Thinking of trading in the 350Z...

[Frank]

ABS is all that saved my ass!

Strangely enough, with ABS you don't stop sooner, but rather you kan keep on steering the car. And when you start sliding, you can't do that either.

About the only things you can do when you start sliding is letting it come to a stop, or throwing the wheel and pounding the gas pedal.

 

[digitalwanderer]

I didn't have room to drop it in gear and hit it, I'd have bashed someone. The thought did cross my mind for a brief but maniacal millisecond though.

Filled her up with gas (she was empty on fumes) and she seems to handle better. My wife took the Pathfinder to work tonight since me and the kids don't need it and it's supposed to snow some more.

 

[RussSchultz]

Strangely enough, with ABS you don't stop sooner, but rather you kan keep on steering the car. And when you start sliding, you can't do that either.

About the only things you can do when you start sliding is letting it come to a stop, or throwing the wheel and pounding the gas pedal.

ABS skates the edge between stop and slide, which lets you stop quicker.

 

[Sage]

it's supposed to snow some more.

what the heck is this "snow" you speak of?

 

[Moloch]

ABS skates the edge between stop and slide, which lets you stop quicker.

You heard of threadhold braking?
You can stop sooner by disabling most abs system as they kick in too soon.

And as an interesting reminder I had this morning, 4 wheel drive does NOT help you stop any better one tiny little bit.

I took off from my house, went 10 feet and started to brake for the stopsign, turned sideways and stopped centimeters from the bumper of the caddy in front of me.

GOTTA take it easy in the winter.

If anything, a 4WD car stops later since it adds weight.
4WD /AWD cars dont corner any better than RWD (worse for 50:50 splits i.e FWD based like dsms) and they of course dont help you stop quicker (as you now know), just let you hit the gas sooner, and in actual racing you only leave a few MPH faster, it's more about stability.

 

[Sxotty]

If anything, a 4WD car stops later since it adds weight.
4WD /AWD cars dont corner any better than RWD (worse for 50:50 splits i.e FWD based like dsms) and they of course dont help you stop quicker (as you now know), just let you hit the gas sooner, and in actual racing you only leave a few MPH faster, it's more about stability.

NOOOO! The horror the horror!
Quick remember friction is proportional to the normal force and the coefficient of friction between tire and road/ice whatever.

SOOOO the more the vehicle weighs the greater the friction.

In other words the stopping distance has nothing to do with the vehicle weight and everything to do with the quality of the brakes.

 

[Moloch]

NOOOO! The horror the horror!
Quick remember friction is proportional to the normal force and the coefficient of friction between tire and road/ice whatever.

SOOOO the more the vehicle weighs the greater the friction.

In other words the stopping distance has nothing to do with the vehicle weight and everything to do with the quality of the brakes.

But the brakes have less weight to slow down?

 

[_xxx_]

ABS skates the edge between stop and slide, which lets you stop quicker.

Actually the main point is to enable steering and prevent uncontrolled slip, it may as well make you stop later depending on the situation (weather, grip, road consistence, temperature etc. all influence the behaviour significantly).

What we have in modern ABS/ESP ECU's is all this and more:

• ESP
• Anti-Slip-Control (ASR)
• Engine-tow-momentum Control (MSR)
• ABS
• Brake Assistance (BAS)
• Electronic brake-momentum dispatching (EBV)
• Parameter steering (PML)
• hill-starting and startup assist

That's in the new M-Class, for example. The S-Class and similarly positioned competition have even more toys, but I'm too lazy to look that up right now.

 

[_xxx_]

what the heck is this "snow" you speak of?

Cocaine?

 

[_xxx_]

But the brakes have less weight to slow down?

And thus less grip. But its not all black and white anyway

 

[Moffell]

ABS skates the edge between stop and slide, which lets you stop quicker.

Hell no! That's a common misconception. ABS is a great system that helps people in a panic but it doesn't help you stop faster. I know this from actual tests with and without ABS.

You can test it yourself as well even with your ABS car on an icy stretch of road/parking lot. Try it first with the aid of the ABS by slamming the brakes. Then try it by gently braking almost as if you had an eggshell under the pedal. After a few tries you'll get it right and will stop faster.

 

[_xxx_]

Hell no! That's a common misconception. ABS is a great system that helps people in a panic but it doesn't help you stop faster. I know this from actual tests with and without ABS.

You can test it yourself as well even with your ABS car on an icy stretch of road/parking lot. Try it first with the aid of the ABS by slamming the brakes. Then try it by gently braking almost as if you had an eggshell under the pedal. After a few tries you'll get it right and will stop faster.

Or you just unplug the wheel sensors temporarely, one should suffice to disable ABS completely

 

[Moffell]

But the brakes have less weight to slow down?

Friction (ie tires and surface) and speed (living force/momentum or whatever it's called) determin the most how long your stopping distance will be. The weight of the car is next to inconsequensial to those two.

A good set of tires and low speed will see you through any traffic situation.

 

[Moffell]

Or you just unplug the wheel sensors temporarely, one should suffice to disable ABS completely

Well if you do it right the ABS won't kick in at all. The ABS is otherwise a good tell if it's slippery outside. When it starts pumping you know; Too fast, better take it easy. Of course then it might already be too late.


Edit: It's weird. My post count has been stuck on 103 for over a year it seems.

 

[_xxx_]

When it starts pumping you know; Too fast, better take it easy. Of course then it might already be too late. .

Sure, but it's got nothing to do with speed, it only works if you use the brakes. If you drive 10 mph and do a full brake and start slipping even a slightest bit, it'll kick in. But I think we're talking about the same thing and just use different wording

 

[digitalwanderer]

Edit: It's weird. My post count has been stuck on 103 for over a year it seems.

Posts in General, RPS&C, and Site Feedback don't count towards your postcount.

 

[Moloch]

Friction (ie tires and surface) and speed (living force/momentum or whatever it's called) determin the most how long your stopping distance will be. The weight of the car is next to inconsequensial to those two.

A good set of tires and low speed will see you through any traffic situation.

I've never seen a heavier car outbrake a lighter car in a race

 

[Frank]

Good tip in general: when you're about to hit something, or when you're about to enter a corner and don't think you're going to make it, slam the brakes for a moment, release them immediately and pull on the wheel. It might take a few tries to get it right (so experiment), but it does work very well.

The idea is not to slow down, but to get maximum traction on your front tires.

Edit: in all other cases it's better to ignore ABS and try to never floor the brakes.

 

[Frank]

4WD /AWD cars dont corner any better than RWD (worse for 50:50 splits i.e FWD based like dsms)

I think you should make a distinction between 4WD SUV's and AWD sedans/hatchbacks. I agree with you on 4WD SUV's, but not on AWD regulars. Those do corner much better.

Then again, AWD without very good suspension won't do much for that. But that seems to be a package deal for most AWD cars I know (and especially the Impreza).

 

[Sage]

Good tip in general: when you're about to hit something, or when you're about to enter a corner and don't think you're going to make it, slam the brakes for a moment, release them immediately and pull on the wheel. It might take a few tries to get it right (so experiment), but it does work very well.

The idea is not to slow down, but to get maximum traction on your front tires.

Edit: in all other cases it's better to ignore ABS and try to never floor the brakes.

I just hit the brakes and let my car figure it all out... and let me just say it's VERY good at stopping! Thank God for smart seatbelts that can vary the ammount of tenstion!!!