Next-Gen iPhone & iPhone Nano Speculation

[anexanhume]

Its a bit more than just that but i agree Apple does have their own ARM license and could essentially do whatever they felt they needed

the Tegra 3 shadow core is still an A9 just built on a LP process

I know I'm glossing over architectural details.

And thanks for correction. I believe the 5th core was thought to be an A8 at some point.

 

[ams]

Ipad mini will use dual core A9 CPU with SGX543MP2 graphics, fabricated on 32nm process and priced at $299 for the 16MB version. The iphone 5 GPU will be a more powerful variant than that used on ipad mini.

 

[ams]

On a side note, it appears that Apple products will not use 28nm [TSMC] fabrication until 2013. So expect dual A15 + dual A7 (big.LITTLE) CPU with PowerVR 6 series GPU in ipad 4 in 1H 2013.

 

[french toast]

On a side note, it appears that Apple products will not use 28nm [TSMC] fabrication until 2013. So expect dual A15 + dual A7 (big.LITTLE) CPU with PowerVR 6 series GPU in ipad 4 in 1H 2013.

I would second that..although I think they will go with dual cortex a15s @ 1.5ghz and a single cortex a7.

I think they will drop the quad channel memory interface for expense and go with dual lpddr3....on 28nm hkmg and all brand new efficient parts that thing will be a serious bit of kit....

 

[anexanhume]

No reason for dual A7. Also, will A7 even be ready for 2013? No one is talking about it. I would expect it in H2 2013 and I think that's a stretch.

 

[Pressure]

The standalone Cortex-A7 is in the 2013 timeframe but could be before as big.LITTLE in tandem with Cortex-A15.

 

[ams]

No reason for dual A7. Also, will A7 even be ready for 2013? No one is talking about it. I would expect it in H2 2013 and I think that's a stretch.

With dual A15 + dual A7, they can advertise it is as quad-core CPU (since all four CPU cores can be active at the same time). And let's not forget that Apple gets what Apple wants, for the most part :smile:

 

[anexanhume]

There's always a 2 year+ lead time from when ARM announces a core to it being available in a consumer device. A15 was announced in September of 2010 and Apple unveiling a A15 on their A6 CPU is the only way we'd see it available before September. Supposedly Exynos 5250 is ramping, but vague Note 2 rumors are all we have.

A7 was announced just last October. Not even a year yet.

With dual A15 + dual A7, they can advertise it is as quad-core CPU (since all four CPU cores can be active at the same time). And let's not forget that Apple gets what Apple wants, for the most part :smile:

I don't think it makes sense. If the task is heavy enough to turn on two A7's, just use one of the A15 cores.

 

[wco81]

Battery life isn't hasn't been a big problem for iPads.

So does it really need a big.little configuration in exchange for the performance hit? Will UI actions be as snappy on the A7?

 

[Jubei]

Battery life isn't hasn't been a big problem for iPads.

So does it really need a big.little configuration in exchange for the performance hit? Will UI actions be as snappy on the A7?

iOS performance is more about GPU imo. I think dual Cortex A7s should be plenty for minor tasks

http://images.anandtech.com/doci/4991/Screen Shot 2011-10-19 at 12.30.25 PM.png

 

[ams]

I don't think it makes sense. If the task is heavy enough to turn on two A7's, just use one of the A15 cores.

Sure, there are different ways to implement a companion core, but Arm is actually the one advocating pairing two A15 with two A7: http://forums.arm.com/uploads/monthly_10_2011/blogentry-107443-007238600%201318978692_thumb.png , http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-rOU9gFXtK...nalyst-Presentation_FINAL+%282%29_Page_09.png

One way or another, ipad 4 will have at least 4 CPU cores in total. I just cannot imagine anything less.

 

[french toast]

If only apple licenced their A6....

I cant believe Samsung isn't going with big little with 5250...really interested to see Mali t604 in action....who would habeas foretold Mali 400 thrashing all before it.

 

[Jubei]

If only apple licenced their A6....

I cant believe Samsung isn't going with big little with 5250...really interested to see Mali t604 in action....who would habeas foretold Mali 400 thrashing all before it.

Most likely because big.little wont be available for the timeline Samsung has planned for Exynos 5250.

5250 will probably be used for their upcoming 11 inch tablet so they can fit a large battery in it to compensate the increase in power consumption. You have more limitations with a smaller device so big.little will be more important for smartphones imo

 

[Mike11]

The standalone Cortex-A7 is in the 2013 timeframe but could be before as big.LITTLE in tandem with Cortex-A15.

Aren't A7 designs expected to show up as early as the end of this year?

ARM’s Cortex A7 will be available in 1 - 4 core configurations, both as the primary CPU in an SoC as well as in a big.LITTLE configuration alongside some A15s. ARM expects that we will see some 40nm A7 designs as early as the end of next year [2012] for use in low end smartphones (~$100). Most smartphone configurations, even at these price points will likely use dual-core A7 implementations. It’s only in emerging markets that ARM is expecting to see single core Cortex A7 smartphone devices.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/4991/...alcore-more-power-efficient-highend-devices/2

 

[anexanhume]

Aren't A7 designs expected to show up as early as the end of this year?


http://www.anandtech.com/show/4991/...alcore-more-power-efficient-highend-devices/2

Expectations don't determine actual availability. Dates people put out there always precede actual availability. Also notice it's talking about stand-alone A7 designs. Designing a heterogeneous CPU architecture with A15 and A7 cores is not as straightforward as a simple A7 alone.

 

[Lazy8s]

IMG provided a business update in a recent disclosure where they mentioned one of the upcoming Rogue SoCs was already in silicon. I assumed that's Apple (and could be wrong) considering ST-Ericsson's troubles, so I'm guessing Apple is capable of delivering A6 for a late 2012 launch of a new iPhone yet still believing the A6 SoCs won't actually launch until the new iPad in early 2013.

32nm A5s and A5Xs will power their remaining iOS line-up this year.

 

[anexanhume]

IMG provided a business update in a recent disclosure where they mentioned one of the upcoming Rogue SoCs was already in silicon. I assumed that's Apple (and could be wrong) considering ST-Ericsson's troubles, so I'm guessing Apple is capable of delivering A6 for a late 2012 launch of a new iPhone yet still believing the A6 SoCs won't actually launch until the new iPad in early 2013.

32nm A5s and A5Xs will power their remaining iOS line-up this year.

I think that's a reasonable assumption. I have to imagine Apple is anxious to get Rogue on a chip to get rid of the big 543MP4.

It's also important to remember that codenames for the purported A6 started showing up in February, so if that's the Rogue chip, it could be ready for iPhone too. We'll see.

 

[wco81]

Are there iOS6 features which would benefit from better graphics? Maybe the Maps with the 3D.

Anyways, there are already complaints about the rumored iPhone design being too similar to the iPhone 4/4S. Henry Blodgett says it could be a disaster for Apple, as iPhone owners don't bother to upgrade because the design isn't different enough.

 

[anexanhume]

Are there iOS6 features which would benefit from better graphics? Maybe the Maps with the 3D.

Anyways, there are already complaints about the rumored iPhone design being too similar to the iPhone 4/4S. Henry Blodgett says it could be a disaster for Apple, as iPhone owners don't bother to upgrade because the design isn't different enough.

I haven't heard any complaints about maps on the beta with the 4S. People even have it working on the 4. However, you never known want exclusive unannounced feature this iPhone will get. My bet is NFC rather than some fancy software feature a la Siri.

The same owners that didn't upgrade to the 4S in record numbers because it looked exactly like the 4?

The purported design is a marriage of the original iphone design that people loved and the new iphone 4 design. It doesn't have the glass back that people complained about and it has a larger screen. The only legitimate complaint I imagine will be people saying the screen didn't grow enough.

 

[ltcommander.data]

32nm A5s and A5Xs will power their remaining iOS line-up this year.

So is 32nm A5X for the iPhone 5 likely? It seems a little early to refresh the iPad 3 with a 32nm A5X, even with a silent update, without causing a large PR stir with early buyers.

I think that's a reasonable assumption. I have to imagine Apple is anxious to get Rogue on a chip to get rid of the big 543MP4.

It's also important to remember that codenames for the purported A6 started showing up in February, so if that's the Rogue chip, it could be ready for iPhone too. We'll see.

If Apple could release Rogue this year, would they do it without OpenGL ES 3.0 support? While references to what is thought to be the A6 has shown up in iOS 6 there's been no reports of OpenGL ES 3.0 references. With the Haiti spec not yet finalized and the conformance tests probably still in flux, I doubt there's enough time between now and a September launch to prepare certified drivers. I suppose Apple could launch Rogue this year on iPhone with OpenGL ES 2.0 and enable OpenGL ES 3.0 in iOS 6.1 alongside the iPad 4 launch, although that probably wouldn't be as strong a Rogue introduction as IMG would like.

Anyways, there are already complaints about the rumored iPhone design being too similar to the iPhone 4/4S. Henry Blodgett says it could be a disaster for Apple, as iPhone owners don't bother to upgrade because the design isn't different enough.

As anexanhume said the lack of glass back, different aspect ratio, and larger screen size are pretty distinct changes if evolutionary. The change in position of the front camera also means people will tell them apart even looking directly at the front of the device. LTE elevating it into the 4G product bracket will also set it apart from the iPhone 4/4S and drive upgrades.