Duh, yeah, you're right. The depth sensor resolution isn't increasing much. I was comparing the wrong thing (optical resolution).
Controllers and every other aspect of Orbis and Durango
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We don't know yet if the sensor is all there is to it. Perhaps there is also better integration with the controller, about which we don't know anything.
Also, there's a new sensor it seems, that may help a lot. And things are far better integrated into the system buswise etc.
I expect quite an improvement regardless.
LightHeaven
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You are looking at the wrong latency. The latency of the camera seeing the scene, plus processing and providing the game with the skeletal data is one thing. Certain games use that data directly, while others smooth (filter) it out or wait for gestures to be completed, which adds delay on top of data.
The first latency, is relatively good (imo) even on current kinect. Here's a video i made back when the sensor was launched (that nui viewer apparently was used at the kinect beta, but it was still avaiable for a short time after the first kinect dashboard was out, so i could download it): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yKdX0AeQDpU And from what i understand, that's the thing that was reduced to two frames at 30fps now, which means kinect 2.0 adds no extra delay (at 30fps) compared to a joystick, because no matter how fast the joystick is you always have at least a 2 frame delay (again on 30fps).
The other latency, that on current kinect 1.0 can be gamebreaker is that the data is super noisy (and the joints moves a lot in time, even when you are standing still), so on top of the traditional input you have to use additional filtering/smoothing to have a data good enough to be presented to the player, or if your game is gesture based, you have no other choice but to wait for the player to do the whole gesture, identify it, and them apply the accordingly action. The leak also said this new sensor is more precise, which hopefully means now that the joints do not jump that much from frame to frame, so no filtering (or at least not as much) is necessary, and the perceived latency is lower. For gestures delay i guess it can be solved if the game is design to work with tracking 1:1 at all times rather than tracking to see the gestures (ie. instead of looking for a punch gesture to make the character punch afterwards, map the whole punch movement to the character on screen and calculate whether it hits anything and at what force, but that brings it's own design troubles, though).
PS4's stereo cameras appear to be about 3" apart. There was no showcase of body tracking though, and the press release doesn't mention it - it only talks about background removal.
There will likely be a lot more about that later. I'm sure they have a few things to figure out in that department still, also regarding SDK stuff. And they didn't consider this the moment for it - they estimated their audience as hardcore, not too interested in motion control stuff.
Yes, but then relative to the increased FOV, the increase in resolution isn't huge; certainly not the 6x I was comparing with the RGB!
That light bar on new dualshock can be motion tracked in same fashion as move controller I suppose.
edit: nvm, I just read official description on playstation blog
"DUALSHOCK 4 was developed alongside a second peripheral, a dual camera which can sense the depth of the environment in front of it and also track the 3D location of the controller via its light bar. "
edit: nvm, I just read official description on playstation blog
"DUALSHOCK 4 was developed alongside a second peripheral, a dual camera which can sense the depth of the environment in front of it and also track the 3D location of the controller via its light bar. "
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGlu3e9kdks
0:20 - 1:30 Close look at the controller. Looks nice.
EDIT : GIF http://i.minus.com/iqI7LUAhVOE6Z.gif
0:20 - 1:30 Close look at the controller. Looks nice.
EDIT : GIF http://i.minus.com/iqI7LUAhVOE6Z.gif
A few more details from Sony:
http://www.engadget.com/2013/02/21/sony=playstation-4-eye-works/
We discussed the issue with the PS Eye being used for tracking the Move controller being antithetical to it being used to give a good picture of the player (it wants to have the light stand out as much as possible), and I guess using one camera to track the Move and the other to film the player is one way of solving that ...
My guess would be that if you use the two camera's in conjunction for stereo/depth of field sensing of the full surroundings, you could still use Move but track it in a different (space/positional) way, that would however probably have a higher latency. So my guess is that they're doing these two things side-by-side to have a choice there depending on the application.
http://www.engadget.com/2013/02/21/sony=playstation-4-eye-works/
We discussed the issue with the PS Eye being used for tracking the Move controller being antithetical to it being used to give a good picture of the player (it wants to have the light stand out as much as possible), and I guess using one camera to track the Move and the other to film the player is one way of solving that ...
My guess would be that if you use the two camera's in conjunction for stereo/depth of field sensing of the full surroundings, you could still use Move but track it in a different (space/positional) way, that would however probably have a higher latency. So my guess is that they're doing these two things side-by-side to have a choice there depending on the application.
Ah, so that's how they solve the player photo/video problem in motion games. 
Wonderbook should be a tablet app.
Yes, I quite like the new controller so far.
Wonderbook should be a tablet app.
Yes, I quite like the new controller so far.
They also have the flexibility of using one camera for motion tracking at 120 or 240Hz, low resolution, while at the same time having the other camera at 1280x800 60Hz for AR.
That sounds like what they're talking about. Motion tracking needs high frame rate. I hadn't thought about that; it's certainly different. Does kinda imply a distancing from 3D though. You can't buy a camera-based game and be sure it'll have 3D composite as it may use 3D IQ and fast Move tracking.
That would certainly provide a large amount of options:
- 'background separation' with 2 cameras. Then use the PSeye libraries to do "2.5D" skeletal analysis... should be adequate for PS4-fit/dancestar etc.
- PS move. As per the current system, but for "mirror" apps you can track the move at a high frame whilst allowing a high resolution mirror image.
- track the gamepad. The controller supposedly has roughly the same sensors as PS move, although there doesn't seem to be any example usage.
- turn the camera off entirely.
Whilst 8GB was a surprise, I'd have preferred to see a demo of background separation
.That would certainly provide a large amount of options:
- 'background separation' with 2 cameras. Then use the PSeye libraries to do "2.5D" skeletal analysis... should be adequate for PS4-fit/dancestar etc.
- PS move. As per the current system, but for "mirror" apps you can track the move at a high frame whilst allowing a high resolution mirror image.
- track the gamepad. The controller supposedly has roughly the same sensors as PS move, although there doesn't seem to be any example usage.
- turn the camera off entirely.
Whilst 8GB was a surprise, I'd have preferred to see a demo of background separation
For background separation, I'd go one step further to try to model the background in 3D.
I expect so. Set your face close to the cameras and they'll have plenty of detail available.
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