Uncharted 4: A Thief's End [PS4]

[Warchild]

I also posted this in the moblur thread: https://forum.beyond3d.com/threads/...plementations-spawn.57607/page-2#post-1898634

ND is almost certainly using an AA similar to the Unreal Engine 4 temporal super sampling used in the demo a boy and his kite. Although it's an improved version of that, not nearly as much ghosting and the errors aren't as obvious. The result is IQ that looks super sampled at the expense of some ghosting.

It could explain why the game doesn't look 900p at times

http://i.cubeupload.com/iUD2d1.png
http://i.cubeupload.com/a2lzSW.png

This implementation is gonna look crazy in 1080p just like infamous ss.

 

[bunge]

There are over 100 threads dedicated to Crysis on these forums. Perhaps the discussion of that game should go to one of those threads instead?

 

[Clukos]

There are over 100 threads dedicated to Crysis on these forums. Perhaps the discussion of that game should go to one of those threads instead?

I agree that this discussion should be kept in the appropriate topic, that's why i made a thread about remastered games instead here: https://forum.beyond3d.com/threads/...d-on-current-gen-consoles-or-pc-ps4-x1.57650/

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Crysis comparison removed. A quick Google of Crysis images shows they're two very different games with a notably different aesthetic and no intelligent comparisons can be made between a brute-forced solution from 10 years ago and an advanced shader technique in operation now.

Anyone wanting to identify weaknesses in UC4's rendering needs to refer to more comparable material that actually, you know, looks the same. A little more humulity when they're making a bit of an ass of themselves also wouldn't go amiss.

14:18

Look at the objects next to Helena and pay attention to how long it takes the specularity to be fully rendered.

That's what NX Gamer was claiming it was adaptive tessellation, lol.

1) That's not front and centre. My eyes were on Elena and I didn't even notice the issue until playing through several times, staring at Nate and then Elena, realised you were talking about the scenery.

2) It's a year old preview build.

You can't really use that in support of your view in response to Warchild that ND are spreading their rendering over several frames for 'front and centre' material. I believe we already discounted NX Gamer's analysis so why raise it here?

 

[Clukos]

Oh by the way, i said i believe it's some sort of selective screen space lod without providing any examples. Sped up to like 200% to make it extremely obvious, footage from PSX (now in webms!):

Scene after changing camera position, notice left to Nadine: http://gfycat.com/OrganicCreepyIcterinewarbler

About 5 seconds later, notice the specular reflection and the guy & glass in the background: http://gfycat.com/WaryMindlessBass

If you noticed, main characters don't exhibit any issues or lod changing, that's why i believe it is selective. Screen space stuff should be obvious :smile:

You can see the entire scene here at 16:40, 17:26 for that specific example:

I think it's a smart use of resources, and can't be easily noticed during normal play.

 

[L. Scofield]

Crysis comparison removed. A quick Google of Crysis images shows they're two very different games with a notably different aesthetic and no intelligent comparisons can be made between a brute-forced solution from 10 years ago and an advanced shader technique in operation now.

Anyone wanting to identify weaknesses in UC4's rendering needs to refer to more comparable material that actually, you know, looks the same. A little more humulity when they're making a bit of an ass of themselves also wouldn't go amiss.

So what exactly are you defining as "comparable material" because apparently two photorealistic open, jungle settings aren't close enough.

But then again style is not even relevant since my reply to Clukos was about scope, specifically in regards to shadow rendering.

1) That's not front and centre. My eyes were on Elena and I didn't even notice the issue until playing through several times, staring at Nate and then Elena, realised you were talking about the scenery.

2) It's a year old preview build.

You can't really use that in support of your view in response to Warchild that ND are spreading their rendering over several frames for 'front and centre' material. I believe we already discounted NX Gamer's analysis so why raise it here?

If that aspect of the game has changed since the preview build you can post evidence of it. Otherwise it's perfectly relevant.

Perhaps the claim "front and center" is exaggerated but the fact the effect is perfectly visible on close objects during a simple cutscene remains.

As for NX Gamer's claims, it's a good example of how easily misinformation is spread by fanboys.

Oh by the way, i said i believe it's some sort of selective screen space lod without providing any examples. Sped up to like 200% to make it extremely obvious, footage from PSX (now in webms!):

Scene after changing camera position, notice left to Nadine: http://gfycat.com/OrganicCreepyIcterinewarbler

About 5 seconds later, notice the specular reflection and the guy & glass in the background: http://gfycat.com/WaryMindlessBass

If you noticed, main characters don't exhibit any issues or lod changing, that's why i believe it is selective. Screen space stuff should be obvious :smile:

You can see the entire scene here at 16:40, 17:26 for that specific example:

I think it's a smart use of resources, and can't be easily noticed during normal play.

Instead of a selective SS filter, perhaps ND artists simply apply less taxing temporal shaders to objects they consider less important than the main characters. That explains why in the E3 2015 shot with Elena some objects display the temporal effect while others not even though they're at the same distance from the camera.

 

[Clukos]

Instead of a selective SS filter, perhaps ND artists simply apply less taxing temporal shaders to objects they consider less important than the main characters. That explains why in the E3 2015 shot with Elena some objects display the temporal effect while others not even though they're at the same distance from the camera.

Maybe, but i still think it's done in screen space as you can see the guy changing lod only after Sully moves about.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

So what exactly are you defining as "comparable material" because apparently two photorealistic open, jungle settings aren't close enough.

The discussion is ended here.

As for NX Gamer's claims, it's a good example of how easily misinformation is spread by fanboys.

Like we need to be informed of that? Try holding a (on topic) discussion with the people in the room instead of someone who's not present. Especially in a game discussion thread instead of the NX Gamer thread etc.

 

[Clukos]

Uncharted related easter egg in The Division: http://gearnuke.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/the-division-uncharted-1.jpg

 

[Globalisateur]

Uncharted related easter egg in The Division: http://gearnuke.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/the-division-uncharted-1.jpg

Nate Dragon... Wanted for questioning involving high-profile museum thefts

The stolen painting:

 

[L. Scofield]

The discussion is ended here.

So, no definition of "comparable material" then. What a surprise.

Like we need to be informed of that? Try holding a (on topic) discussion with the people in the room instead of someone who's not present. Especially in a game discussion thread instead of the NX Gamer thread etc.

I'm not holding a discussion with NX Gamer. I'm using NX Gamer's assessment of Uncharted 4 as a point of discussion in an Uncharted 4 thread

 

[Clukos]

The stolen painting:

That was too easy

Two additional examples of lod from PSX (gfycat creates some very interesting url names )
http://gfycat.com/BronzeUnfinishedGrizzlybear
http://gfycat.com/SpanishAgitatedCrustacean

Both start from 1st frame after complete camera position change

Edit: More examples to support my hypothesis (goin' all scientific method )

Embedding a 400kb gif

Lights and specular highlights are easy to spot but same thing happens to the chair and buildings, stationary objects are rather easy to spot if you know what you're looking for. When objects are moving it's really hard to notice though. Oh and the images separately if anyone wants to check them:
http://abload.de/img/1uksys.jpg
http://abload.de/img/2suson.jpg
http://abload.de/img/3xosad.jpg

Witcher 3 and Umbra middleware related stuff

Spoiler

If memory doesn't fail me i think Witcher 3 did something similar, although a bit simpler? I can remember things popping in and out when camera changed positions in cutscenes specifically.

Edit: I remembered correctly and did some research, Witcher 3 is doing this

using Umbra 3 and this is probably why Witcher 3 is so reliant on mem bandwidth on PC (as seen in almost every DF video covering memory bandwidth), interesting.

Presentation by CDPR: http://twvideo01.ubm-us.net/o1/vault/GDC2014/Presentations/Bushnaief_Jasin_Solving_Visibility_In.pdf

 

[ultragpu]

GDC 2016 is happening today isn't it? Will we get infos on UC4 at all?

 

[Clukos]

GDC 2016 is happening today isn't it? Will we get infos on UC4 at all?

http://schedule.gdconf.com/session/...atter-of-substance-presented-by-allegorithmic
http://schedule.gdconf.com/session/technical-art-culture-of-uncharted-4

Not sure if we actually get any info. Unless they make it public of course, which usually takes some time.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

GDC 2016 is happening today isn't it? Will we get infos on UC4 at all?

Most of Naughty Dog's past post-mortems (available in the GDC Vault) came after each game's launch. I guess in part because it's easier to talk about a game that most of the audience have played/finished. Plus you don't need to worry about spoilers or leaks

 

[Clukos]

The shaders in some of these scenes... Holy shit. Like the previous one though, out of context spoilers so beware.

 

[Warchild]

paging clukos for comparisons also interesting we might be getting the triangle count for drake!
Edit: Huh 46, 48k only?

 

[Clukos]

Images

Amazing looking scene in gif (webm actually): http://gfycat.com/SociableDenseHyrax

 

[Warchild]

tris: 48571 if i'm reading it correctly

 

[Clukos]

First comparison gif with PSX 2014: