Ooh-videogames
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5 pages and no response from ERP.
"2x the power of the GC," can someone clarify what this means? (ERP)
- Thread starter Li Mu Bai
- Start date
Eagle-Vision said:
E-V is correct, & I somehow completely overlooked this. RE4 is certainly not within the same technical (nor visual) class as Rebel Strike. Rebel Strike achieves everything from light scattering, EMBM, self-shadowing, per-pixel lighting, inverse kinetics, DPLIIx support, (the split screen co-op in RL actually manages to look more impressive than the original despite the fact that Flipper/Gekko are performing 2x the workload) hi-res textures, real-time water physics, a particle system putting out upwards of 20,000 particles at a time, (x the fps correct?) LOD, etc.
Too bad F5 had extremely subpar animators. 2x this rendering quality should indeed be enough.
Just goes to show how tastes differ. I thought RE4 was a great looking game, but Rebel Strike didn't impress me. Check list of features aside, the game was ugly, barren and a little glitchy. Looked like they were trying to spread what the GC had to offer far too thinly. Didn't impress anyone else that saw it either (EDIT - meaning the folks I know, that I witnessed witnessing it /EDIT).
It really showed in the on foot sections though, which looked bad despite limited environmentss and were host to some of the most unrewarding gameplay I've spent money on in recent years.
It really showed in the on foot sections though, which looked bad despite limited environmentss and were host to some of the most unrewarding gameplay I've spent money on in recent years.
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nintenho said:
Yes, because Gamecube's 24 MB of RAM definitely wasn't enough for bumpmapping....?
That said, it would still be interesting to see just what difference the lower fillrate requirements and doubtlessly highly efficient architecture of the Revolution will make at 640x480. And of course, when it comes to a game like UT, we can see what kind of difference the controller makes.
I thought Rebel Strike's on-foot sections were exceedingly boring and visually unappealing, and all but a few flight levels not designed particularly well. I don't recall any major glitches in the flight levels, though...they cleaned up the self-shadowing glitches from the previous game. I did think the Death Star attack mission in the A-Wing, the first mission on Yavin IV, the speeder bike chase, and the AT-ST missions all looked fantastic. But on average, I felt the co-op version of Rogue Leader with the new graphics engine looked better than most of the missions in Rebel Strike. On a technical level, anyway, there's a ton going on. It's easily one of the most effects-heavy games this generation, especially considering the framerate. RE4 looked good, but weirdly enough, the graphics engine seemed to be getting better as the levels progressed...the first 2/3 had no AA, but the military base looked smooth.
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nintenho said:
Dont know what are you talking about in the first sentence, as ingenu said Rev specs had not been released yet, personally I do care very little about bump/normal/paralax... mapping and it should be one of the best ways to show how much different it is the console from the others from controls, online, gfx and maybe features if it indeed end up with (eg) one microphone (see my sig) or any other Rev feature yet to reveal.
Plus I said hoping.
PS I am remembering know that sometime ago they had a job to PS3, XB360 and Rev using UE3, althought some said that sometimes in this ads things are not certain.
Eagle-Vision
Regular
Gameplay wise, it really lacked, that's true. On a technical level however, it's far superior than anything else on the GCN.function said:
Couple of things I was really hoping ofr this gen from graphics.
1. Nicer cleaner presentations from games. No jaggies for example.AA and AF being used extensively, FFS I was playing PC games 3 years ago, with 4XA and 8XAF, you would think by now it would be standard on consoles.
2. More extensive use of real time lighting and shadows. Realy adds to the depth and dimension of 3d games.
3. Most importantly....detail. All those little touches that can bring a game world alive. Birds, bugs,realistc weather system with things like dynamic wind rain, sun clouds etc. Little eices of garbage, etc . Alltose little touches that immerse you in the game world and make it seem that much more real. Create a world that exists regardless of my presence and input.
Unfortunately all the power so far seems to be being used to produce just higher res version of games we are already playing with these dead empty game worlds.
1. Nicer cleaner presentations from games. No jaggies for example.AA and AF being used extensively, FFS I was playing PC games 3 years ago, with 4XA and 8XAF, you would think by now it would be standard on consoles.
2. More extensive use of real time lighting and shadows. Realy adds to the depth and dimension of 3d games.
3. Most importantly....detail. All those little touches that can bring a game world alive. Birds, bugs,realistc weather system with things like dynamic wind rain, sun clouds etc. Little eices of garbage, etc . Alltose little touches that immerse you in the game world and make it seem that much more real. Create a world that exists regardless of my presence and input.
Unfortunately all the power so far seems to be being used to produce just higher res version of games we are already playing with these dead empty game worlds.
function said:
Whoa there function! Let me clarify, I was referring to the feature-list utilized, & definitely not the gameplay. The on foot animation was horrific, bland, & limited with regards as to what you could do gameplay-wise. The flight missions were definitely better, but the fixed camera annoyed me at times, nonetheless it was a showcase of the GC's power & potential. The lighting engine is the Cube's best, 2nd I give the nod to RE4. Overall, RE4 surpasses this where it matters by miles, (the gameplay) & boasts some impressive technical highlights & visuals as well.
Eagle-Vision
Regular
The soft shadows covering the forest (and everything on it) while subly moving around are really amazing. Can't wait to see more of Lair >_<Li Mu Bai said:
Li Mu Bai said:
Yeah, the feature-list reads well but the end result wasn't impressive to look at IMO. Perhaps the subject matter didn't give it a great deal of scope though. I agree entirely with your views on the gameplay, but what the game was rendering didn't match up to the impressive sounding engine.
ninzel said:
These points you make ninzel hit the proverbial "nail on the head." Two developers currently excel in this regard, Aounuma's Zelda EAD team, & Kojima's KCEJ-W Metal Gear team. They bring out the more subtle details that most developers wouldn't, due to their immense creativity. This leads to much more immersive worlds imo, an example of this would be in TP. As there are chickens in the village, there are also cats waiting in ambush to pounce upon them. The posters in SOL's lockers, Snake catching a cold, unnecessary background & game details to be sure, though these are the very aspects that deserve more attention. Here's some older ones from TWW as well: (some credit to ShadowCattivvi)
-At night at a high vantage point, stare straight up into the sky using the fp view. At least a dozen constellations are visible (the Big Dipper and Orion's Belt are the only ones I could identify as true to life, the rest were created for Hyrule)
-The closer you zoom the camera in while sailing, the stronger the sea current will sound.
-The arrows' trajectories are obviously directly affected by wind. Shoot one straight into the air in any outside area, it'll sway depending upon the wind's direction at the time.
-Arrows will stick into certain surfaces, while not others. You can shoot arrows into soft ground, carpet, and wood, and instead of bouncing or ricocheting off, they'll remain protruding out, fully retrievable.
-If you swing the Deku Leaf while wearing the Iron Boots, Link won't budge from the recoil.
-You can also Leaf bombs that you have thrown. Throw a bomb towards a Moblin, then give it an extra gust of wind so that it rolls directly into him.
Amongst so many other details, there was clearly quite a lot of effort put into this game despite all the flack & criticism it received. RE4 has quite a few as well, Ashley's panties for example. I bring up TWW specifically because TP is supposed to be paying very close attention to these such details, & expanding upon them much further, though now in a more realistic manner. I've been told cryptically of some interesting aspects. I also salivate on what Kojima will bring us with MGS4.
Eagle-Vision said:
Indeed it was, one of my various jaw-dropping scenes from RSIII.
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Li Mu Bai said:
Protecting his NDA I guess.
And with a lot of shaders I supose.
BTW completely agree with you ninzel, I would love to see D3/Q4 shadows in everything (depending on the art) and a lot of life in games too, about the first I doubt you will need the be worried as in that department GC games (at least exclusives) are the best.
Li Mu Bai said:
I really can't comment on this without getting specific.
It does remind me of the outrage when Gamecube specs were published out of the developer docs by IGN. The number of people who argued that they must be wrong and from early docs, was somewhat amusing. Not that I'm saying IGN is accurate or not this time, just that they have in the do have pretty solid sources, although they can get enthusiastic in their interpretation of their sources.
Nintendo really isn't trying to compete in power terms, they are playing a very different game, in my mind it's an interesting strategy and it'll be interesting to see how it plays out.
With litterally >10x the number of polygons/frame and much more complex shaders some people find it hard to differentiate between Xbox and X360. IMO Graphics is getting towards the end of it's tenure as the primary factor in selling games (Note didn't say it was over). The question is how much power is enough to create excellent visuals and does Revolution have enough? I guess the market will decide.
FWIW I'm unconvinced by the revolution controller, it's a bit too gimmicky for my tastes, but I thought the same thing about DS and I really like the Kirby game.
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