Business Approach Comparison Sony PS4 and Microsoft Xbox

[Jay]

All of which are coming out on PS4, and every gamer knows it. So what's the point of running a conference where you say, "here's stuff you already know is coming to our machine"

I thought the same way, but I don't know if I credit people with that much intelligence any more.
The first XB1 reveal was pretty much this approach.

 

[brasnial]

All of which are coming out on PS4, and every gamer knows it. So what's the point of running a conference where you say, "here's stuff you already know is coming to our machine"? Makes more sense to me to take that moment to say, "we have the usual suspects, but also this other stuff," so that those undecided about which console based on both of them getting the core games can be swayed by the extras. That is after all what both these machines are about. The core game experience is probably going to be identical between both, save a few differences in online, maybe framerate and IQ, and such. The reason anyone is going to buy one over the other is the unique experience it offers, in exclusives and in UI and services. Sony made a point of of highlighting some of their immediate exclusives.

What would have a bigger impact of your fan base shifty a new uncharted or 30 Indie tiles .
Uncharted of coarse the only reason it was a no show was because its not ready to be shown much like a lot of Sony's big hitters .
Microsoft just happen to have more big name exclusives at launch for some reason forza ....dead rissing being too big hitters .

Sony concentrated on what they have ready to show now must of there Indie games will appear first on ps4 but who here really thinks if Sony had a uncharted ....grand turismo ready to show that Indies would have had the same amount of time dedicated to them.
No Sony would have had maybe one Indie developer talk plus a high light real ,then they would have concentrated on there big hitters .

Most of Sony's talk about being developer friendly in my opinion is just there way of making sure every tom ...dick and harry knows that the PS4 is not the developer nightmare that the PS3 was at launch .

But if Sony think Indie games are a big selling point on a £350 machine then in my opinion they are betting on the wrong horse .
Now I know Sony don't think Indie games will sell there machine but they had to fill a hour and a half as they had room to show Indies off they did but in the future when Sony has big hitters of there own lined up I expect to see and hear less Indie talk .

 

[brasnial]

So it's 60 million hardcore gamers that make up the PS3 and 30 million hardcore + 30 million families that make up the XBOX 360 now?

Until Microsoft can show a game so compelling, and family oriented that it will move boxes you might have a point. But it would require a new genre imho to make a big difference. And it would have to be a genre that can't be copied with a EYE + PS4.

No the casual market is 100 million strong as the wii proved .....Microsoft are hoping to have a foot in both camps hardcore and casual that's why kinect exists and is in the box .

Sony on the other hand seem to have so far not tried to entice both markets that's there choice not mine but if word of mouth makes Xbox one a must have item with the casuals like word of mouth worked for the wii .
Come on the wii got a good kicking by most of the dedicated gaming press but the public loved its easy of use .
Now I can see the same thing happening again with xbox one because of kinect .
Hay just my humble opinion and as the saying goes opinions are like assholes in the fact we all have one

 

[Johnny Awesome]

While the likes of TitanFall and Forza 5 are turning heads at E3 and Gamescom, Sony is talking about Indie games because the launch titles aren't up to snuff and they don't have much playable on the floor.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Now I know Sony don't think Indie games will sell there machine but they had to fill a hour and a half as they had room to show Indies off they did but in the future when Sony has big hitters of there own lined up I expect to see and hear less Indie talk .

Even with as many internal development teams as Sony have, you don't want them all - or even a lot of them - dropping their AAA exclusives too close together near launch. There are a ton of third parties dropping their AAA's like COD, Battlefield, Watch Dogs, not to mention GTA V a couple of months before, to drain the coffers of many gamers.

In addition, you need to be thinking longterm. You're often talking 2-3 years to deliver a AAA game and Sony will be wanting to drop AAA games over the coming 12-18 months and after that, the expectation is those who delivered on launch will be ready to drop their second PS4 exclusive AAA games.

Uncharted didn't launch on PS3 until a year after launch and I wouldn't be surprised if Naughty Dog's first PS4 game launch was in that ballpark. They're not the kind of developer that you squander their talent on a fast release for press headlines. They'll be working on something special and taking their time about it.

 

[Johnny Awesome]

I don't have a problem with Sony doing what they are doing (as they certainly have enough to sell out at launch): Thin on the exclusives at launch and talking about Indie games. I'm just pointing out the reality of it.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

What would have a bigger impact of your fan base shifty a new uncharted or 30 Indie tiles .

For you fanbase, probably neither. the PS fanbase will buy PS4 no matter what. For undecided gamers, definitely a GT and an Uncharted are good to have, but I COD and the like are the AAA titles that'll rake in the most sales, and I for one wouldn't want to launch my most expensive titles alongside the first next-gen iterations of those behemoths. Sony are perhaps a little too loose with some of their devs, letting PD spend forever on GT5 and 6 and having nothing for PS4, and likewise Team ICO doing absolutely nothing for an entire generation. All that said, everybody knows PS4 is going to have games. The launch lineup is only about giving people a reason to buy now instead of waiting 6-12 months or more. I think PS4's lineup is enough for that, as is XB1's. There may be some people who'll invest in a whole future 5+ years on a platform based on the first wave of games available for it, but I have trouble believing that's a huge amount. eg. How many PS2 fans swapped over to XB360 when it launched on the strength of Gears alone? I don't think a lack of Uncharted or GT is going to see people in droves buying XB1 for Forza and Killer Instinct or Dead Rising 3; I don't think it'll have any tangible impact. The deciding factors will be price, friends, brand loyalty (including game franchise loyalty, such as those who want the platform with ND's games on), services, interface, and all that jazz.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

I'm just pointing out the reality of it.

And this is nothing new, hardware launches are traditionally a period of thin pickings for quality games. That's the reality of getting devs to deliver games in the far-from-ideal environment of final phases of console hardware and SDK development.

But by virtue of launching when they are, which happily coincides with the launch of a bunch of big third party games, the pressure is off for both companies. Ironically it probably works better for Microsoft as they have less first and second party devs to deliver the exclusive AAA games.

 

[brasnial]

For you fanbase, probably neither. the PS fanbase will buy PS4 no matter what. For undecided gamers, definitely a GT and an Uncharted are good to have, but I COD and the like are the AAA titles that'll rake in the most sales, and I for one wouldn't want to launch my most expensive titles alongside the first next-gen iterations of those behemoths. Sony are perhaps a little too loose with some of their devs, letting PD spend forever on GT5 and 6 and having nothing for PS4, and likewise Team ICO doing absolutely nothing for an entire generation. All that said, everybody knows PS4 is going to have games. The launch lineup is only about giving people a reason to buy now instead of waiting 6-12 months or more. I think PS4's lineup is enough for that, as is XB1's. There may be some people who'll invest in a whole future 5+ years on a platform based on the first wave of games available for it, but I have trouble believing that's a huge amount. eg. How many PS2 fans swapped over to XB360 when it launched on the strength of Gears alone? I don't think a lack of Uncharted or GT is going to see people in droves buying XB1 for Forza and Killer Instinct or Dead Rising 3; I don't think it'll have any tangible impact. The deciding factors will be price, friends, brand loyalty (including game franchise loyalty, such as those who want the platform with ND's games on), services, interface, and all that jazz.

I agree with everything you just shifty .....one of Sony's big hitters would drive early sales much faster than any number of Indie games.
I have no doult Sony are probably moving heaven and earth to have one of there big hitters ready for next Christmas just like Microsoft will move heaven and earth to make sure halo shows up for next Christmas .

Both companies are playing with what they have on the table at this precise minute Sony Indie Microsoft acouple of core big exclusives .

The first few months will be about selling to your more commited fan base .....I personally think Sony have a bigger committed fan base than Microsoft .
But Microsoft have a bigger chance of appealing to the family and casual market with kinect in my opinion .

Predicting the future is a mugs game .....and yes I class myself a mug as I peer into my crastal ball trying to see if the family market and casuals are kinect happy

 

[DrJay24]

What would have a bigger impact of your fan base shifty a new uncharted or 30 Indie tiles .
Uncharted of coarse the only reason it was a no show was because its not ready to be shown much like a lot of Sony's big hitters .
Microsoft just happen to have more big name exclusives at launch for some reason forza ....dead rissing being too big hitters .

Ryse a 360 Kinect game turned XB1 is one reason they have one whole extra retail exclusive. Of course without the money hatted DR3 they would have less. It speaks that they had to buy a few exclusives. BTW are Forza and Dead Rising big sellers now?

So ride that one extra exclusive for a few months, let's hope they can produce games for year two and on. Of course Sony has big stuff in the works, but ignore all those studios with unannounced PS4 games, its all indies for the next five years.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Of course without the money hatted DR3 they would have less. It speaks that they had to buy a few exclusives.

Not really. Doesn't matter how you get exclusives, whether you run (costly) internal studios or hire someone else to make them - the important thing (sadly for gamers who either have to choose console or operate more than one) is that your platform has exclusives good enough to attract the pundits.

 

[temesgen]

What would have a bigger impact of your fan base shifty a new uncharted or 30 Indie tiles .
Uncharted of coarse the only reason it was a no show was because its not ready to be shown much like a lot of Sony's big hitters .
Microsoft just happen to have more big name exclusives at launch for some reason forza ....dead rissing being too big hitters .

Sony concentrated on what they have ready to show now must of there Indie games will appear first on ps4 but who here really thinks if Sony had a uncharted ....grand turismo ready to show that Indies would have had the same amount of time dedicated to them.
No Sony would have had maybe one Indie developer talk plus a high light real ,then they would have concentrated on there big hitters .

Most of Sony's talk about being developer friendly in my opinion is just there way of making sure every tom ...dick and harry knows that the PS4 is not the developer nightmare that the PS3 was at launch .

But if Sony think Indie games are a big selling point on a £350 machine then in my opinion they are betting on the wrong horse .
Now I know Sony don't think Indie games will sell there machine but they had to fill a hour and a half as they had room to show Indies off they did but in the future when Sony has big hitters of there own lined up I expect to see and hear less Indie talk .

Given the depth and consistent releases from Sony first parties I think most are willing to give them the benefit of the doubt where teams like ND are concerned.

 

[east of eastside]

I don't think there's any evidence to support your view that PlayStation is the art-house cinema of the gaming world. The best selling titles are the same core games - COD, FIFA, Madden, blah blah. We also have the same media experience with Netflix and iPlayer et al being popular on the platform. Look a the launch line-up; it's pretty much all core games like shooters, racers and sport.

Sony: The Order: 1886 is a 'filmic', linear, third-person action-adventure..

'Filmic', nice term, captures the essence of Sony first-party game design: production values/presentation-based-gaming over actual gameplay based gaming. At least Microsoft wants their action games to be about multiplayer and online. Uncharted, Last of Us were from the same Sony cinematic action-gaming approach..

Just spending a moment looking at the reality, your remark comes off as, well, ridiculous quite frankly, founded on nothing whatsoever except a prejudiced outlook. Sony hasn't sacrificed any of the core gaming experience for the indie. They've just embraced a larger diversity which is something Sony have always done and why they have been as popular as they have been. Considering MS are also courting the indie sector at the moment, it's something the industry as a whole seems to be favouring. I honestly don't understand where your perception of PS being for trend followers and not gamers comes from.

I'm not saying they "sacrificed core gaming" for indie, I'm saying the indie focus is a compensation for their lack of better core exclusives, at the moment, compared to Microsoft.

Objectively speaking, maybe Sony is so confident that they have tactically decided to delay more of their core gaming exclusive reveals for later. In that case, Microsoft is the one compensating with software for what they are lacking in platform appeal..

I honestly don't understand where your perception of PS being for trend followers and not gamers comes from.

I can't give you a really neat and concise answer to that, I'm afraid, but just kind of stumble through with a rough one..

Atari, Amiga, Nintendo, Sega were all about gameplay in their game design approach back in their time of old-school gaming. It was Sony that introduced the whole 'Hollywood', production value based/presentation-over-gamplay modern "gaming" paradigm with Playstation, as part of the expansion of the mainstream appeal of video games.

Games like Uncharted, Last of Us, The Order: 1886 all extend that Sony game design legacy where the presentation is the bigger selling point then the actual gameplay (in action games). Halo, Gears, Titan Fall, etc for Microsoft all have great production values, but without sacrificing gameplay for presentation or going for that 'filmic appeal'. Gran Tourismo vs Forza is another example where Microsoft tends to balance presentation and gameplay better than Sony. Killzone 4 will probably look great, but play like a bore like it always has, citing the same example..

In general, Microsoft has always marketed technology more from a functional concept rather than a combination of functionality and trend/cool appeal. In that regard, Apple and Sony borrow from the same playbook while Microsoft has historically been the 'uncool' one. You can see that marketing approach difference in the design and execution of Xbox One vs PS4. So much of how PS4 has been presented and hyped (*not saying every aspect*) is a very large and well executed p.r. play that not everybody has jumped on the trend, or gullibly bought into.

 

[temesgen]

Sony: The Order: 1886 is a 'filmic', linear, third-person action-adventure..

'Filmic', nice term, captures the essence of Sony first-party game design: production values/presentation-based-gaming over actual gameplay based gaming. At least Microsoft wants their action games to be about multiplayer and online. Uncharted, Last of Us were from the same Sony cinematic action-gaming approach..



I'm not saying they "sacrificed core gaming" for indie, I'm saying the indie focus is a compensation for their lack of better core exclusives, at the moment, compared to Microsoft.

Objectively speaking, maybe Sony is so confident that they have tactically decided to delay more of their core gaming exclusive reveals for later. In that case, Microsoft is the one compensating with software for what they are lacking in platform appeal..



I can't give you a really neat and concise answer to that, I'm afraid, but just kind of stumble through with a rough one..

Atari, Amiga, Nintendo, Sega were all about gameplay in their game design approach back in their time of old-school gaming. It was Sony that introduced the whole 'Hollywood', production value based/presentation-over-gamplay modern "gaming" paradigm with Playstation, as part of the expansion of the mainstream appeal of video games.

Games like Uncharted, Last of Us, The Order: 1886 all extend that Sony game design legacy where the presentation is the bigger selling point then the actual gameplay (in action games). Halo, Gears, Titan Fall, etc for Microsoft all have great production values, but without sacrificing gameplay for presentation or going for that 'filmic appeal'. Gran Tourismo vs Forza is another example where Microsoft tends to balance presentation and gameplay better than Sony. Killzone 4 will probably look great, but play like a bore like it always has, citing the same example..

In general, Microsoft has always marketed technology more from a functional concept rather than a combination of functionality and trend/cool appeal. In that regard, Apple and Sony borrow from the same playbook while Microsoft has historically been the 'uncool' one. You can see that marketing approach difference in the design and execution of Xbox One vs PS4. So much of how PS4 has been presented and hyped (*not saying every aspect*) is a very large and well executed p.r. play that not everybody has jumped on the trend, or gullibly bought into.

What was the review score for The Order? Its not out yet but you know it will compromise gameplay for other objectives. While we're at it Gears has better gameplay than Uncharted... OK... generally speaking it makes little sense to compare gameplay this way but we can certainly look at reviews and see your perspective is an outlier.

 

[AlphaWolf]

What was the review score for The Order? Its not out yet but you know it will compromise gameplay for other objectives. While we're at it Gears has better gameplay than Uncharted... OK... generally speaking it makes little sense to compare gameplay this way but we can certainly look at reviews and see your perspective is an outlier.

Opinion is opinion, Gears of war x360 games metacritic avg is almost 93 and uncharted is right at 92 (avg of all 3 games), Obviously gears is a much better game...

It's really a stupid argument, but I don't know that he is an outlier considering those metacritic results.

 

[temesgen]

Opinion is opinion, Gears of war x360 games metacritic avg is almost 93 and uncharted is right at 92 (avg of all 3 games), Obviously gears is a much better game...

It's really a stupid argument, but I don't know that he is an outlier considering those metacritic results.

I didn't say Uncharted was a better game I called him out for suggesting that the developer compromised gameplay for other priorities. It was a ridiculous comment and I'm actually surprised anyone would to try and defend it....

Edit:

If the game had been compromised as he suggested I seriously doubt the IP would have the overall reputation and review average it currently does.

 

[AlphaWolf]

I didn't say Uncharted was a better game I called him out for suggesting that the developer compromised gameplay for other priorities. It was a ridiculous comment and I'm actually surprised anyone would to try and defend it....

no one did.

 

[temesgen]

no one did.

here is his comment which led to my reply:

"Games like Uncharted, Last of Us, The Order: 1886 all extend that Sony game design legacy where the presentation is the bigger selling point then the actual gameplay (in action games). Halo, Gears, Titan Fall, etc for Microsoft all have great production values, but without sacrificing gameplay for presentation or going for that 'filmic appeal'. Gran Tourismo vs Forza is another example where Microsoft tends to balance presentation and gameplay better than Sony. Killzone 4 will probably look great, but play like a bore like it always has, citing the same example.."

Is it a stupid argument or a stupid comment which started the discussion?

 

[Blazkowicz]

Maybe it's flamebait?
But I had the dishonor of playing the first Uncharted and it's crap. The shooting part was some kind of imprecise, slow tank simulation. But there's platforming (figuring out what stone edge is reachable and has been flagged as "you can cling to it" when they made the map), and triggering cutscenes if you like that.

The other games I can't comment, I've played nothing of the PS360 gen.

 

[zed]

Opinion is opinion, Gears of war x360 games metacritic avg is almost 93 and uncharted is right at 92 (avg of all 3 games), Obviously gears is a much better game...

It's really a stupid argument, but I don't know that he is an outlier considering those metacritic results.

You might wanna recheck your maths as gears of war for the 4 games average metacritic is under 90.