Sony Disable “Install Other OS” in firmware (v3.21)

[eastmen]

I think you know exactly what i meant with the no CFW and no piracy, and i honestly think that you are painting yourself into a corner on this one. It´s been a while since the last time we saw the horns of the Console war show on this forum, but yours is starting to glow red.

I'm not exactly sure why there is a console war.

The 360 is hacked and people use it to make copys , they use hardrives they shouldn't be able to use.

I don't take sides. I don't argue that people shouldn't be able to do it on console x but are allowed on console b.

The only diffrence is that in the psp's case there were reasons why cfw was important because it improved the device outside of getting illegal games. CFW on the psp was a valid thing to want some of those things sony has implemented in the normal firmware , but many things still aren't avalible. Just the fact that I can get increased battery life and load times is good .

With the original xbox the CFW allowed you to enhance the media center functions of the xbox which for many was a great deal.


I'm not a supporter of piracy. But CFW doesn't just mean piracy. Piracy exists without CFW and has for as long as gaming systems have been around

 

[makattack]

That's not what you said earlier. You said that CFW is not a problem and that you can have CFW without piracy. So which systems had CFW and no piracy?

I wanted to stay away from this thread, but y'all are making too many generalizations and labeling custom firmware software as evil for no good reason:

http://openwrt.org/

That's wonderful custom firmware software that allows old home routers to be infinitely more useful. Of course, this isn't a console, but I'm just saying that you can't ignore the value in replacing the OS of a device.

My phone (HST G1 from T-Mobile) is arguably a game console / platform, and its value is also enhanced with custom android OS versions / root exploits that are not used by most for pirating software.

 

[patsu]

Router is not a content platform though. As for Android, it's too early and has limited appeal for piracy. May have to wait longer to see how things pan out. [size=-2]If the content providers don't feel comfortable with the state of affairs on Android content security, they may not invest aggressively.[/size]

I don't think anyone can guarantee what CFW can or cannot do. They can only speak for themselves. But we know many consumers, at least on the PSP, have pirated because CFW allows them to. As for whose fault it is, Sony is partly to blame too.

EDIT: The BitTorrent download stats does not speak for the piracy rate. As I mentioned, a lot of the pirated content comes pre-packed into the PSP (memory stick). Those cannot be measured accurately.

 

[tuna]

Not for my saturn at least. Nor the sega cd.

Could you please provide some more information regarding piracy on the saturn without a mod chip?

 

[tha_con]

I wanted to stay away from this thread, but y'all are making too many generalizations and labeling custom firmware software as evil for no good reason:

http://openwrt.org/

That's wonderful custom firmware software that allows old home routers to be infinitely more useful. Of course, this isn't a console, but I'm just saying that you can't ignore the value in replacing the OS of a device.

My phone (HST G1 from T-Mobile) is arguably a game console / platform, and its value is also enhanced with custom android OS versions / root exploits that are not used by most for pirating software.

Apples and oranges.

WRT doesn't allow you to use illegally obtained content, i.e. movies, music, games, etc. I have no problem replacing the OS of a device, I do, however, have a problem with replacing the OS of a device for "good" when it can (and will, without question) lead to rampant piracy.

Your phone is apples and oranges as well, since those custom OS versions, root exploits, etc, are mostly used to add patches to the phone, customize the OS's appearance, etc. I can't say I'm particularly familiar with the Andriod OS or it's phone's, but I'm certain they won't play PSP, DS, PS1, PS2, PS3, Wii, NGC, etc.

Still, I think CFW is okay in some instances, but when you're doing something that allows you to run unsigned code for illegally obtained content...I have an issue with it. I have an issue particularly with those who can't see the connection between the two.

 

[eastmen]

Could you please provide some more information regarding piracy on the saturn without a mod chip?

My saturn I used a 4meg cart which allowed me to play japanese games. It could also allow me to play back ups if i choose to do so (which i did for games i couldn't find. Seriously sega why did you limit sales of the later titles !)

 

[eastmen]

Apples and oranges.

WRT doesn't allow you to use illegally obtained content, i.e. movies, music, games, etc. I have no problem replacing the OS of a device, I do, however, have a problem with replacing the OS of a device for "good" when it can (and will, without question) lead to rampant piracy.

Your phone is apples and oranges as well, since those custom OS versions, root exploits, etc, are mostly used to add patches to the phone, customize the OS's appearance, etc. I can't say I'm particularly familiar with the Andriod OS or it's phone's, but I'm certain they won't play PSP, DS, PS1, PS2, PS3, Wii, NGC, etc.

Still, I think CFW is okay in some instances, but when you're doing something that allows you to run unsigned code for illegally obtained content...I have an issue with it. I have an issue particularly with those who can't see the connection between the two.

You can run mame and other software on windows , andriod , iphone os . Does that mean those os's shouldn't be sold because they are illegal.

Hell you could have run mame on linux installed on the ps3 and played all those game for free.

Piracy exists without custom firmware.


However Custom firmware offers things that people want outside of free games.

For instance. If when the 360 came out someone made a custom firmware so that you could install games directly to the hardrive , or you could trick the 360 into using a 500 gig 3.5inch drive would you be for or against that ?

On the ps3 if someone made a custom firmware that allowed you to install any game fully to the hardrive so that you would get faster load times would you be for or against it.


On the psp custom firmware allowed higher bit rate movies , it allowed loading games onto memory sticks which gave the consumer the benfit of increased battery life, faster load times which combined with not having to carry around umds increased the portability of the system drasticly.

Even on the ds the hack card that I have (and I own al my titles for both ds and psp mind you) allows me to bring my ds to more places with me becuase i no longer have to carry all my games with me or be limited to a single game .

 

[BoardBonobo]

You can run mame and other software on windows , andriod , iphone os . Does that mean those os's shouldn't be sold because they are illegal.

Hell you could have run mame on linux installed on the ps3 and played all those game for free.

Piracy exists without custom firmware.

In that instance mame is illegal because it is allowing piracy to occur.

On the ps3 if someone made a custom firmware that allowed you to install any game fully to the hardrive so that you would get faster load times would you be for or against it.

If it was also a requirement that they had to have the original disc in the drive each time they launched it then I'd be for it. If it was written so that you could install and forget, therefore pirate a game then it would be bad.

On the psp custom firmware allowed higher bit rate movies , it allowed loading games onto memory sticks which gave the consumer the benfit of increased battery life, faster load times which combined with not having to carry around umds increased the portability of the system drasticly.

And the psp is practically a dead platform.

Even on the ds the hack card that I have (and I own al my titles for both ds and psp mind you) allows me to bring my ds to more places with me becuase i no longer have to carry all my games with me or be limited to a single game .

And I have a friend with cards full of games that they paid almost nothing for. That is a bad thing.

 

[-tkf-]

I caved and updated the firmware, to much free stuff to be had from PSN..

 

[eastmen]

You cannot be this dense...

I'm not buying shit you say, I think you pirate a ton of content, everything you say screams "HEY I PIRATE A LOT OF STUFF AND THATS WHY I LIKE CFW". You try so strong to justify it's existence and the ability to use ILLEGAL SOFTWARE (i.e. backups, which people WILL DO no matter what).

Whatever, there's an ignore list feature, and it'll certainly assist me when surfing B3D and not seeing your posts that continue to contradict each other.

So instead of having a valid counter arguement you simply attack me and call me a pirate.

Nice bullshit slander you got there. Can't get me for being what did you call me a console war guy so you instead call me out on piracy.


I own all my content , It doesn't make any sense for me to pirate it , it takes more time and mostly has more hoops to jump.

My psp will rip my umd to my computer for me. I don't need to download anything there.

If these systems offered me what i wanted i'd be fine and wouldn't need to download CFWs. I don't have CFW for my 360 or my PS3 and I don't see why i'd need them. MY ps1 and ps2 aren't hacked , either is my wii or gamecube. My ds is hacked because i want to carry more content with me , more easily. My psp is hacked so i get a decent life out of it and make it more portable with faster battery life. If it wasn't for both systems not offering this then I woudn't have done it.

In fact if Nintendo got its act together and started offering full ds games on store for my dsi i would even need a hack card.

 

[-tkf-]

Can't get me for being what did you call me a console war guy so you instead call me out on piracy.

Read the damn thread, how many in here is actually supporting you on this argument. There comes a point where you have to look at what other people thinks and says, and when you are the single person making a claim, you are either a genius or wrong.

Your first excuse was Bad video, yet the PSP you owned supported full res from the purchase.
Second was carrying to many UMD´s and you used your DS as an example of how easy it was to carry small games. But hey, you also have a DS with a hacked card for comfort, i guess they took to much space anyway.

CFW and Piracy goes hand in hand, CFW on the PS3 will reduce software sales, CFW/Bootcard on the DS does the same, on the PSP it´s apparently out of control. Mame, Video whatever the excuse is, it has a cost on the piracy side.

I am the last to judge on the moral issue on Piracy, it´s not black and white, and it´s to easy to shout thief at a pirat, and that is really not the issue here. But CFW enables piracy and in game cheating, and it is pr definition a very bad thing for developers, manufactures and gamers.

 

[Rolf N]

The analogy I like to use is that of an open door. If you don't want shit to come through, you keep it shut. My PSP3000 runs with the original firmware, and I have not even spent a second on researching how to change that. I keep that door shut.

 

[eastmen]

Read the damn thread, how many in here is actually supporting you on this argument. There comes a point where you have to look at what other people thinks and says, and when you are the single person making a claim, you are either a genius or wrong.

Or I'm right and people are trying very hrd to paint CFW as the bad guy to find reasons why sony failed and failed hard with the psp

Your first excuse was Bad video, yet the PSP you owned supported full res from the purchase.
Second was carrying to many UMD´s and you used your DS as an example of how easy it was to carry small games. But hey, you also have a DS with a hacked card for comfort, i guess they took to much space anyway.

If it wasn't for CFW the supported video on PSP would still be poor. CFW changed that and thus its valid.

UMDS are big and take up alot of room making it even less portible than the system already was. The CFW allowed me to use the psp to the fullest , fixing problems that sony itself could have and should have fixed in the design stages of the system.

MY ds becomes even more portable with a hack card , I don't have to worry about loosing any games or having to switch out games / carry them with me. Very important for on the go gaming.

These are all valid reasons to seek out a CFW and none of them have to do with Piracy .

CFW and Piracy goes hand in hand, CFW on the PS3 will reduce software sales, CFW/Bootcard on the DS does the same, on the PSP it´s apparently out of control. Mame, Video whatever the excuse is, it has a cost on the piracy side.

Yet the 360 that has a way for piracy still has software greatly outselling the ps3 software. So the ps3's lack of software sales currently need another scape goat.

I am the last to judge on the moral issue on Piracy, it´s not black and white, and it´s to easy to shout thief at a pirat, and that is really not the issue here. But CFW enables piracy and in game cheating, and it is pr definition a very bad thing for developers, manufactures and gamers.

Yet piracy doesn't require CFW and CFW brings with it many advantages that have nothing to do with piracy.

 

[Rolf N]

Yet the 360 that has a way for piracy still has software greatly outselling the ps3 software.

They sell software in exact proportion to installed base. Every Wii, PS3 and Xbox 360 owner buys a game every 10.5 weeks on average +/-0.5, and this has held for the entire life of the platforms as tracked by US NPD.

 

[eastmen]

They sell software in exact proportion to installed base. Every Wii, PS3 and Xbox 360 owner buys a game every 10.5 weeks on average +/-0.5, and this has held for the entire life of the platforms as tracked by US NPD.

and yet the wii and 360 both have piracy and yet are able to sell the same amount of software as the ps3 that has no piracy

 

[corduroygt]

and yet the wii and 360 both have piracy and yet are able to sell the same amount of software as the ps3 that has no piracy

There still isn't an effective 360 piracy solution with online games. SP only games underperform compared to their install base on the 360.
Also, piracy is most prevalent outside the wealthy nations of NA, Western Europe, and Japan, which is where ~90% of all 360's are sold.

Wii demographics are outside the hardcore gamer, who, sadly, are the people with the know-how on how to pirate, not to mention the best selling wii games come with accessories like wii fit, or they're bundled with them.

 

[patsu]

There is a flaw in the measurement. As I mentioned above, a lot of piracy cannot be measured. e.g., Those occurring off-line (pre-packed). They are lost opportunities and also help people to pirate automatically.

and yet the wii and 360 both have piracy and yet are able to sell the same amount of software as the ps3 that has no piracy

Piracy is not the only cause for loss sales. Also, Wii, 360, and PS3 are not as easy, or rather "matured", as PSP CFW piracy.

 

[corduroygt]

They sell software in exact proportion to installed base. Every Wii, PS3 and Xbox 360 owner buys a game every 10.5 weeks on average +/-0.5, and this has held for the entire life of the platforms as tracked by US NPD.

This graph, based off of US NPD disagrees, PS3 software revenue compared to its install base is far higher than the other 2.
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/4299/npd_behind_the_numbers_february_.php

 

[-tkf-]

and yet the wii and 360 both have piracy and yet are able to sell the same amount of software as the ps3 that has no piracy

Didn´t someone claim that the PS3 was primarily bought for Blu-Ray?
Or was it the other way, Blu-Ray was dead because the PS3 didn´t help Blu-Ray

Lets pretend you are right about one thing, that the sales are equal, then you hold the smoking gun on the evidence that the PS3 is CLEARLY a strong reason for the Blu-Ray victory and sales. Because no one with a hint of brain would claim that consoles that has been cracked sells just as much as they would have without being cracked. So obviously the PS3 sold great numbers to people that doesn´t use it for games.

This is of course if you are right about the games sales, besides that... you are like a reborn PC-ENGINE stubborn, ignorant and totally and utterly on your own

 

[tha_con]

Right, let's ignore any inconvenient detail that doesn't fit with your prejudices...

Also writing in caps will certainly strengthen your argument

So you're saying the availability of easy to use CFW doesn't entice pirates? That CFW can exist on a gaming platform without piracy?

You're saying that a hacker can create a patch to remove DRM from a game, and it wont' be used to pirate said game?

You're telling me that some DVD's are copy-protected, and when a hacker creates a program to override that to make his own backup, it won't be used to pirate said movies?

Is THAT what you're trying to get across? Rather, are those the "inconvenient" details I'm missing?