Xbox Live: six million users

[Tap In]

and all we know for sure is that Microsoft wont give the exact figure of its members who have Gold Subscription.

I really don't think that matters to them in the larger scheme of things.

As long as some gamers feel it's reasonable to pay for their online gaming (which helps subsidize the other services and software and servers etc) then the larger picture is the D/L content that anyone can just log on and get at any time. there is no "active vs. non-active" wrt Silver (free) membership. Once they activate the online portion, they (and their families) are prospective customers for the hundreds/thousands of pieces of micro-transaction material available (as well as having free access to the other online features).

 

[DemoCoder]

exactly. comparing 200 million userbase to less than 10.4 million userbase is not fair.

Irrelevent. Console users have less choice than PC users. Can they sign up a competiting online service? Can they run business applications? Buy an XBox360, and Live is pretty much your only choice to get online content into the box or play online.

The PC market has more choice and is more segmented.

 

[Jesus2006]

Number of subscriber is not a very good measure. It raises questions on how many "One Month Trial ones" who never continued after trial, etc, etc. Even the article mentions that Microsoft is silent about such statistics

I wonder how many people with mutliple accounts were counted in, everybody i know (including myself) has at least 2 some even 3 live (silver) accounts.

 

[Tap In]

I wonder how many people with mutliple accounts were counted in, everybody i know (including myself) has at least 2 some even 3 live (silver) accounts.

probably about the same as those with only one silver account but share it in the same family. so probably a wash.

 

[wco81]

It does matter how many are paying.

Paid subscriptions are a part of Microsoft's business model, and how they differentiate themselves from competitors.

They're saying, we're offering a premium online experience that people will pay for.

So how many have taken them up on that offering?

Need to also learn about the churn rate and so forth. Also useful would be median time playing online per user and how long a subscriber continues to pay.

X360 is more identified with online than either the PS3 or the Wii. How many people are playing online games (meaning they're paying) will be a useful metric compared to similar numbers for the other two consoles.

 

[Tap In]

They're saying, we're offering a premium online experience that people will pay for.

you're missing the point that a great proportion of the those premium features offered are FREE with Silver.

Only online play is pay and evidently most do not have a problem with it. those that do, go elsewhere to play online. No biggie.

 

[scooby_dooby]

that 70% is an estimate of how many user a/c have downloaded from Xbox Live arcade. It is not a figure for active subscribers. Because for those 70% are they still active ? is that 70% during life of Live Service ? If an a/c downloads one arcade content and is inactive now , thats counted isn't it ?

Who cares? If they logged in, and downloaded content, they have made use of the Live! service, and shown that they value it. In the end, that's all that MS is aiming to do, demonstrate the value of Live.

As far as why it's an estimate, that's obvious. Single users who use multiple accounts, multiple users who use single accounts, and the fact that new people sign up/login daily make it impossible to give a n exact number.

 

[scooby_dooby]

It does matter how many are paying.

Paid subscriptions are a part of Microsoft's business model, and how they differentiate themselves from competitors.

It's a part, but a part of their business model is also offering an abundance of free content to their users, to add value to the hardware. In addition, they have other sources of revenue that do not require subscription, such as DLC, and Movie/TV downloads.

I don't really see why it's important to find out how many are gaming online, though it would be interesting. Most interesting though, is "How many people are taking advantage of this free service?", that gives you a lot of insight into the overall demand for online services.

 

[Rainbow Man]

I don't see why anyone ought to care about how many live users there are. It's just not interesting - except to micirsoft beancounters of course and maybe an xbot here and there who are still fascinated with epeen sizes.

I have a live acocunt and my console logs in on it every time I turn it on. That's as much attention as I give it really. Ony time I 'value' the whole Live thing is when there's some new interesting title from the arcade to download but those have been scarce for months now. I'm still waiting for worms and castle crashers and that Jeff Minter game whatsitscalled. No I'm not much of a streetfighter or mortal kombatant unfortunately.

When those hits the arcade I'm sure I'll buy more points. Until then the whole live network might just as well not exist for me personally.

Peace.

 

[Nesh]

exactly. comparing 200 million userbase to less than 10.4 million userbase is not fair.

That figure includes XBOX owners too I think

 

[wco81]

Ask MS which kind of subscribers they would prefer, paying or non-paying.

Odd thing is, you would think downloading costs them more to support than online play. Downloading requires hosting and bandwidth whereas online play, unless they're hosting dedicated servers, is just a handoff for peer-to-peer play, right?

Would Silver account holders be allowed to download at all if they didn't have any microtransactions?

That's another thing which would be interesting to know, the breakdown in revenues between subscriptions and microtransactions. They don't have to give actual numbers, even percentages would be helpful.

You know that when they present about the state of the video game business, people will want to know about XBL revenues, profit/loss.

 

[Sis]

Ask MS which kind of subscribers they would prefer, paying or non-paying.

Odd thing is, you would think downloading costs them more to support than online play. Downloading requires hosting and bandwidth whereas online play, unless they're hosting dedicated servers, is just a handoff for peer-to-peer play, right?

Would Silver account holders be allowed to download at all if they didn't have any microtransactions?

That's another thing which would be interesting to know, the breakdown in revenues between subscriptions and microtransactions. They don't have to give actual numbers, even percentages would be helpful.

You know that when they present about the state of the video game business, people will want to know about XBL revenues, profit/loss.

You need a point to your post. Let me give you some examples:

1) Given that online system Y has N number of subscribers, Xbox 360 numbers are poor.
2) Given that game console maker has N number of users, Xbox 360 numbers are poor.
3) Given that the Xbox Live system costs X and subscribers only account fo Y of that amount, Microsoft is losing money...

Whichever you pick, it'd have to be better than, "Yeah, but wouldn't Microsoft prefer to have more?"

 

[wco81]

I was responding to the claim that it doesn't matter how many of those 6 million subscribers are paying.

That's an incredible claim.

I would find it hard to believe MS or Wall Street doesn't care.

6 million is only meaningful if most of those are paying. If they're counting free Silver accounts, why isn't that closer to 100%?

Plus isn't their goal to have at least 50% of the installed base be paying subscribers? Pretty sure they've publicly expressed that, in the context of only 10% of the Xbox installed base being XBL subscribers or 10% attach ratio.

 

[ninzel]

Would it be impressive to say that 6/10 people who walk into a bar on a Friday night bought a drink? I see nothing surprising or impressive about a system that is built and heavily marketed around connectivity,attracting people who would then go online. Especially now when a large portion of the services and content are free.

 

[Sis]

Would it be impressive to say that 6/10 people who walk into a bar on a Friday night bought a drink? I see nothing surprising or impressive about a system that is built and heavily marketed around connectivity,attracting people who would then go online. Especially now when a large portion of the services and content are free.

So by your analogy, everyone buys a 360 to go online. Except 40% decide once they have it that they instead opt not to "buy the drink"?

 

[crystalcube]

Would it be impressive to say that 6/10 people who walk into a bar on a Friday night bought a drink? I see nothing surprising or impressive about a system that is built and heavily marketed around connectivity,attracting people who would then go online. Especially now when a large portion of the services and content are free.

Thats a seriously flawed analogy.
Because thats not what microsoft is saying ... in similar analogy .. if Microsoft was running bar they would say..

We have had 6 million visitors since we opened our bar in 1992. We cant tell you how many actually paid but of all those visitors atleast 70% ( estimate ) have at least had one drink each. We know many have used the dart board and people generally have fun. But we dont want to tell who are regular visitors or among the new visitors who will be visiting us regularly.
Oh and by the way we are the only bar in town for the moment ... the other bar is still under construction

 

[Corwin_B]

6 million is only meaningful if most of those are paying.

Wrong. Before going Gold, I used Silver a lot for buying DLC : I spent on DLC (Live Arcade Games) more than a full year's worth of Gold membership. So Silver can be a great source of revenue. Also, you have to factor in the various untangible benefits for MS of the Silver accounts, such as good SW attach rate driven by downloadable demos and Achievements.

If they're counting free Silver accounts, why isn't that closer to 100%?

Because many people won't even connect the thing to the Internet in the first place ?

 

[pipo]

Wrong. Before going Gold, I used Silver a lot for buying DLC : I spent on DLC (Live Arcade Games) more than a full year's worth of Gold membership. So Silver can be a great source of revenue.

Yup. Some other stats:

Xbox LIVE Marketplace:

* Consumers have quickly jumped to the Xbox LIVE Marketplace as their one-stop download center. More than 70 percent Xbox LIVE members are downloading content from Marketplace, driving more than 135 million downloads since the launch of Xbox 360.

...

* Gamers have also quickly adopted the new Microsoft Points stored value system, with more than 5 Billion points activated on Marketplace to date.

* Online entertainment through Xbox LIVE is not just limited to games. Xbox 360 is the only console offering movie and TV downloads, and the new Xbox LIVE Video Marketplace is packed with HD content from top partners such as Paramount, MTV Networks and CBS. As a result, nearly 50% of Xbox LIVE members in the U.S. log into Xbox LIVE Marketplace every time they turn on their console.

Xbox LIVE Arcade:

* Xbox LIVE Arcade has been an instant hit on the Xbox 360, with nearly 70% of all connected consoles already downloading and playing Xbox LIVE Arcade titles.

* Xbox LIVE Arcade has now surpassed 25 million downloads from its diverse library of original development and classic titles from the world’s best independent and established developers and publishers.

From: http://gamerscoreblog.com/team/archive/2007/03/06/542176.aspx

I'd guess the number of Gold subscribers still is on the low side (half of the 70% they're referring to?). They need to add more exclusive features, discounts or a massive hit to get that number up IMHO.

Having said that, I think MS is very happy with the performance so far.

 

[wco81]

Well, MS needs to break down the revenues between Gold subscriptions and microtransaction payments.

And again, between Gold microtransactions versus Silver microtransactions.

The number of people who log on is no more meaningful than the number of people who use Google but never click a single ad or sponsored research result.

The thing about some pay DLC is that it could cannibalize shrink wrap sales.

So is it right to call it a part of online revenues?

 

[assen]

Well, MS needs to break down the revenues between Gold subscriptions and microtransaction payments.
And again, between Gold microtransactions versus Silver microtransactions.

And maybe open up their entire intranet, and publish the source code for Windows, Office and Halo in the process?