AMD: R9xx Speculation

[Silent_Buddha]

The biggest failing I can think of is getting outmanoeuvered by Intel in spite of all the Fusion hype. Intel essentially delivered Fusion before AMD did and that was supposed to be their ace.

One of the drawbacks of relying on TSMC. Had they not skipped 32 nm and/or had problems with 40 nm it's quite likely Fusion would have arrived last year. I'd imagine Fusion was originally meant for 32 nm. It being cancelled threw everything into a bit of a mess with Fusion APU's just like it did with their GPUs.

Regards,
SB

 

[mczak]

Is Bulldozer behind schedule? They seem to be stretching their Phenom II line like back with Athlon 64 X2. Bulldozer is starting to remind me of Barcelona.

The original leaked roadmaps showed BD to be released sometime 2011. There were rumors AMD was trying to pull this in to Q4 2010 but if they really tried, it apparently didn't work.

One of the drawbacks of relying on TSMC. Had they not skipped 32 nm and/or had problems with 40 nm it's quite likely Fusion would have arrived last year. I'd imagine Fusion was originally meant for 32 nm. It being cancelled threw everything into a bit of a mess with Fusion APU's just like it did with their GPUs.

The earliest leaked roadmap showed Ontario alongside BD to be released in 2011 (in 32nm, but then still AMD fab, not TSMC). So it doesn't appear there was any delay due to TSMC (it is still very early in 2011!). It was likely never targeted for TSMC 32nm, or if it really was, probably moved to 40nm quite early (since even early pricing for 32nm TSMC said it's going to be more expensive per transistor than 40nm - same reason Barts was planned for 40nm in contrast to Cayman).

 

[Florin]

And u think that a tegra 2+ some 2*1GHz ARM cores will make u throw away your 3 GHz desktop quad core cpu and a decent GPU when windows 8 arives ?

It's not unthinkable. Laptops killed desktops, at least for consumers. Increasingly, we now find mobile devices taking over roles that used to belong to laptops.

These "mobile revolutions" and "super phones"are just shareholders wet dreams. I think they will get over it after a while when people get sick of all those gadgets and who knows what with 1 milion unused functions.

Heh. Maybe. So far they're not showing any sign of losing momentum.

Me thinks when fusion comes out and later APU aplications will emerge than i think the rest of the industry will just stare what did they miss out. And of course how far will they trail behind with AMD working on new gpus paralel.

You're in for a surprise there, then. Intel's manufacturing advantages can easily scale them down into the ranges where Fusion operates. Their 'good enough' GPUs will be up to DX11 and OpenCL/DC support by the time Ivy Bridge rolls around. Meanwhile from the other side the ARM boys are scaling up into that range with competitive PowerVR and Nvidia GPUs and a huge power advantage.

 

[trinibwoy]

Sure, but Dirk Meyer has only been serving as CEO since July 2008. How much of an impact could he really have had on Llano's schedule?

Hard to say but there a lot of decisions that were made in those two years that we aren't privy to. Some of which could have dramatically affected AMD's focus and medium/long term strategy. A CEO doesn't get much of a honeymoon.

 

[silent_guy]

Besides, Atom is actually a sort of failure that was saved by the sudden arrival of budget mini notebooks. It was supposed to be their chance to get into MIPS / ARM territory but it has far too high power usage for that. Additionally it is an offshoot of the failed Larrabee tech.

History and intent don't matter: Intel was there and sold millions until the netbook fad was over. AMD didn't.

Either way, in the story about the firing of Dirk M., the alleged failures of Intel are irrelevant, especially considering that Intel had other, extremely profitable product lines... Unlike AMD.

 

[eastmen]

History and intent don't matter: Intel was there and sold millions until the netbook fad was over. AMD didn't.

Either way, in the story about the firing of Dirk M., the alleged failures of Intel are irrelevant, especially considering that Intel had other, extremely profitable product lines... Unlike AMD.

Do you think the netbook fad is really over ? I bought an hp 311 which was a atom + ion and prompetly returned it because of performance but i need something with a keyboard thast smaller than my laptop and a tablet just doesn't do it as its to slow also.

I think with the right cpu/gpu netbooks will come back into fashion. We got my little cousin a dm1 because she needs something to take to classes to take notes with. She has an ipad , its what she wanted for her birthday in july , taking notes on it is just silly and doesn't work. But with a netbook she is able to do what she needs to do. I hope the cpu is fast enough

 

[Rangers]

For good news, from what I read on Neogaf Zacate/Ontario/whatever kill Atom from what I read. And that's mobile/netbook/forward looking stuff, sounded like a big win there. Anyways Intel doesn't have anything in phones either.

 

[swaaye]

Well I have a 9" EeePC that I use just about every day and have been for almost 3 years. It has the Celeron 900. I won't buy anything bigger than 9". I am eyeing the 7" 1024x600 tablets.

I don't know who netbooks are popular with or if many other people who bought them have actually significantly used them. I like the little thing for restaurant web browsing and as a very light, fully functional mobile micro "utility" PC. The keyboard may suck but it's far better than a touchscreen KB, and 9" EeePC web browsing is miles ahead of any phone.

History and intent don't matter: Intel was there and sold millions until the netbook fad was over. AMD didn't.

Either way, in the story about the firing of Dirk M., the alleged failures of Intel are irrelevant, especially considering that Intel had other, extremely profitable product lines... Unlike AMD.

True

 

[silent_guy]

Do you think the netbook fad is really over ?

I'm sure it will continue to exist as a category with some respectable volumes, but the hype of two, three years ago has disappeared. Back then at CES, you couldn't walk 3 feet without falling over an or another netbook. This year, I don't remember seeing a single one. It was all tablets.

I think notebooks similar to the MacBook Air 11", but somewhat cheaper, hit the sweet spot of size and performance.

 

[thatdude90210]

According to the Wall Street Journal, he was sacked for pretty much what's being talked about here. He didn't have the vision to get AMD into the newer mobile devices like smart phones and tablets. It's a huge missed opportunity.

Advanced Micro Devices Inc.'s board was concerned for nearly a year that Chief Executive Dirk Meyer wasn't doing enough to get the chip maker into markets for newer mobile devices, according to people familiar with the matter."

 

[GZ007]

According to the Wall Street Journal, he was sacked for pretty much what's being talked about here. He didn't have the vision to get AMD into the newer mobile devices like smart phones and tablets. It's a huge missed opportunity.

That sounds more like greedy bitches to me. They are already doing a lot of things for the money they have.
The mobile SOC market has a lot more players so the risks are much higher there. It would be interesting how much money nvidia earns on a tegra device with all the patent,license fees. They dont sell it in 100k quantities just for fun.

 

[UniversalTruth]

...Laptops killed desktops, at least for consumers...

Oh, really? When? Because I have missed that sad moment. /sarcastic

...These "mobile revolutions" and "super phones"are just shareholders wet dreams. I think they will get over it after a while when people get sick of all those gadgets and who knows what with 1 milion unused functions....

I agree.
Unfortunately companies can control in which direction consumer needs, demands and desires will go.
Me, as a consumer, is not an owner of such device, small display, low performance gadget. I'm a happy owner of a 17 inch laptop and, by the way, I'm even considering an upgrade to a 18 inch beauty.
Why on Earth will you need such a tablet or netbook, or whatever when you are in the restaurant having dinner? That's absolute nonsense and people have to think what is happening with their lives.

 

[trinibwoy]

I know very few people who own a desktop PC. Someone who had a laptop in college (for obvious reasons) will not buy a desktop computer unless it's for a very specific purpose e.g. gaming. There's just no compelling reason for the average consumer to purchase a desktop nowadays besides lower cost.

Same thing is happening to laptops due to the emergence of smartphones but to a much lesser extent. I rarely use my laptop nowadays as many common activities are perfectly doable on my phone (which I'm writing this post on). Given that it's always with me I do far more "computing" on my iPhone than my desktop and laptop combined.

 

[Alexko]

I know very few people who own a desktop PC. Someone who had a laptop in college (for obvious reasons) will not buy a desktop computer unless it's for a very specific purpose e.g. gaming. There's just no compelling reason for the average consumer to purchase a desktop nowadays besides lower cost.

Same thing is happening to laptops due to the emergence of smartphones but to a much lesser extent. I rarely use my laptop nowadays as many common activities are perfectly doable on my phone (which I'm writing this post on). Given that it's always with me I do far more "computing" on my iPhone than my desktop and laptop combined.

Really? Man, I don't know how you can stand writing more than a short text message on that thing…

 

[thatdude90210]

Really? Man, I don't know how you can stand writing more than a short text message on that thing…

Yeah, I hate having to do any sort of writing on my iphone. I don't bother with messageboards or online shopping on it. Even my netbook feels claustrophobic coming from years of full desktop.

 

[trinibwoy]

Really? Man, I don't know how you can stand writing more than a short text message on that thing…

Yep it's fine for quick stuff like that. I wouldn't try to write an essay on it though. But it's hard to imagine how a company could underestimate the emergence of smartphones. The signs have been there for years now and the iPhone and Android made it even more obvious.

 

[Lightman]

Yep it's fine for quick stuff like that. I wouldn't try to write an essay on it though. But it's hard to imagine how a company could underestimate the emergence of smartphones. The signs have been there for years now and the iPhone and Android made it even more obvious.

Smartphones are great on the go. I'm browsing message boards on them since 2002. Must say that HTC HD2 with 4.2'' screen gives me the best experience so far, but even my previous 3.2'' screen phone was good enough. Less than that and it's a bit of a pain.
On the other hand though, if I'm within reach of desktop PC or laptop then no way I will use my phone for browsing.

I can't imagine my household without at least one desktop PC (I have 3 ATM), but that's my preference of course. Laptops are fine for lighter workloads, business stuff, etc. but they are far behind desktops in a lot of areas.
So I don't see desktops fading away anytime soon yet :smile:

 

[Blazkowicz]

at home there's the overpowered desktop with about 300€ worth of hardware + 300€ worth of audio gear + 0€ worth of CRT displays (I feel CRT is easier on the eyes and easier for gaming..)
mouse + keyboard beat any laptop or PDA phone, ditto an actual pair of 80W speakers.
also that I can replace single pieces of dead hardware as they crap out is nice.

I use an actual notebook made of wood pulp (or what is the term for the simplest form, without a spiral)

I write it from one side for projects, procrastination etc. and from the other one with contacts, meetings, addresses etc.
I tried the netbook route before but while it had a crisp, vivid screen (first time I'd like a LCD, small size helps) it was unreadable in indirect sunlight, also the keyboard same as on eee PC 900 was unreliable.
the paper book is an order of magnitude lighter, thinner, reliable and I can carry it all the time in the backpack - I can still use it even in the event I go homeless or civilisation collapses.

other good tools are the yahoo webmail - both mails to self and text notes, ssh (i.e. ubiquitous access to text files, persistant IRC client, and file transfers!), anyterm (to log in to a text console from a browser, if one day I have to use a computer without ssh client or a locked down network), soon a home server will go online, and lastly a USB drive tied to my bicycle's key so I have it 24/7 with me and it's unlosable.

I believe I would get a PDA phone with keyboard if I had the need, though (as long as I can buy it not from a carrier and it concentrates on offering usb, audio jack, phone calls and a keyboard rather than pointless specs)

 

[Silent_Buddha]

I still don't know how people can stand surfing the web on a smartphone, I've tried it and I just couldn't stand it. Then again, I also can't stand browsing the web on the 1024x600 7" screens that are found on a lot of netbooks.

And considering how verbose I can get in some of my forum posts and e-mails, there's just no way a smartphone would be suitable for even 10% of my internet needs. Meh, I'm just not one of those that's interested in a smartphone for most of the things I can do on a computer I guess. Where I find smartphones absolutely fascinating is in the media playback, certain apps (GPS for example, but not any sort of text or image processing), and emergency internet use (quick reference to e-mail for example).

Regards,
SB

 

[swaaye]

My bro gave me his Droid v1 when he got the v2. I've been occasionally playing with it as a mini mobile web device for a few months. I find its web browsing ability to be just barely tolerable, but typing even on boards like this is not an option. My EeePC 900 has been the primary thing of comparison and it is far more usable in every way. But the fact that the Droid fits in my pocket is appealing and is making me consider the new 7" 1024x600 tablets. But again I don't think I could stand to type on a touch screen.

I think smartphones are primarily designed as social networking terminals and I'm not into that stuff at all which perplexes most people lol. I see them as inadequate phones (too big, damage prone) and as barely adequate web access devices. I would rather have a tiny flip phone and have a tablet for mobile web access.

And btw when is ATI going to bring MSAA / SSAA to Dead Space as NVIDIA has done for their cards?