Sony Home - The official thread*

It's not the downloading that takes forever, it's the install process. But the download is definitely slower than it should be.

And I wouldn't say it's "my connection to Sony", because my connection is fine. I regularly download at 1MB/s from many sites. Maybe Sony is just really, really cheap or otherwise incompetent with their North American infrastructure (which honestly would not be surprising given that they are incompetent at making small patches rather than pushing down whole firmwares as well).

How exactly the size of firmware downloads, or the choice to go with a full firmware download instead of a patch, relate to incompetency?

Completely confused here.

Also, isn't it safer using a full firmware instead of a patch? Because patches have more room for error and corruption? Someone step in if I'm wrong here.
 
Any idea why one would choose to go that route? What benefits are there of doing it this way? I see negatives only.

How exactly the size of firmware downloads, or the choice to go with a full firmware download instead of a patch, relate to incompetency?

Completely confused here.

Also, isn't it safer using a full firmware instead of a patch? Because patches have more room for error and corruption? Someone step in if I'm wrong here.

From what I understand it is due to the type of memory it uses that requires the entire chip be erased and reprogrammed.
 
So, it's really nice to see the people on my friends list show up in home. :) Looks like it's off, and working, although people still had some trouble getting in obviously tonight. I'm sure this will smooth itself out over the weekend though. I'm pretty happy with Home so far, though I was hoping the new content would be in this week already, but apparently that'll be next week for Europe at least. That's fine of course for all the new people, because for them Home is new anyway, and then next week it'll have all these extra spaces. I'm very happy with how Home works for chatting, voice chatting, the way the avatars look, etc. Now it's a matter of getting everyone on board, and getting the game support also and build out this thing. Looking good so far though! I think Sony actually pulled it off, now it's a matter of keeping things going!
 
If the provider is the same as XBL, then they have a huge problem on their own side. XBL downloads (even the free Silver stuff) are significantly faster in Canada. Both when I lived on he west coast and now on the east coast.

The CDN provider runs the host you download your software from. Firmware updates are publicly available on the net. So, you don't have to hit the Sony servers for authentication. It's between you and the CDN provider only (plus the hops in-between). Even with a big file size, the download should be pretty fast.

I believe your problem happens during the install phase. My PS3 is in the office with super high bandwidth. I noticed I do finish installing faster than most people. I suspect the PS3 contact a Sony security server to validate every component within the install package. The security protocol may require 2-way exchange of information. Hence you could encounter longer delay when everyone else is busy downloading and installing other packages (e.g., Home).

I suggest next time you might want to try updating your PS3 during the lull period (if you hate to wait).

Really? I think if you look at how many firmware updates have come out and how frequently we get minor patches compared to Sony's competition, in addition to other stuff like how much resources the PS3 OS uses compared to the competition, it's fair to question their relative technical competence.

Yes within the same time frame, we also get major items released though (BD 1.1 and 2.0 with Java VM, upscaling DVD, DivX, DLNA, Life with Playstation, Folding @ Home, in-game XMB, Flash 9.0 with faster web browser, full screen YouTube support, and now Home). I don't think they can't deliver. I think they deliver too many fragmented pieces.

As for memory footprint, it's hard to argue now without the final numbers and the list of running components. It's fair to question anyone's technical competence but I think in this case it's also not difficult to see that they are competent, but may be swarmed. They often need UI help and a top level synergy though ^_^

I simply do not comprehend why the PS3 needs so many updates so often, and then on top of that each update takes an absurdly long time to download and install compared to the competition. I understand your angle on this will be "because they are adding new features all the time", which is true but if they were really competent organizationally and technically most of the features they've been adding should've been launched long ago, or at least bundled in larger updates that are less frequent. Additionally, most of the patches are of the "0.01" variety which largely fix bugs, not adding any significant features.

I don't know I can agree with "most of the patches are 0.01 variety" by looking at the updates so far.

Then there's other things like Home's absurd loading times and I really question the calibre of SCE's internal developers.

It takes up to 6-7 seconds to sync and load a 3D level. It is definitely troublesome but I won't call it absurd.

Sorry for the threadjack, it just annoys me to no end to sit down and want to play something and then just stare at my screen for 15 minutes while it updates to add full-screen Flash functionality which I never wanted or needed anyway. They need to be more respectful of their user's time and adopt a system that provides genuine patches hosted on capable infrastructures with regular, less frequent updates.

If my observation is correct (There was an earlier post between Shifty and me comparing our install time), the system may be heavily locked down.... just like that irritating plugin dialog in the web browser. It's not entirely about technical competence.
 
Any idea why one would choose to go that route? What benefits are there of doing it this way? I see negatives only.

Probably easier testing time since they have components from "all over the place". A fixed set of pre-configured packages are easier to QA.

That and they probably have other "more important" deliverables to attend to.

NavNucST3 said:
EDIT: Gonna wait until tomorrow...cant even get past the eulacheck.jsp

Yeah, that's what I do too. I turned off my PS3 right after updating it to 1.03. Will try tomorrow when things should be less crazy.

I expect the novelty to wear off quickly. Then I can take my time to poke around and check out games with proper Home support.



EDIT: Not bad for Titanio's Home: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=13964142&postcount=812

15rntsk.jpg


Looks like you may not need to queue for arcade games anymore (since you can place them in your own apartment).

The GAF folks are also thinking about pooling their money to set up a clubhouse.
 
I got a timeout on the UELA yesterday, but then got in eventually anyway in that same attempt.
 
Looks like you may not need to queue for arcade games anymore (since you can place them in your own apartment).

How can you get arcades in your home? I want them, lol.

I met a friend on friends list who I never talked to in HOME and we started to chat. Really cool. Well, he mentioned it was a sausage fest so I changed my avatar to a female and jesus. Someone screamed "**** it's a chic" and all these guys came over and started dancing with my avatar, asking where I was from, and saying Hi. I was laughing so hard, it was sad. I changed back to my regular avatar and the same guy screamed "it's a chic with a ****" and all the guys ran away :LOL:

I feel bad for the actual female users who are running around in HOME.
 
That'll pass soon enough, or at least it will die down. However, this is one of the things my wife likes best about Home, getting all the attention from men. Well, that and the shopping. ;)
 
Penny Arcade's impressions seem to mimic my own. Home really does seem to be DOA for most people...

http://www.penny-arcade.com/2008/12/12/

The Beta for Playstation home is now available to everyone, and now you know what I know: this is what happens when your marketing department tries to make a game. Here is everything you need to understand about Home, if you should accidentally launch it from your XMB: press and hold the Playstation button in the center of your Dual-Shock or Sixaxis controller. From the menu that appears, select Quit.

There are things about Home that are simply beyond my understanding. Chief among these bizarre maneuvers is the idea that, when manufacturing their flimsy dystopia, they actually ported the pernicious notion of scarcity from our world into their digital one. This is like being able to shape being from non-being at the subatomic level, and the first thing you decide to make is AIDS.

If you approach an arcade machine and there is a person standing in front of it, you will not be able to play it. Likewise, if you see people bowling and think that bowling is something you might like to do, you probably wont be able to. Unable to play arcade games like Ice Breakers and Carriage Return the first several times we logged on, these games had begun to take on an epic stature in our minds. These were gushing fonts of liquid fun, habit-forming and dangerous - for the good of our virtual society, the supply had to be controlled. When we were finally able to play them, we learned that they were the equivalent of browser games.

There is nothing about the experience of using Home to suggest that you are actually moving through a single, contiguous environment. It is very clearly a handful of walled off zones, where you are confronted by incessant load screens in a desperate search for stimulation. From the moment you enter one of their ultrahygenic "amusement regions," it's clear that all life has been burned away. You get the sense that this is a place in which no interesting thing could ever happen.

There is already a growing school of Home apologetics, fostered by the same Order of Perpetual Masochists who lauded the rumble-free Sixaxis at launch and suggested, hilariously, that Lair and Heavenly Sword were videogames. They're under the impression that because something is free, this places it on some golden dais beyond censure. It's no virtue to give away something that no-one in their right mind would buy. They have no idea what this world is for, and that ambiguity infuses every simulated millimeter of it.

This is the terrible secret that roils beneath their false universe: it is nothing more than a cumbersome menu, a rampart over which you must hoist yourself to accomplish the most basic tasks.
 
Penny Arcade's impressions seem to mimic my own. Home really does seem to be DOA for most people...

http://www.penny-arcade.com/2008/12/12/

Well, you really have to wonder what Sony's thinking. I got into the Beta months ago, tried it out, figured 'this could be okay', then left. Months later it's released... in the exact same state as before? And as I understand it's been like this for ages? The game needed content, tons of content. Clothes, customization items... stuff that just wasn't there. And no one ever pointed out that virtual lines are not a great idea?
 
Yeah, the project seems to be plagued by epic incompetence. The first 10 minutes I spent with Home I almost got a headache after all of the face-palms I kept giving myself...
 
There are things about Home that are simply beyond my understanding. Chief among these bizarre maneuvers is the idea that, when manufacturing their flimsy dystopia, they actually ported the pernicious notion of scarcity from our world into their digital one.
I wonder what's hard to understand.
It's about making random people interact in a social environment, otherwise this would be the worse game launcher ever.
What would be the point of putting games in a cumbersome interface if not the social interaction?
 
The only way to save home IMHO is to open it wide to developers, like Facebook and OpenSocial. Provide a simple authoring language so that anyone can build custom objects and attach scripting behavior, and place these objects in their home or club. Or get Media Molecule to include some poppet-like authoring tools for making stuff.

If you look at every successfully massively multiplayer VR, it relied on massive user generated content, going all the way back to MUDs in the early 80s.

If they simply restrict authorship to licensed developers, they're going to die.
 
Well, you really have to wonder what Sony's thinking. I got into the Beta months ago, tried it out, figured 'this could be okay', then left. Months later it's released... in the exact same state as before? And as I understand it's been like this for ages? The game needed content, tons of content. Clothes, customization items... stuff that just wasn't there. And no one ever pointed out that virtual lines are not a great idea?

I think their idea is to get third party developers to do Home content. If the latter drag their feet, they will be vulnerable. Sony should have taken matters into their own hands by manufacturing initial launch items (Where is Dress ?). The dev team promised fast updates in the Message of the Day but it would be hard for people to swallow after waiting for so long.

I wonder what's hard to understand.
It's about making random people interact in a social environment, otherwise this would be the worse game launcher ever.
What would be the point of putting games in a cumbersome interface if not the social interaction?

Good point, but I think they can do a better job in usability and still maintain the social interaction aspect.

The only way to save home IMHO is to open it wide to developers, like Facebook and OpenSocial. Provide a simple authoring language so that anyone can build custom objects and attach scripting behavior, and place these objects in their home or club. Or get Media Molecule to include some poppet-like authoring tools for making stuff.

If you look at every successfully massively multiplayer VR, it relied on massive user generated content, going all the way back to MUDs in the early 80s.

If they simply restrict authorship to licensed developers, they're going to die.

Yes ! Opening the evolution of Home to a larger pool of devs and users is the correct idea. If the devs are too slow, Sony needs to drop them (or at least don't rely on them). A cluttered world is better than a stagnant world.

I see that the Home environment has changed yet again. What's the point of tweaking the models if free Home items are still too few and fundamental features like game launching is not widely available ?

The streaming media is more interesting now and I see many more people online these days. With the current limited content, Sony can only rely on short term curiosity and chatters to sustain the interest. Better speed up the content development pace (or release the content dev tool to more parties).
 
Penny Arcade's impressions seem to mimic my own. Home really does seem to be DOA for most people...

http://www.penny-arcade.com/2008/12/12/

There is a relatively easy way to address their concern while keeping the current traits of Home. I made the suggestion late in the beta.

When you enter a space (e.g., Bowling Alley), Home should show a transparent "Home Acitivity/PULSE" panel before loading the new level. The "PULSE" panel should allow us to choose:

* Who we want to be with in the new Space (if said person is in the space), and

* What we want to do in the new Space (e.g. Bowl, Pool, ...)

Then find or generate a Space that allows us to do what we want.


If we let the panel idle, it should continue to auto fill with user (names) in the target Space. I should be able to phone these users right away using the Home phone service (selecting them from a list), and instantiate a new Space where necessary.

Finally allow the panel to be accessible from MenuPad anywhere. Essentially, I can navigate Home without the 3D UI. But whenever we want to, we can always instantiate a new Space and see each other. ^_^
 
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