mckmas8808
Legend
Sony financing about 40 EDI (download) games
- Thread starter Shifty Geezer
- Start date
Hmm... I'm still confused over this thread. The main reasons are:
(i) I can't find an official definition of eDI (and so I misunderstood people when they made specific comparisons between XBLA, PC Game Portal and eDI). On one extreme, eDI sounds like a horizontal backend initiatives/concept in Sony, subsuming various digital distribution efforts such as:
- Porting of Playstation emulators to other platforms (e.g., PCs) so that downloaded content can be playbacked on PCs, PSPs and PS3s.
- Mini-game purchase for PSP and PS3 (e.g., Calling-all-Cars)
- Back catalog distribution (of retro games) to PSP and PS3
- Music/Movie on demand to PSP and PS3
- Full-blown game content download (e.g., GTHD tracks and cars) to PSP and PS3
In this view, eDI comprises of a few consumer frontends (e.g., different eStores and clients), but is fundamentally a (soft) initiative.
On the other end, eDI is just a content (mini-game/music/movie) portal.
(ii) We seem to be talking about different domain (e.g., What Inane_Dork refer to as "fundamentally identical" may be "fundamentally different" to me).
e.g., [Not targeting Inane_Dork, but one of his posts illustrate our differences starkly]
Besides content similarity, there are other aspects that can differentiate services. At 30,000 feet, many services are "simple" copies of each other. e.g., Apple iTunes vs MS's Play-for-Sure (Both just sell songs... the same songs in fact, but I think of them as 2 fundemantally different approaches). Without knowing what eDI is, I hesitate to argue either way.
From technical perspective, you may be correct.
From marketing perspective, a PC game portal can be fundamentally different from XBLA. The user behaviour and needs can be worlds apart (working crowd casual games on PC vs hard core gamers on Xbox Live). e.g., PC mini-games are typically small, XBLA games seem to be more lenient in this aspect. This is why I suspect Sony's eDI effort is just a backend initiatives... with different user frontend targeting different user needs. But I have no proof.
This in principle I can agree. All e-Distribution initiatives (in whatever form) will need to blend/confuse its packaging so that there is no direct comparison with existing USD50-60 games. This is to prevent hurting the distis and the publishers (i.e., pre-empt cannibalization)
If we keep debating on specific points, we may actually diverge more and more. Did I miss any official words on what eDI is ?
(i) I can't find an official definition of eDI (and so I misunderstood people when they made specific comparisons between XBLA, PC Game Portal and eDI). On one extreme, eDI sounds like a horizontal backend initiatives/concept in Sony, subsuming various digital distribution efforts such as:
- Porting of Playstation emulators to other platforms (e.g., PCs) so that downloaded content can be playbacked on PCs, PSPs and PS3s.
- Mini-game purchase for PSP and PS3 (e.g., Calling-all-Cars)
- Back catalog distribution (of retro games) to PSP and PS3
- Music/Movie on demand to PSP and PS3
- Full-blown game content download (e.g., GTHD tracks and cars) to PSP and PS3
In this view, eDI comprises of a few consumer frontends (e.g., different eStores and clients), but is fundamentally a (soft) initiative.
On the other end, eDI is just a content (mini-game/music/movie) portal.
(ii) We seem to be talking about different domain (e.g., What Inane_Dork refer to as "fundamentally identical" may be "fundamentally different" to me).
e.g., [Not targeting Inane_Dork, but one of his posts illustrate our differences starkly]
Besides content similarity, there are other aspects that can differentiate services. At 30,000 feet, many services are "simple" copies of each other. e.g., Apple iTunes vs MS's Play-for-Sure (Both just sell songs... the same songs in fact, but I think of them as 2 fundemantally different approaches). Without knowing what eDI is, I hesitate to argue either way.
From technical perspective, you may be correct.
From marketing perspective, a PC game portal can be fundamentally different from XBLA. The user behaviour and needs can be worlds apart (working crowd casual games on PC vs hard core gamers on Xbox Live). e.g., PC mini-games are typically small, XBLA games seem to be more lenient in this aspect. This is why I suspect Sony's eDI effort is just a backend initiatives... with different user frontend targeting different user needs. But I have no proof.
This in principle I can agree. All e-Distribution initiatives (in whatever form) will need to blend/confuse its packaging so that there is no direct comparison with existing USD50-60 games. This is to prevent hurting the distis and the publishers (i.e., pre-empt cannibalization)
If we keep debating on specific points, we may actually diverge more and more. Did I miss any official words on what eDI is ?
The argument wasn't that only experienced developers would create download games, but it was said that there's no reason to think big developers will get on board
Most of the games so far (on XBLA) haven't required top-class development talent to create and could have been offered to junior developers. I'm rather assuming that's what'd happen because that seems the most sensible move. Would you take your top talent away from you big-name games to create Galaga and Frogger titles on Live Arcade? "Hey, Kojima! Stop that MGS4 rubbish and make us Frogger for Live Arcade!" This is from the larger publishers/developers known for disc games. Of course you have independent developers such as Blitz Games and PopCap also present. It all depends on what you measure as big name developers.Inane_Dork said:
That's an assumption that he was assigned, rather than told there's EDI and would he like a go. Reading his interviews, whether assigned or not Jaffe would be trying to do download titles instead of epics. In one interview it seems Sony are more encouraging him to stay with GOW
And later on, it seems as though Sony aren't bossing him to make download games, but are being supportive...
That's certainly one top-class developer (though TBH I personally don't rate Jaffe that highly on his previous works) who's been attracted to the idea. As I said in my first line
Some top level developers known for AAA titles would like to have a go at smaller games as they're more fun to make
Whether they get to make download titles or not because the publishers will/won't support them, they are being attracted to the idea. And if there's some success, chances are the publishers will let them off the lease to work on download games.
Anyhow, this is all just particulars. Looking at the big picture and comparing the PC Indie space to these console distribution options, we're already getting some major investment in downloadable games. eg. UE3 is being licensed for some XBLA games. How many PC Indie's have the financial resources to use UE3? That shows that developers/publishers are investing a decent amount of money and the technology used won't just be Torque and ODE and other popular PC Indie mainstays. Whether they're developers known for disc-based games, or PC Indies entering the console market, there's work being done to get int this arena. It's early days yet so you can't look at what's out there now and say 'these download services aren't going to offer anything different to what's been done for years in the PC space.' Looking at what's being talked about, there's lots of new content coming. New ideas with professional investment. And the financial model means there can be more experimentation as there's less risk. I think those that doubt there'll be 'innovation' are just looking at the current state of XBLA and PC downloadables, and ignoring the fact there's serious investment and developers saying 'we'd get a lot more creative freedom on smaller/downloadble games where we don't need a publisher to tell us what to do,' which they've been saying for years. Looking at all that, I don't see how anyone can think these download services will just be puzzlers and remakes, or be low-quality products.
The full eDI is just that as I understand it. It's basically Sony distributing stuff over the internet. In this particular thread, it's Sony creating 40 titles for download to PS3 over PS3's network, which is comparable to MS providing content to XB360 users over Live! Arcade.
The argument is one of 'will this amount to anything, or is no different to the PC space' - at least that's what I've been arguing!
Right, but are these 40 titles it ? Or are they phase 1 of an eDI store ? In the former case, eDI could be an XBLA-like distribution point. In the latter case, eDI is the platform (middleware + business processes).
Presumably these are the current lot of titles to be followed by more. It's like Sony are funding say a dozen ordinary PS3 titles at the moment - and that doesn't mean that there won't be any more titles after that!
From Harrison's most recent ThreeSpeech interview, it sounds like eDI is a business plan for Sony to fund and publish downloadable games, open to any developers to approach them. Sony are encouraging the development of more technically demanding games than what's mostly associated with downloadble games.
“We announced an initiative from a worldwide studios perspective at GDC this year,†he explains, “as a call to action to the development community to encourage them to create games specifically for us, that we would fund, that we would publish, in the online sense of the word, and distribute online.†- P. Harrison
We don't yet know whether games that appear will remain just 'casual' games (flOw and Soduku), or if someone will add a deeper game, perhaps something artistic like Okami but on a smaller scale. Or episodic games like Telltale's adventures, which I think highly likely to be offered in at least a test case. XBLA is obviously the test-bed and that's been casual in nature, but RoboBlitz I think is a deeper game then the usual 10-minute time killer.
I think it's been hinted, or at least implied once upon a time, that via open development, potentially anyone at home creating a game could approach Sony to add it to the eDI. Ideally that'd mean you could create a prototype on PS3 Linux say, show it to Sony, and fingers crossed they take you up to fund and develop it. Whether they'll actually extend that to bedroom developers or keep eDI for professional developers is unknown. To begin with it's likely only those with experience will be considered, when you note the need to submit for partnership into the program. Perhaps for homebrew to cross over into eDI, there'll be a constant Net Yaroze type opportunity for finding new talent? We also might see competition with XBLA and XNA development on the PC to further opportunities for bedroom developers.
I really hope major headway is made here. Many existing large companies had their genesis in 8 bit owners programming at home. The great talents we consider now were once upon a time newbies on home computers. Uncovering creative talent is what these intiatives would be able to do better than any other methods and it'd be a crying shame if they didn't manage that.
From Harrison's most recent ThreeSpeech interview, it sounds like eDI is a business plan for Sony to fund and publish downloadable games, open to any developers to approach them. Sony are encouraging the development of more technically demanding games than what's mostly associated with downloadble games.
“We announced an initiative from a worldwide studios perspective at GDC this year,†he explains, “as a call to action to the development community to encourage them to create games specifically for us, that we would fund, that we would publish, in the online sense of the word, and distribute online.†- P. Harrison
We don't yet know whether games that appear will remain just 'casual' games (flOw and Soduku), or if someone will add a deeper game, perhaps something artistic like Okami but on a smaller scale. Or episodic games like Telltale's adventures, which I think highly likely to be offered in at least a test case. XBLA is obviously the test-bed and that's been casual in nature, but RoboBlitz I think is a deeper game then the usual 10-minute time killer.
I think it's been hinted, or at least implied once upon a time, that via open development, potentially anyone at home creating a game could approach Sony to add it to the eDI. Ideally that'd mean you could create a prototype on PS3 Linux say, show it to Sony, and fingers crossed they take you up to fund and develop it. Whether they'll actually extend that to bedroom developers or keep eDI for professional developers is unknown. To begin with it's likely only those with experience will be considered, when you note the need to submit for partnership into the program. Perhaps for homebrew to cross over into eDI, there'll be a constant Net Yaroze type opportunity for finding new talent? We also might see competition with XBLA and XNA development on the PC to further opportunities for bedroom developers.
I really hope major headway is made here. Many existing large companies had their genesis in 8 bit owners programming at home. The great talents we consider now were once upon a time newbies on home computers. Uncovering creative talent is what these intiatives would be able to do better than any other methods and it'd be a crying shame if they didn't manage that.
It seems so. That's why I mentioned eDI could be a "platform + businesss processes" to advance digital distribution on PS3 (so it may take multiple forms from the user perspective). e.g., Does Polyphony Digital gets funding from Sony regarding its per-car, per-track download effort ?
Judging from one's responses in this thread, his eDI idea seems closer to this concept (Hence, the comment that it's different from XBLA ?).
