Oh right.
A comparison of PS3 and 360 as media players
- Thread starter TrungGap
- Start date
Oh right.
(((interference)))
Veteran
If your TV supports RGB Full settings, then you should set both settings to full (also the super white thing). The PS3 makes sure that whatever doesn't support Full RGB as a source, is mapped to the Full RGB spectrum anyway.
Think of it like this: say I have a color range of 0-10, where 0 is no color, and 10 is the full red. If the PS3 outputs this range, it would map this range either to 16-235 or to 0-255 (Full RGB). Now if I have a source color range of 12.000 to 512 million, it would still map this to either 16-235 or 0-255, depending on your setting. In this case, the source material doesn't matter as much as you'd think, see?
However, this is still the best setting if your TV supports it, because 0-255 has 36 more steps of color information per pixel. So whenever you output information that uses 255 steps, you get the best color resolution, while you lose nothing (with room for better color upscaling in theory when you have stuff like DVD upscaling active on the PS3) whenever source material that is 16-235 is mapped to the 0-255 of Full RGB by the TV.
At least that's how I understand it. I just read the thread patsu posted, but people there don't actually fully understand what's going on here I think, except a few people at the end of the thread.
Just going back to this, I was watching a DVD with a lot of dark scenes (Pan's Labyrinth) on my PS3 the other day and I don't think this is correct.
I had set the Bravia and the PS3 to full RGB and I could immediately tell something was off as the blacks were looking more like grays (also when u hit the PS button to bring up the menu, the background looks dark grey instead of black).
When I switched the TV and PS3 to limited RGB the blacks looked like they were supposed too.
Can anyone else confirm this? Or is it just something with my setup (perhaps one of the other settings I have on is interfering eg. Super White?)
You are correct. By setting your PS3 to full, and having a TV that does not do full, you lose out on deep blacks and bright whites.
This is especially noticeable on DVD and Blu-ray, since those formats only support 16-235 anyway, so stretching the colour range can only hurt you and introduce artifacts.
(((interference)))
Veteran
I thought so! But everyone told me otherwise, including Sony's Bravia "product expert"
So it's the same with Blu-ray as well? What about videos played of the PS3's HDD?
This is annoying, i'll have to change the PS3 and TV settings everytime I switch between a game and a video/movie now.
EDIT: Oh wait misread your post, no my TV actually does support FULL RGB - PS3 games look fine, its just material that isnt mastered in Full RGB that is the problem ie. movies
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I use Limited RGB on my Bravia. It's dark enough. I believe it's the recommended setting for HDTV. Full RGB would make it too dark.
OTOH, if you're playing on a monitor, then go for Full RGB. The difference between Limited and Full RGB is significant on my monitor. I Full RGB there.
OTOH, if you're playing on a monitor, then go for Full RGB. The difference between Limited and Full RGB is significant on my monitor. I
Full RGB there.specwarGP2
Regular
How do you know if your TV is supports full RGB? When I set it to full its too dark. My TV has pretty good black levels - I always have to turn up the in game brightness because its too dark on default settings.
If it has the option for Full RGB in the menus, it should support Full RGB. It'd be remarkably stupid to have the option to enable a feature the TV doesn't support! Turning up the brightness is just a matter of calibration, not RGB range. Or putting it another way, if you use limited RGB, the black level (16,16,16) will be rendered as the minimum brightness intensity you'd get with (0,0,0) in Full RGB, and your brightest (235, 235, 235) will be as bright as (255,255,255) in Full RGB. The difference is there'll be less brightness resolution between these minimum and maximum points.
All Full RGB does is increase intensity resolution, similar to 24bit colour versus 16 bit colour (only to a far smaller degree!). I don't know how limited RGB content is actually transformed by PS3 to Full RGB, but in theory it'd just be a lerp/mapping and shouldn't have any dumb offsets such that limited RGB content start at dark grey and tops out at bright grey, missing the black and white marks. That said, given the confusions and results people have, perhaps something in the chain is broken?
All Full RGB does is increase intensity resolution, similar to 24bit colour versus 16 bit colour (only to a far smaller degree!). I don't know how limited RGB content is actually transformed by PS3 to Full RGB, but in theory it'd just be a lerp/mapping and shouldn't have any dumb offsets such that limited RGB content start at dark grey and tops out at bright grey, missing the black and white marks. That said, given the confusions and results people have, perhaps something in the chain is broken?
Are you sure you calibrated your contrast and brightness settings correctly? Obviously once you've selected Full RGB on your TV and PS3, you should adjust these settings - for me initially things were too dark. Also, do you have super-white on or off? I don't use it, as it changes nothing for my TV.
However, one thing that is perhaps overlooked is that some TVs also use a dynamic contrast/brightness setting. My Samsung does that, and it's very noticeable if you're using a Limited RGB mode, as then it's constantly trying to make the best use of mapping the Limited RBG input to the higher color range it has available. You notice this particularly when going from dark scenes to bright scenes and vice versa and this can result in shifting gray levels.
For me this was one of the biggest advantages of Full RGB on the PS3 and on the TV, as when having both on the TV hardly makes these kind of adjustments anymore (still happens, but not nearly as often as before) and I don't have to use the duller Movie mode option to prevent this from standing out too much.
(((interference)))
Veteran
Yes I use calibrated settings on my TV, it looks fantastic when playing games or watching HDTV. The only problem seems to be movies when using Full RGB (if you set it the TV and the PS3 to Limited RGB then there are no problems)
For info the TV is an KDL-46XBR4 which definitely supports Full RGB.
It seems like that is indeed what is happening, as I was watching the movie in a dimmed room and could easily tell that the night scenes were definitely not as dark as the set's black levels would allow.
And if you pressed the PS button during playback, to get the basic "quit playback, turn off system" menu - that would have a dark grey background instead of the black i'd normally get while playing a game etc.
It ridiculous that a Sony PS3 would have problems interfacing with a Sony TV (which came out after the PS3 did)
ShadowRunner
Veteran
Have you tried changing the BD/DVD Video Output Format (HDMI) option under video settings? I remember having a similar issue, i believe you have to change that setting to RGB if you have the range set to full. If using limited it should be set to Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr. I believe the auto setting uses whatever the scource material does, which would normally be Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr.
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(((interference)))
Veteran
Ah, yes that might do it, but isn't Y Pb/ Cb Pr/ Cr get you a better picture? And IIRC Full RGB doesnt support Super White.
I am using HDMI though, so maybe RGB is a better bet, anyone know?
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ShadowRunner
Veteran
It all depends on the TV. If your TV handles processing of Y Pb/ Cb Pr/ Cr better than RGB then set the PS3 to output Limited range, and use superwhite if supported by the TV. Most TVs will look fine using full RGB, and doesnt need superwhite (Limeted = 16-235, Limeted plus SuperWhite = 16-255, Full = 0-255).
Just test full and limited and see what looks best for you (making sure you do proper calibration for each setting). You will only have big problems if you TV doesnt support both but if it does the only difference should be where the colorspace conversion takes place, either at the tv or the ps3. I guess it is similar to image scaling, sometimes the TV will be the better quality scaler sometimes the PS3 depending on the TV you are using.
Just test full and limited and see what looks best for you (making sure you do proper calibration for each setting). You will only have big problems if you TV doesnt support both but if it does the only difference should be where the colorspace conversion takes place, either at the tv or the ps3. I guess it is similar to image scaling, sometimes the TV will be the better quality scaler sometimes the PS3 depending on the TV you are using.
John Koller confirmed they will have 3D games by this summer:
http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/31367/sony-ps3-3d-firmware-summer-2010
On cloud storage...
http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/31367/sony-ps3-3d-firmware-summer-2010
On cloud storage...
Sorry to be on-topic, but is it just me or downloaded videos (divx, avi, whatever) look a lot better when played through a PS3 than when i just plug my mac and play them with VLC?
I've been noticing more and more issues with playing mp3's via my 360 as of late. I mainly use my PS3 as my music player, but have recently found the 360 turned on more. I have an external HD with a 200gb FAT32 partition. I have zero issues playing any of the tracks via PS3.
I have a ton of issues now playing some of the same files on my 360. When using the Media Guide, and digging into the folders to select what I want. I can always drill to an artists name, and see the albums (root>artist>album>tracks). But, when I go to drill down, it will either hang flat out in excess of 5 minutes, lock up my machine and need to hard reset, or it will allow me to cancel out, and go back up one level. It's repeatable for me, with the same artists/album. The only thing I have been able to determine is some of the album titles are extremely long and/or the files are encoded in V0 (but that shouldn't be an issue).
Has anyone else had something similar happen? Thoughts?
I have a ton of issues now playing some of the same files on my 360. When using the Media Guide, and digging into the folders to select what I want. I can always drill to an artists name, and see the albums (root>artist>album>tracks). But, when I go to drill down, it will either hang flat out in excess of 5 minutes, lock up my machine and need to hard reset, or it will allow me to cancel out, and go back up one level. It's repeatable for me, with the same artists/album. The only thing I have been able to determine is some of the album titles are extremely long and/or the files are encoded in V0 (but that shouldn't be an issue).
Has anyone else had something similar happen? Thoughts?
Redbox to rent Blu-ray by mid 2010:
http://www.homemediamagazine.com/re...ay-rentals-likely-mid-year-higher-price-18469
http://www.homemediamagazine.com/re...ay-rentals-likely-mid-year-higher-price-18469
(((interference)))
Veteran
While it does noise/block reduction etc, i'm not sure if it upscales videos played back from HDD, as the quality is nothing like what you would get if you watched a DVD with the PS3's admittedly excellent DVD upscaling turned on.
The playback menu for DVDs has far more upscaling related options compared to HDD playback.
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