Digital Foundry Article Technical Discussion [2018]

[Cyan]

Still impressive looking game, just comparing to top end games like HZD, GoW and Origins its not that long away from it, i mean over 10 years difference. What if developers would create something like the first Crysis again, not limiting to consoles. Imagine a Crysis 2018 on a core i9, Titan V, 64gb ram

maybe we will never see that, perhaps in the VR space, but other than that.. if we don't discover a 4th dimension. Quake 1, Unreal 1 and Crysis were the biggest leaps in the history of 3D graphics.

Yup. My PS4 was quite loud, my PS4 Pro is really quiet. My PC, also water cooled, is also really quiet. The exception to both is during hot summers when the ambient temperatures are high in the UK and the cooling systems go into overdrive to shift heat that really can't be shifted. Bless them.

Well, I think you dont know what's hot there in the UK. Hot weather can have many meanings depending on where you live. I am from one of the rainiest, if not the most rainy place in my country and I am sure it's warmer than the UK..

Would love to go there someday, but I've had my fair share of UK these last days. My neighbours and my mom seem to be fascinated by the english royal family, they liked Diana and so on, so we had a very extensive coverage of the royal wedding in the media. I am a republican, so yeah, stressful times. Long live David Attenborough.​

 

[see colon]

Why not just buy a TV for pc use? Cheaper and its the same thing, pc in the living room isnt anything strange anymore.

Sort of the same. The color space is different for most consumer PCs, response times are generally worse, and real refresh rates ate usually lower. I don't think I've ever seen a TV with 1ms response time, for example. The long and short of it is, TVs are cheaper because they don't support the features PC monitors do. You can get away with 8ms response times and limited color space on a TV because watching movies and playing games with a controller is more tolerant to those limitations, and the cost savings of using slower, less accurate panels allow you to have larger screens for the same or lower price.

 

[DuckThor Evil]

Sort of the same. The color space is different for most consumer PCs, response times are generally worse, and real refresh rates ate usually lower. I don't think I've ever seen a TV with 1ms response time, for example. The long and short of it is, TVs are cheaper because they don't support the features PC monitors do. You can get away with 8ms response times and limited color space on a TV because watching movies and playing games with a controller is more tolerant to those limitations, and the cost savings of using slower, less accurate panels allow you to have larger screens for the same or lower price.

Well these new expensive HDR-monitors won't be 1ms in response time either and the 1ms TN panels aren't very accurate either. TV's are cheaper mostly because of economies of scale, not because of the features. Once HDMI 2.1 TVs roll out, high end gaming monitors have hard time justifying these kind of prices. You basically need a bigger than 27" screen for 4k anyway.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

Considering that TN panels have a hard time attaining good color coverage, accurate colors, good black levels, high contrast, etc. I'd be amazed if a good HDR TN panel ever comes out, assuming HDR is possible on a TN panel in the first place.

Regards,
SB

 

[Cyan]

PC has an HDR support problem - and Nvidia wants to fix it
Are extreme spec 4K displays the answer?

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2018-how-nvidia-aims-to-address-pcs-hdr-problem

At the forefront of gaming technology pretty much since the year dot, the PC format has fallen behind in one key area: support for high dynamic range - the future of display technology. HDR screens for PC users are thin on the ground and often poorly specced, while the list of supported games stands at less than 50 per cent of the number found on consoles. Something has to change, and it starts by getting excellent PC desktop monitors out there. This week, Nvidia showed press its highly impressive 120Hz 4K HDR G-Sync technology. The specs of two upcoming HDR screens from Acer and Asus exceed what living room displays are capable of by quite a margin in some respects, and may help in beginning to address the lacklustre HDR take-up we've seen for PC users so far.

PC's lack of traction in HDR is something of a vicious circle. Consider Sea of Thieves by Rare - it features one of the most striking HDR implementations we've ever seen, enhancing the game's distinctive visuals considerably. However, it's only an option for Xbox users - there's no HDR support whatsoever on the PC side. On checking in with the developer about this, we were told that the lack of compatible displays meant that implementing it wasn't a priority. It's an excuse that frustrates us because, of course, PC is just as compatible with living room HDR displays as the consoles, but the divide between the living room and the den/office - each with their own type of display - is still, clearly, a thing... for now, at least.

View attachment 2590

Extreme specs with prices to match, the Acer Predator X27 (left) and the Asus ROG Swift PG27UQ. 4K, HDR, G-Sync, 144Hz - these are the best of the best in terms of core functionality.

This 49" curved 32:9 monitor (3840x1080p) looks really good to get the HDR experience and ultrawide screen, along with Freesync 2.

https://www.techspot.com/review/1633-freesync-2-hdr-impressions/

 

[vipa899]

maybe we will never see that, perhaps in the VR space, but other than that.. if we don't discover a 4th dimension. Quake 1, Unreal 1 and Crysis were the biggest leaps in the history of 3D graphics.

You never know, didnt expect Crysis either to happen. But like it allways has been, PC gamers welcome the higher FPS, resolution and higher settings in multiplat games.

Yup. My PS4 was quite loud, my PS4 Pro is really quiet. My PC, also water cooled, is also really quiet. The exception to both is during hot summers when the ambient temperatures are high in the UK and the cooling systems go into overdrive to shift heat that really can't be shifted. Bless them.

My pc gets louder too (but not that much hotter) when its summer, we have quit high temps here in Sweden now, warmer then usually in may. My ps2/ og xbox dont get louder at all whatever the ambient temps are

 

[Cyan]

My pc gets louder too (but not that much hotter) when its summer, we have quit high temps here in Sweden now, warmer then usually in may. My ps2/ og xbox dont get louder at all whatever the ambient temps are

How high is high, there?

You never know, didnt expect Crysis either to happen. But like it allways has been, PC gamers welcome the higher FPS, resolution and higher settings in multiplat games.

It's nowadays when those differences are higher than ever. 4k vs 900p(typical XB1) 1080p (typical PS4), and 30 fps vs whatever fps you throw at your PC. That wasn't usual in the previous gen.

Of course, maybe a console like the 360 when when it was 3 years old got surpassed by a PC which cost many hundreds of €, but I can assure you that having seen Mass Effect, Gears of War, GTA 4 or Bioshock in a powerful PC and in a 360 you really have to be a fan of the pixel so you could notice the improvement of resolution, the best texture here or there or the best filter implemented in this or that part.

 

[vipa899]

How high is high, there?

Its been everything between 22 to 28c here with reports saying 30. Thats really warm, for mid-sweden in may. Can get really warm in the room my pc is, GPU temp can be as high as 68 but then gpu fan speed is up to 70%, and thats everything but silent. Dont have a PS4 but i assume it gets louder too if in a room thats close to 30c.

It's nowadays when those differences are higher than ever. 4k vs 900p(typical XB1) 1080p (typical PS4), and 30 fps vs whatever fps you throw at your PC. That wasn't usual in the previous gen.

Of course, maybe a console like the 360 when when it was 3 years old got surpassed by a PC which cost many hundreds of €, but I can assure you that having seen Mass Effect, Gears of War, GTA 4 or Bioshock in a powerful PC and in a 360 you really have to be a fan of the pixel so you could notice the improvement of resolution, the best texture here or there or the best filter implemented in this or that part.

Yeah true, its the exclusives that set the consoles apart, not the graphics. Its like the PS2 days... think PS4 is like the PS2 with many sucessive games and large install base, it does alot better then the PS3 atleast. Personally for me its not worth it, all the exclusives are nice but they are mostly single player which means play one time and thats it for me. That and most of its exclusives dont really attract me, only HZD seems nice to me, should really be multiplat, like all games so everyone can enjoy them, it shouldnt matter if you play pc, ps4 or xbox or switch. But that wont ever happen.

 

[chris1515]

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2018-detroit-become-human-tech-analysis

 

[ultragpu]

Astounding rendering engine, been waiting to see what a game that sacrifices scope while injects everything into graphics quality would look like on the PS4 and with HDR at that.

 

[OCASM]

There was a GDC presentation on its rendering tech if anybody is interested. It's on the GDC Vault.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

State of Decay 2: Xbox One X looks better than S - but frame-rate is lower
Undead nightmare?

 

[Cyan]

Its been everything between 22 to 28c here with reports saying 30. Thats really warm, for mid-sweden in may. Can get really warm in the room my pc is, GPU temp can be as high as 68 but then gpu fan speed is up to 70%, and thats everything but silent. Dont have a PS4 but i assume it gets louder too if in a room thats close to 30c.

surprisingly warm for the north. Yes. I am from the Iberian Peninsula -southern Europe, and here temps are in the low 20s, and cloudy/rainy-. They say the rainiest part of the iberian Peninsula is in the north of Portugal. And in my country I live in the rainiest place -or so they say-.

Not DF news but UK news. It is AI (love this topic) related. The UK fears that robots could learn military tactics from videogames. The same algorithms that lead to super computers to defeat the best Go players in the world could learn unstoppable military tactics.

Collecting resources and creating a good army is the basis of "Starcraft" (Blizzard) .

http://www.lavanguardia.com/tecnolo...teligencia-artificial-guerra-reino-unido.html

 

[Jay]

State of Decay 2: Xbox One X looks better than S - but frame-rate is lower
Undead nightmare?

Strange they never locked it to 30 on both systems.
On base Xbox, should've scaled res up not framerate.
Although framerate is fine on the X it just gives a bad perception with the base running at higher average framerate, just strange all around.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Strange they never locked it to 30 on both systems.

We've seen this issue with both Pro and X, which goes to show that as much much effort that Microsoft and Sony put into making scalability across performance profiles a priority, it still requires some work, or perhaps, just maybe, it's a conscious decisions by devs to prioritise fidelity over frame-rate.

Let's watch the next few patches and see.

 

[Riddlewire]

If you can't even match the quality of a 1997 PS1 effect (lens flare), then you should leave it out of your game.

 

[Jay]

We've seen this issue with both Pro and X, which goes to show that as much much effort that Microsoft and Sony put into making scalability across performance profiles a priority, it still requires some work, or perhaps, just maybe, it's a conscious decisions by devs to prioritise fidelity over frame-rate.

Let's watch the next few patches and see.

base model framerate goes pretty high though.
The 1X seems more consistent at 30.
Base model could've done with better fidelity than framerate

Sure it would've been nice to have options on the 1X, but it seems solid as is. Just missing being locked

 

[zed]

If you can't even match the quality of a 1997 PS1 effect (lens flare), then you should leave it out of your game.

Haha Its quite jarring, what were they thinking?

 

[Niebotskick]

 

[function]

Strange they never locked it to 30 on both systems.
On base Xbox, should've scaled res up not framerate.
Although framerate is fine on the X it just gives a bad perception with the base running at higher average framerate, just strange all around.

Base X1 res may have been capped at 900p due to esram size. Perhaps they chose not to spend their limited resources on going beyond this, even though - with 30 fps as the target - it would often have been able to do this.

X1X avoids the low points of frame rate that X1 has (into the teens with stutters as low as 120 ms or 7.5 hz), as DF say due to the faster CPU, but it's clearly targeting 30 fps with its resolution scaling. Pity they weren't just a little more aggressive with that and offer a 30 fps cap. This would be a good example of where adapative sync would be a real boon.

Good to have concrete comments that the faster CPU is useful for higher res asset streaming in this game.

That X1 lens flare is comical.