XBox One and Windows 10 Programs [UWP, X0, W10]

Discussion in 'Console Industry' started by Cyan, May 2, 2015.

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  1. ToTTenTranz

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    Are we 100% sure of this? Is this related to using different services here and there or do you have any idea of the percentage of lines of code that have changed between one and the other?
     
  2. liquidboy

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    im just saying, ignoring xbox one, that Windows 8 is immensly different to Windows 10 .. from Kernel, wddm, dx12, driver model all the way up thru frameworks, store, appmodel and even to the application frameworks winrt/xaml/winjs and with objc/java projections now ..

    honestly from what ive heard it sounds like lots of the code that the os team and services team built for xbox one made its way into windows 10, and so not only will the greater windows community (desktop/mobile/hololens/perceptive pixel/iot etc) get these BUT it will also arrive to xbox one once desktop is released..
     
  3. Rikimaru

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    I do not think kernel is very different. wddm maybe. Application frameworks is a mess now most likely.
    Xbox team stripped Win8 on other hand. And OS is still a mess.
     
  4. iroboto

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    It's much easier now in Windows 10 to create and deploy a universal app compared to Windows 8. Coding for it is about as hard as making a html tag. You are essentially wrapping the program in "device" tags so that it operates differently in each control and layout scheme.
    This was harder to do with Windows 8 universal apps where there were separate code bases for each type of device you were targeting.
    It will be interesting to see what people do with universal apps. I think most commonly you will see a lot of mobile games, and extensions of applications being shown on Xbox. I'm not entirely sure I would use Xbox as a productivity device, but it is nice to know the option does exist.
     
  5. Davros

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    So does xb1 support any hid compliant device?
     
  6. AzBat

    AzBat Agent of the Bat
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    As with most USB devices on Xbox hardware: YMMV. Won't know until you test it. What you have in mind?

    Tommy McClain
     
  7. shredenvain

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    No Phil has already hinted that some franchises will stay Xbox exclusive like Forza and Halo.
     
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  8. fehu

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    Does universal app that run on desktop run for sure on hololens and one? Or is the developer for example able to port a game to desktop / tablets, but marking it incompatible to the one in the manifest? (for exclusivity maybe)
     
  9. Rikimaru

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    They need to mark it being compatible. With hololens without controls and xbone gamepad there will not be a lot of cross apps.
     
  10. fehu

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    I'm not so sure, but at least with kinect you can emulate touch without any code modification
     
  11. iroboto

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    Consider universal apps like directX features. One code base but if device like this also do this. If device does that do it like that.

    That means one program can easily be deployed to all devices but you won't want the same functionality on all of them just due to the input output nature of each device. Compatibility is already accounted for if the device is Windows 10. You can code features that would not exist in every device and during compile time you will be hit with a warning, but it is still allowed. You can limit the platforms on the store IIRC.

    The universal platform runs contained and has less resources available: as such it limits the fidelity of the games that can run in it. You will be operating with half CPU cores and 8 or less CU AfAIK.
     
    #31 iroboto, May 5, 2015
    Last edited: May 5, 2015
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  12. Davros

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    Wheels and joysticks
     
  13. Davros

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    They way it was explained to me is you compile your code but you do not get 1 exe that runs on all platforms but several exe's . One for pc, one for xbox ect
     
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  14. powdercore

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    Where are you getting these info? Windows 10 uses WDDM v2 instead of v1.x that moves to the GPUMMU model and away from the IOMMU model. All the new stuffs are presented here: https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/hardware/dn894184(v=vs.85).aspx

    This is what allows MS to do heterogeneous multiadapter with DX12. In fact, DX12 requires WDDM 2.0. Then you have the new WinRT that supports a ton more APIs. Windows 10 is what linked everything together.

    What does application frameworks is a mess mean? App framework for Win 10? Win 8? For XB1?
    What does OS is still a mess mean? How so? Where is this info come from?

    http://blogs.windows.com/bloggingwindows/2015/03/18/developing-for-the-windows-10-device-platform/

    [​IMG]
     
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  15. Arwin

    Arwin Now Officially a Top 10 Poster
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    I assume you'll be able to list supported features and hardware similar to how you do that with apps now - you register what they use/need permission for (e.g. GPS, etc.) Other than that though, I'm curious to see what we can do. I've just installed Windows 10 and Visual Studio 2015 RC on an old Core 2 Quad though.
     
  16. Cyan

    Cyan orange
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    Exclusives are essential for the soul of a console. Some forumers have pointed out at times that they wouldn't mind having current console exclusives on the PC, and other platforms too. But then if all the games were programmed as multi, we could all buy a PC or a console and that would be it, hence if you like variety exclusives are necessary, like dragging people to your product, offering something different not everyone can enjoy (say Gran Turismo, F-Zero, Forza...).

    That's one of the reasons emulators are so popular, because the games were running on different hardware, and that's fun and offer a challenge for those creating the emulators.

    Hopefully some of the cross apps are going to be emulators in the future.
     
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  17. Shifty Geezer

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    Which is ideal for MS as then they can drop the difficult hardware market and cash in from other people's (PC IHVs) hardware running their OS. Hence reasons to keep XB1 titles exclusive are limited. If the hardware is profitable, or the games make more money than their PC counterparts (likely very true) would it make sense.
     
  18. dobwal

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    I imagine MS will employ a mix of the two. Halo maybe too valuable to the Xbox platform to give up while something like Forza (which has already been somewhat ported to DX12) has less impact on console sales and might be more valuable as a Xbox/PC title.

    Better to weigh exclusivity based on the strength of the IP. Some IPs may be strong enough to sell hardware (Xbox One) while some maybe more suited to selling PC gamers on the Xbox PC ecosystem.
     
    #38 dobwal, May 6, 2015
    Last edited: May 6, 2015
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  19. Scott_Arm

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    I don't know. As long as you have to buy it through the Windows Store, and they get their cut, I don't know if they'd care if you played it on Xbox or PC. Just my interpretation. It's not like you'd see Forza and Halo for sale on Steam. All of this looks to me like Xbox Two is going to be just one avenue for experiencing gaming on Windows1X, just like the Surface is one of many Windows tablets.
     
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  20. Silent_Buddha

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    Hardware could be profitable as well. Look at Apple or Microsoft's own Surface.

    It could be that they are going to try to turn the Xbox brand into low cost living room PC/console that can play games basically as well as a competitor's console. All for the same price as the competitor's console.

    There are still benefits with the software licensing revenue for Xbox games (and I'm assuming apps). As well as benefits from having a living room presence. Although it may be arguable whether a living room experience is as valuable as it was 5-10 years ago with the de-emphasis of television with the plethora of mobile devices and methods of getting visual media.

    Regards,
    SB
     
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