Computex 2021, AMD | Nvidia

trinibwoy said:
Lol for real. It’s tempting just for the cool factor alone. I might be peddling a lightly used 5950x next year.
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To be honest, I'll only be interested in Zen3+ if it's coming with DDR5, otherwise I might choose a slower (also probably cheaper) Alder Lake.
It just seems like a bad choice to go with the 7 year-old DDR4 in the same year DDR5 is coming to the market.
 
I still remember getting all excited when I got my Ryzen 5 1600 and B450 mobo about how I'd have a nice, long upgrade path if I so chose.

The rate it's going I'm gonna go from my 1600 to whatever the next socket is before I upgrade. :|
 
ToTTenTranz said:
To be honest, I'll only be interested in Zen3+ if it's coming with DDR5, otherwise I might choose a slower (also probably cheaper) Alder Lake.
It just seems like a bad choice to go with the 7 year-old DDR4 in the same year DDR5 is coming to the market.
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On the other hand new DDR generations have a tendency of start off not only overpriced relative to previous gen, but also it'll probably take some time before we get faster speed grades. They'll probably be mostly at JEDEC latencies too.
High end DDR4 might actually be faster in many scenarios
 
Malo said:
The rate what is going?
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Bondrewd said:
Eh 5k Ryzen's are sorta available right now.
GPUs are lol.
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Actually the rate my Ryzen is doing, it's great. I've had it OCed to 4Ghz since the week I got it and I just don't feel a need to upgrade my CPU/mobo and by the time I do I'll want DDR5 and whatever the next socket is.

It's not a great value upgrade for me to do a new CPU right now, I'm entirely GPU limited.

I'm not saying you can't get Ryzens, I'm actually impressed as hell at how well mine has done! I thought I'd be needing to upgrade it a year or so after I got it, but it's been a champ and I've no complaints of it whatsoever. Got my son the same CPU/mobo/memory and he's loving it too.

I just meant by the time I'M ready to upgrade it probably won't be with the same mobo, even though I have lots of CPU upgrade options for it. Not saying I wouldn't drop a better CPU in if one came my way, I just think investing in a monitor right now would be cheaper/wiser/better value for my monies.

You folks ain't wrong, this is just in my personal situation how it works out. :)
 
Kaotik said:
On the other hand new DDR generations have a tendency of start off not only overpriced relative to previous gen, but also it'll probably take some time before we get faster speed grades. They'll probably be mostly at JEDEC latencies too.
High end DDR4 might actually be faster in many scenarios
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This is true, but a DDR4 platform bought in 2021 is most probably not upgradeable for a newer architecture, whereas a DDR5 one might be.
Even the one from Intel, as they already confirmed socket compatibillity with Raptor Lake.
 
ToTTenTranz said:
To be honest, I'll only be interested in Zen3+ if it's coming with DDR5, otherwise I might choose a slower (also probably cheaper) Alder Lake.
It just seems like a bad choice to go with the 7 year-old DDR4 in the same year DDR5 is coming to the market.
Click to expand...

It's sorta the opposite for me. I upgrade to a memory standard at the end of its run. Haswell was my first foray into DDR3 and Zen 3 is my first dance with DDR4. So if I do a quick jump to Zen3+ it'll still be really early in my upgrade cycle and mostly just for kicks.
 
trinibwoy said:
It's sorta the opposite for me. I upgrade to a memory standard at the end of its run. Haswell was my first foray into DDR3 and Zen 3 is my first dance with DDR4. So if I do a quick jump to Zen3+ it'll still be really early in my upgrade cycle and mostly just for kicks.
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The problem is you're investing in a mobo+ram setup that won't get a CPU upgrade path.
If you assume from the get go that you'll need to buy a whole new set of internals the next time you upgrade your system (and worst of all go through all the hassle of changing the motherboard, formating the OS partition, etc.. I used to find that entertaining 15-20 years ago but not so much nowadays) then that's fine.
But I did just that for my last big upgrade and the result is I'm still stuck with a ridiculously old Ivy Bridge Xeon on a X79. Had I waited for a X99 Haswell I'd have upgraded to a much better CPU by now.
 
ToTTenTranz said:
The problem is you're investing in a mobo+ram setup that won't get a CPU upgrade path.
If you assume from the get go that you'll need to buy a whole new set of internals the next time you upgrade your system (and worst of all go through all the hassle of changing the motherboard, formating the OS partition, etc.. I used to find that entertaining 15-20 years ago but not so much nowadays) then that's fine.
But I did just that for my last big upgrade and the result is I'm still stuck with a ridiculously old Ivy Bridge Xeon on a X79. Had I waited for a X99 Haswell I'd have upgraded to a much better CPU by now.
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Yeah that's essentially the plan. Full system upgrade every 6-8 years. Have been using the same case for 11 years now though.
 
ToTTenTranz said:
Had I waited for a X99 Haswell I'd have upgraded to a much better CPU by now.
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X99 is a bit (or very, depends on how well you tolerate fucky DRAM being fucky) cursed platform tbf.
I'm not sure if your launch experience would've been anything besides peak misery.
 
LOL at people in here talking about lack of upgrades on their mobo. i'm still on an Intel-branded DX79Si motherboard, running my i7-3930k at 4.5GHz (yay 1.25 BCLK strap!) for the last... I dunno... Eight years at least? Intel ARK says it's getting close to nine years now! Yeah buddy. Sandy Bridge has been holding down the fort for a long damned time, and yet even though Ivy Bridge was only a firmware change away, it never came to the DX79SI board. Intel is a bunch of dicks. And yet, paired with my overclocked 1080Ti and playing all my games at 1440p on my 60Hz Dell U2711, I can still find a lot of places where I'm still fully GPU limited even with all the options cranked.

It also helps that I'm not a twitch gamer ;)

Anyway, Zen3+ sounds like a great place to hop off for me. I'd happily sit on a nice 12c / 24t Zen3+ on a high performance bit of DDR4 memory and ride that bad bastard into the next six to eight years of gaming goodness, too.
 
trinibwoy said:
Lol for real. It’s tempting just for the cool factor alone. I might be peddling a lightly used 5950x next year.
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Me too. Well, I'd prolly give the 5950X to a friend. I might have a GPU to give him too if I do a double-upgrade in winter 2022.

The "15% average" uplift will be a substantial portion of the DDR5 uplift. In my opinion, might as well wait until DDR5 matures with Zen 5...

Zen 4 may actually turn out to be quite tame in comparison with Zen 3 V-Cache. I'm going to guess Zen 4 will also have V-Cache, but the extra performance that DDR5 is supposed to bring will be covered by V-Cache instead. So then it's a question of whether there are substantial IPC uplifts in Zen 4, on-top of the V-Cache boost.

In my opinion Zen 4 needs to be 50%+ faster than Zen 3 to warrant waiting another 5 quarters. Otherwise you might as well wait 10 quarters for Zen 5. And if Zen 4 is an APU, the IPC gains might not be so exciting...

On the other hand, Zen 3 is, despite 7nm, heavily power-limited. Zen 4 might not be a monstrous IPC uplift, but "clocks x cores" may see a big boost due to 5nm, which would be enhanced by V-Cache :)
 
Bondrewd said:
Naaaah.

Nah and those cores love MLP spam which DDR5 brings aplenty.

It is but wut.
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So some type of aggressive prefetch that is neither temporal or Spatial locality based?
AI prefetchers here we come? ( i mean way more AI then the Jaguar / Zen1 prefetcher)

edit: imagine a Core that has more computational throughput on its front end then backend and in terms of accelerating scalar / small SIMD code i can totally see it :)
 
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