What would have been the reason for MS not adding hdmi to first 360s

[NavNucST3]

Aren't all 1080p DLP sets wobulated right now also? I'm not sure how I feel about that and the 1080p designation, but hey it works out I guess.

STOP FOLLOWING ME!



I don't know about all of them, but they still look damn good.

When I was looking at TVs last year, there was a huge demand for the HP (of all TVs) because the 65" was one of the first (if not the first) to actually accept 1080p, even though there were "many" 1080p sets already on the market.

 

[RobertR1]

If you really want to champion HDMI and HD in general, make sure your set can receive native 1080p/24 and runs upto 120hz thus giving you all the desirable multiples. Don't worry these are coming.....

Until then you're aren't really "HD" enough I wonder when "deep color" will replace HDMI as the next buzzword.

 

[btdvox]

You do know that there's a ton of HDTVs out there that don't accept 1080p over HDMI, right? Many of those do, however, accept it over VGA and component.

I definately want to see some comparisons to substantiate that claim. For LCD monitors, those with DVI inputs often skimped on the analogue electronics for the VGA input. Monitors with only VGA inputs, especially the earlier models, had image quality indistinguishable from DVI.

What TV's dont use 1080p over hdmi? At the store I work at almost every TV that is there needs HDMI for 1080p otherwise it wont even run it.....Im pretty sure thats because of HDCP...

The "HDTV's" That dont use HDMI and use vga or component (i dont think component only vga) are LCD Monitors for like a Computer.....

 

[NavNucST3]

What TV's dont use 1080p over hdmi? At the store I work at almost every TV that is there needs HDMI for 1080p otherwise it wont even run it.....Im pretty sure thats because of HDCP...

The "HDTV's" That dont use HDMI and use vga or component (i dont think component only vga) are LCD Monitors for like a Computer.....

I think you missed the where we were talking about 1080p TVs that don't ACCEPT a 1080p input, it was not uncommon for the first 1080p tvs, read up on it. I believe you are thinking output.

 

[Dave Baumann]

In light of the issues that Sony are having with regards to scaling and compatibility, it seems to me that MS's primary effort on the display side was compatibility. On the one side you have Sony pushing for the latest output specification, which has caused some issues with older HDTV sets, while on the other MS put aside the very latest specifications whilst creating an output system with high compatibility with new and old sets.

 

[RobertR1]

I still wanna know what part of the HDMI1.3 spec Sony adopted and what got left behind. From recollection, it's not full HDMI1.3 more of a 1.2a+

 

[Farid]

Thread Title Edited

Thread title changed and thread moved to the general Console Talk forum seeing that the discussion is barely technical (if the thread turns technical, it will be moved again back to the Tech forum).

 

[aaaaa00]

The pins on the 360's A/V output are all accounted for. There is no digital video signal on these ports and there aren't enough spare pins to add it.

Last I heard there were still a few unknown pins that appear to serve no function (21 and 23).

The 360 already shares pins between VGA and component video out: pins 3,4,7,8,11,17,19 do different things depending on the mode selected by the output dongle you use, there's no reason the hardware couldn't be designed to multiplex another set of outputs onto existing pins.

All it takes is 2 pins -- connect these and you could in theory cause the xbox to reconfigure the existing output pins.

But who knows for sure.

 

[btdvox]

I was under the impression that hdmi 1.3 only added Dolby TruHD-

 

[RobertR1]

I was under the impression that hdmi 1.3 only added Dolby TruHD-

Quite a bit more actually:
http://www.hdmi.org/press/pr/pr_20060622.asp

..thus my curiousity on what is included and what is left it.

 

[Randell]

2, we would get superior picture quality since hdmi sends digital signals

That is just too broad a statement to be completly true. Many displays look better with component or equal. It purely depends on the display and the quality of the internal electronics as to what looks better.

 

[Hardknock]

I would rather have a scaler than a digital connection any day of the week.

Being all digital is the reason why PS3 doesn't scale from my understanding.

 

[London Geezer]

I still wanna know what part of the HDMI1.3 spec Sony adopted and what got left behind. From recollection, it's not full HDMI1.3 more of a 1.2a+

Where did you read that?

If Sony advertises HDMI 1.3 and then it turns out it's not actually 1.3, they could be in trouble. I'm pretty sure PS3 has a proper HDMI1.3 port.

 

[patsu]

I still wanna know what part of the HDMI1.3 spec Sony adopted and what got left behind. From recollection, it's not full HDMI1.3 more of a 1.2a+

PS3 includes v1.3a. Sony has a compliance test lab for HDMI v1.3a even.
http://www.cdrinfo.com/Sections/News/Details.aspx?NewsId=18951

I would rather have a scaler than a digital connection any day of the week.

Being all digital is the reason why PS3 doesn't scale from my understanding.

I thought people are saying scaling happens only in the digital domain ?

 

[Zassk]

The pins on the 360's A/V output are all accounted for. There is no digital video signal on these ports and there aren't enough spare pins to add it.

Some of the pins on the A/V connector are digital. Is there any reason to think that those pins cannot be reprogrammed to output video signals (e.g. upon detection of an MS HDMI dongle)?

The chip that drives the A/V connector has a flashable firmware, so the only question is whether enough digital pins are available to transport a video signal to a dongle, right?

Is there any other limitation that I'm missing?

 

[London Geezer]

Being all digital is the reason why PS3 doesn't scale from my understanding.

Scaling is always digital. The reason Ps3 doesn't scale has nothing to do with it "being all digital", which it isn't since it does have analog output too. The reason is simply that it doesn't have a scaler like the 360 does (which is digital by the way).

 

[GB123]

Current 360 will never output a digital feed as it doesn't have a TMDS unit.

The reason 360 doesn't have this is the same reason the PS3 doesn't have an internal scaler, cost.

The next revison could very well include one though (Lost Planet JP bundle for example

Almost all new and future 1080p sets will have 1080p via component at least from Samsung, Pansonic and Toshiba, i think the new bravia sets are supporting it too.

If you were one ofthose people who bought a first gen 1080p set you should have known what you were getting yourself into.

 

[Dave Baumann]

Current 360 will never output a digital feed as it doesn't have a TMDS unit.

TMDS isn't needed. For instance, all that is needed to incorporate a Silicon Image HDMI transmitter is for the either Xenos or the scalar to output an SDVO signal. It wouldn't surprise me if this is how the output from Xenos to the Scalar/display chip is already carried [Note: I don't actually know that myself].

 

[Zassk]

Almost all new and future 1080p sets will have 1080p via component

Hopefully the same will be true for 1080p via VGA 1:1.

 

[scooby_dooby]

If you were one ofthose people who bought a first gen 1080p set you should have known what you were getting yourself into.

if you bought a first gen 1080p TV then odds are it doesn't accept 1080p anyways, instead it deinterlaces 1080i.