - assuming the SDD performance is significantly better than a fast HDD. Time has more value to me than the type of prices we're talking about.
I'm with you on this too. We need to see extensive benchmarks with game loading performance of legacy BC games on different storage tiers: Internal NVME, External NVME, external SSD, and external HDD.
I'm curious how my 2TB external SSD compares to external HDD when the system isn't bottlenecked by internal connection bus or the puny Jaguar cores. That will change my plan of larger HDD, or another SSD or higher performance SSD, or the NVME cards for SeriesX.
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I'm probably going to upgrade to the new Nvidia card but... I'm waiting to see what Series X/PS5 are really like first. If nextgen consoles are really almost a load-less experience I just don't think I will want to game on PC on the TV for a long time. Frankly, I'll take immediacy over graphics every day of the week. The console experience for me is, the killer feature. I love suspend/resume, being able picking up the controller pressing a button and the game springs to life right where I left it. I only flip back to PC gaming for better performance, like not waiting for whatever the hell Fallout 4 is doing on consoles during epic load times. I am that PS4 gamer who flipped to PC mid-gen but still bought a PS4 Pro.
I think the mistake is in people interpretation of what they may have seen. The same way MS lists 8K as possible output for Series X. Regardless of MS allegedly listing 1440p, consumers will likely be using 1080p resolution because of their limited TV sets or displays. I dont know of any mass market consumer displays that use 1440p.
One benefit of a potential Series S is if the resources are scaled down from 4K, with the same speed NVME it may have faster load times than PS5. So if PS5 can dynamically load assets when needed then Series S would do so too, perhaps even better.
Of course there is Zero official information about the product. So MS cant have lied about it.
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I'm not expecting miracles when running current gen games because many will be doing stupid things like bypassing the zlib hardware because that was slower than some weird software algorithm they wrote for 2013-era hardware, that is no longer the case but the game doesn't know any better. Likewise, games still loading vast amounts of unnecessary textures because they think they're running off a crappy HDD.
I suspect some games will just work really well and others, probably not so much. But I am interested to see how this all shakes out and I really hope Digital Foundry will look at this this in-between analysing all the new shiny pixels in new/old games.
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Still all rumor on resolutionat target, nothing official. But I've never really agreed with the 10gb number. Does it make sense for 4k to 1080p games? Yeah, but I always thought it would match 1X's 12gb. Too many different RAM targets( 8g, 10gb, 12gb & 16gb). 10gb on Lockhart doesn't make sense unless OS tasks on Lockhart are not the same as SX(2.5gb) or 1X(3gb). So yeah, 12gb+an extra 4gb=16gb for 4K makes more sense.
Tommy McClain
Nah, it's something that's been tried before, and it just means I wouldn't be able to simply order 2 at whatever reseller I choose, so I'll have to get one from Amazon and one from somewhere else.I assumed you've really seen the widespread rumour that it'll be limited to one console per household. To what extent Sony can/will really enforce this is anybody's guess. Do you need to buy separately from two different retailers or is card/postcode info shared with Sony when you pre-order? I typically always pre-order consoles in two places then cancel one a few weeks out and I must remember my Barclaycard expires in November so I must not use that. I don't know if it's still the case, but changing card/payment info on Amazon cancels a pre-order as I found out with my Switch pre-order.
Game memory:
13.5 / 9 = 1.5x
7.5 / 5 = 1.5x
coincidence, I'm sure.
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I don't think they'll match Scorpio anyway. Scorpio was expensive to build, and they need to cut costs any way they can. Even though it's 3 years later and a new node, we know that cost reductions have been a sore point lately.
It would have been nice, but... oh well.
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It's so strange to me that they haven't even begun to lay the ground for a multi-device launch, like the game of pricing chicken I can see but there's no reason they couldn't be talking up how their approach is all about enabling Gamers (tm) access to the next gen whatever their budget. That's a lot of messaging to push alongside whatever the pricing story is versus PS5
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