Sony PlayStation 5 Pro

[babybumb]

That GT7 res count is brutal. Native 4k on PS5 without ray tracing all the way to 1080p with PSSR to 4k on PS5 Pro, all for a single ray tracing effect (+ the cost of PSSR). On the PS5 the replays are native 4K at 30 fps with higher quality ray tracing too.

Not really. 4k (1080p) DLSS performance is pretty much needed for 60fps on 3070 or 4070 in Forza unless the RT is set really low quality..

 

[iroboto]

You think optimizations for 5Pro will benefit Series X even tho it has significantly less TOPs?

Not that particularly. More like, the model is good enough to run off compute units which don’t run in parallel to rendering, so if there is sufficient time for it, a different model could conceivably run on series X.

It is that way today for fsr3 for instance, except FSR3 doesn’t take any advantage of the DP4A of XSX. but we have a strong signal that PSSR could be using that and some (if running on CUs). The main advantages here by 5Pro would be the dual issue combined with sparse format support giving it 4x the capability.

I’m 50-50 on it, you can math out compute units to be able to generate 300TOPS for sparse format support into silicon, but XDNA may also be small enough to be integrated into the chip.

I really don’t know, I’m leaning towards the latter, but it looks like we have to wait to know the truth of this one.

TLDR: XSX could have a better model than FSR3, but not better than PSSR. But if PSSR requires XDNA, I don’t think there is any chance we will see custom scaler from MS.

 

[Proelite]

A 320 bit bus and 720GB/s would have been a game changer. Shame like the PS4 pro the BW is again disappointing.

 

[Charlietus]

Not really. 4k (1080p) DLSS performance is pretty much needed for 60fps on 3070 or 4070 in Forza unless the RT is set really low quality..

The new Forza isn't the best example to make a comparison to GT. Maybe it's gotten better with patches, I don't know.

We are talking 2-3x higher ray tracing performance and 45% more power, so you would expect the hit from it to be much more contained.

If you think about it, at PS5 settings, it's probably running at 4k native at 85-90 frames. Those are the heaviest 1080p reflections ever made by man

At this point, unless the games at launch are really different, we are looking at Turing levels of ray tracing.

Even if at the end of the day, the final image quality is what matters, no matter the numbers.

But it's hard to not be negative about this console, but they decided to price it like this, so their loss.

 

[snc]

 

[techuse]

The new Forza isn't the best example to make a comparison to GT. Maybe it's gotten better with patches, I don't know.

We are talking 2-3x higher ray tracing performance and 45% more power, so you would expect the hit from it to be much more contained.

If you think about it, at PS5 settings, it's probably running at 4k native at 85-90 frames. Those are the heaviest 1080p reflections ever made by man

At this point, unless the games at launch are really different, we are looking at Turing levels of ray tracing.

Even if at the end of the day, the final image quality is what matters, no matter the numbers.

But it's hard to not be negative about this console, but they decided to price it like this, so their loss.

Mark said PS5 Pro can trace rays at 2 and sometimes 3 times as fast. That particular step is only 1 aspect of RT and is almost certainly still being done on the shader core. I doubt there is any bespoke hardware to offload those calculations. People were expecting way too much.

I don’t know where those res numbers are coming from, but if true it seems likely PSSR is also running on the shader core.

 

[Charlietus]

By what I'm seeing, I'm not buying this console unless I can find it at a fair price (550~) used. The PS5 is still good, even if of course the graphics of Nvidia sponsored games and heavy rt games are going to struggle a bit.

Sony isn't Apple or Nintendo, and thank God the internet isn't going easy on them.

 

[Remij]

In the past having the higher input resolution often crowned a console the more powerful, given everything else the same... in the future, the winner will be who can render at the lowest input resolution while producing a similarly satisfactory result through their upscalers.

 

[Charlietus]

Mark said PS5 Pro can trace rays at 2 and sometimes 3 times as fast. That particular step is only 1 aspect of RT and is almost certainly still being done on the shader core. I doubt there is any bespoke hardware to offload those calculations. People were expecting way too much.

I don’t know where those res numbers are coming from, but if true it seems likely PSSR is also running on the shader core.

From the leaked documents 8 months ago, it takes 2ms to upscale from 1080p to 4k. If it was just running on the shaders, it would be much heavier. That is more or less in line with fsr 2 on PS5.

 

[techuse]

From the leaked documents 8 months ago, it takes 2ms to upscale from 1080p to 4k. If it was just running on the shaders, it would be much heavier. That is more or less in line with fsr 2 on PS5.

That doesn't preclude the possibility of it running on the shaders. We have no idea how heavy or light the model is.

 

[Charlietus]

That doesn't preclude the possibility of it running on the shaders. We have no idea how heavy or light the model is.

Admittedly, I'm not even sure how it all works and the right terminology to use.
For example, to me, running on shaders is the model PS5 uses, so FP 16 calculations. And since PS5 pro supports 300 Tops INT 8, that's additional hardware to make the calculations. But I'm not sure.

 

[techuse]

Admittedly, I'm not even sure how it all works and the right terminology to use.
For example, to me, running on shaders is the model PS5 uses, so FP 16 calculations. And since PS5 pro supports 300 Tops INT 8, that's additional hardware to make the calculations. But I'm not sure.

FP generally just refers to a fractional number and the 16 specifies that it is limited to 16 bits of memory. The shaders can run virtually any type of math, performance will just vary based on what the hardware is designed to do.

 

[GLS28R]

As expected, PSSR is better than FSR but not as good as DLSS. A comparison with XeSS would be interesting.

 

[Scott_Arm]

pssr looks quite good but let be honest, you wont have good reprojection from 864p. Remember when xss was supposed to be 1440p console and now we are with ps5pro and 864p internal, ps5/xsx absolulty worst generation ever

But ps5 pro won't be upscaling from 864p. It'll be upscaling from something higher than that. With Alan Wake 2 60 fps mode, I'd guess something like 1080p, assuming other visual improvements. 1080p to 4k should be fine.

Pretty sure PS5 (regular) was something like 864p at 60 fps. Very unlikely that isn't increased.

 

[snc]

But ps5 pro won't be upscaling from 864p. It'll be upscaling from something higher than that. With Alan Wake 2 60 fps mode, I'd guess something like 1080p, assuming other visual improvements. 1080p to 4k should be fine.

Pretty sure PS5 (regular) was something like 864p at 60 fps. Very unlikely that isn't increased.

DF counted 864p in Alan Wake and new Assasin. Looks like they just changed fsr to pssr. Tough maybe early version (see Remedy dev comment I posted)

 

[Scott_Arm]

DF counted 864p in Alan Wake and new Assasin. Looks like they just changed fsr to pssr. Tough maybe early version (see Remedy dev comment I posted)

Odd choice. Biggest problem on console is imagine quality. PSSR would have to be miraculous to make up for that. I guess they're just pushing the graphics even further.

 

[Dictator]

Is this true?

View attachment 12033

I really dislike that this video is being talked about before release, but this post (wherever it is from) is full of it. PSSR was easy to count which is why we stated that multiple times, which means its reconstruction is failing more readily.

 

[Charlietus]

I really dislike that this video is being talked about before release, but this post (wherever it is from) is full of it. PSSR was easy to count which is why we stated that multiple times, which means its reconstruction is failing more readily.

Without seeing the episode, you would think that the PS5 Pro can barely keep up with the PS5 by what people are saying on the internet.

Also, people wanting native 4k in 2020 :/

People wanting native 4k in 2024 :/

 

[Charlietus]

Wait. I thought the PS5 Pro was supposed to run Quality modes at 60fps by default.

Here we still see 2 modes and with Rachet and Clank it's running the Performance RT mode just at higher res?

It depends on the intention of the developer. They can do whatever they want, there are no obligations.

I'd also imagine that by release, things will have improved, even if I don't expect miracles.

 

[Nesh]

It depends on the intention of the developer. They can do whatever they want, there are no obligations.

I'd also imagine that by release, things will have improved, even if I don't expect miracles.

What is the intention of the developer other than to have the best possible result on screen?

If the developer chooses lower settings to achieve 60fps it means that the power is not there. Quality mode in R&C has RT and higher settings than in Performance RT, just at 30fps.