So is this the generation where PC's are surpassed forever?
- Thread starter skilzygw
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Dual core athlon 64s , dual core p4s .
R600 , r700 , r800 , r900
nv50 , nv60 , nv70 , nv80 , nv90
Basicly the same way they allways do .
For the next 4-6 years the consoles will be stuck with thier tri-core cpus and gpus and fixed memory pools . In those 4 years what will happen is
we will go from a 512 megs of ram to most likely 1.5 gigs of ram standard on pcs for system memory
Gpus will most likely have 512 megs of ram to 1gig of ram and the ram will keep clocking faster and faster and offer more and more badnwidth than what is in the consoles
The gpus will become more feature rich and the features they have will become faster and faster .
When the ps2 , xbox and gamecube came out the consoles were in some ways superior and in some ways not . It will be the same at the end of the year .
The pcs will have more fillrate and memory and perhaps bandwidth for the gpus than the consoles , the consoles will have more cpu power and more advanced graphics cores .
But it will all change 6 months to a year later .
Its interesting to see what happens with these physics add in cards. If they take off the pc may leap foward much quicker than it has in the past
R600 , r700 , r800 , r900
nv50 , nv60 , nv70 , nv80 , nv90
Basicly the same way they allways do .
For the next 4-6 years the consoles will be stuck with thier tri-core cpus and gpus and fixed memory pools . In those 4 years what will happen is
we will go from a 512 megs of ram to most likely 1.5 gigs of ram standard on pcs for system memory
Gpus will most likely have 512 megs of ram to 1gig of ram and the ram will keep clocking faster and faster and offer more and more badnwidth than what is in the consoles
The gpus will become more feature rich and the features they have will become faster and faster .
When the ps2 , xbox and gamecube came out the consoles were in some ways superior and in some ways not . It will be the same at the end of the year .
The pcs will have more fillrate and memory and perhaps bandwidth for the gpus than the consoles , the consoles will have more cpu power and more advanced graphics cores .
But it will all change 6 months to a year later .
Its interesting to see what happens with these physics add in cards. If they take off the pc may leap foward much quicker than it has in the past
I kind of don't see how they're radically different from pc's their gpu's are gonna be custom versions of the desktop part and they're using multi cpu power cores which to be honest will probably be overun in performance by amd and intel by mid next year. Also the memory on consoles is going to be too low, pc's will have far more room to expand and do things that consoles will require lots of cut down textures and art to fit. After looking at what's on offer i think pc's have still gotta a nice little future, epecially with XNA integrating nicely with pc's. Besides if you kill of the pc market, it will affect the generation after next, because the pc sector funds a lot of r&d and creates progress in the graphics and processing fields. With no pc gaming, giants like ATI/nvidia wouldn't be offering the amazing 3d solutions they provide today.
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Intel isn't involved in a console so I'd expect them to prove the title wrong.
One thing that is different about the next gen consoles is thier adoption of PC like features - hard drives keyboards mice etc. Xbox had them same with PS but not as standard. I think the xbox2 and PS3 has a few different flavours rather like a PC model line up catering for different markets.
One thing that is different about the next gen consoles is thier adoption of PC like features - hard drives keyboards mice etc. Xbox had them same with PS but not as standard. I think the xbox2 and PS3 has a few different flavours rather like a PC model line up catering for different markets.
So basicly they will be like todays pc games on high end rigs .
I didn't notice any stiff animation on half life 2 with my system , nor did i see crappy lighting or low polygons .
What i did see was breath taking visuals made possible by high polygons , advanced effects and crisp high res textures with proper filtering done to them and of course smooth curves and lines thanks to high lvls of fsaa .
Ofcourse games on next gen consoles will be a big huge jump over CURRENT consoles, but I doubt about current and upcoming PC titles. Not to mention that if it were actually true you are saying, everything will be lost on a crappy TV screen. Simple as that. Most consoles get people only tricked because TVs are blurry and low res. PC gamers expect better.hovz said:
hovz said:u didnt see low polys and shitty lighting in hl2??
the ONLY things that look visually pleasing in hl2 are the water and character faces.
Couldn't agree more. The word i would use to describe Half Life 2's graphics are "flat and lifeless". That's perhaps because i recently watched the latest U3 engine video's.
Re: So is this the generation where PC's are surpassed forev
Long answer:
The only way that could happen is if all progress on the pc side freezes. But it won't freeze. I'd be willing to bet money that both ati and nvidia already have teams working on designs that'll blow the console gpu chips out of the water. Xbox 2 will always and forever be stuck at r500. PS3 will be stuck with whatever nv50 level chip it gets. Similar fate for Revolution.
Meahwhile, in a few years I could have a quad-core 64bit cpu, r600 or nv60 vidcard with 1024 megs ram, an entire soundcard dedicated to 3d sound, 2-4 gigs of very fast main system memory, and a terabyte of fast storage space.
Consoles grab the limelight when first launched. High end pc's give them solid competition; soon, even mainstream pc's overtake them. There's no compelling reason to expect this pattern to change.
Short answer: No.skilzygw said:
Long answer:
The only way that could happen is if all progress on the pc side freezes. But it won't freeze. I'd be willing to bet money that both ati and nvidia already have teams working on designs that'll blow the console gpu chips out of the water. Xbox 2 will always and forever be stuck at r500. PS3 will be stuck with whatever nv50 level chip it gets. Similar fate for Revolution.
Meahwhile, in a few years I could have a quad-core 64bit cpu, r600 or nv60 vidcard with 1024 megs ram, an entire soundcard dedicated to 3d sound, 2-4 gigs of very fast main system memory, and a terabyte of fast storage space.
Consoles grab the limelight when first launched. High end pc's give them solid competition; soon, even mainstream pc's overtake them. There's no compelling reason to expect this pattern to change.
Re: So is this the generation where PC's are surpassed forev
Old consoles were highly-specialized designs (examples: NES, SNES, Sega Genesis), with hardware acceleration for specific features that just weren't seen on the PC.
Today, even the PS2 has a design that is quite different from your standard PC. All geometry processing is done on the CPU, which was designed to be very good at geometry processing. The GPU uses embedded DRAM, and has 16 pixel pipelines (though has lower texturing output than that).
The only console that I know of that is very similar to a PC design is the X-Box. But it's also a first-generation console by a company whose primary business is the PC business, so that's not surprising.
Nope, not at all. A couple of examples:skilzygw said:
Old consoles were highly-specialized designs (examples: NES, SNES, Sega Genesis), with hardware acceleration for specific features that just weren't seen on the PC.
Today, even the PS2 has a design that is quite different from your standard PC. All geometry processing is done on the CPU, which was designed to be very good at geometry processing. The GPU uses embedded DRAM, and has 16 pixel pipelines (though has lower texturing output than that).
The only console that I know of that is very similar to a PC design is the X-Box. But it's also a first-generation console by a company whose primary business is the PC business, so that's not surprising.
Most developers make games in parallel for PC and consoles, so there won't be much difference anyway. Take another compiler, make the game for another platform. Good example, UE3 - it will be able to produce the same output for all target systems if so desired.
So no, PC won't come to an end games-wise.
So no, PC won't come to an end games-wise.
howz has a point in that PC games have to target a range of hardware. That means that many PC games target as a baseline something lower than the highest end at the time of release. (However, there are also games that aim quite high, figuring that PC evolution will soon make their demands mainstream)
Targeting a range cuts both ways, it also allows increased visual quality at the other end of the performance spectrum, and later in the lifetime of a game. Which is nice. Also, as the PC platform moves (slower and slower) forward during the lifetime of a console, the relative visual quality will also improve. Until the next console generation makes its appearance, of course.
PC games have traditionally held advantages in resolution, memory sizes, game modding/upgradeability, a better user interface for some types of games, typically better display devices, and better network gaming potential.
Consoles will clearly close a couple of these gaps, resolution is not likely to be much of an issue at HD res + AA. Nor will PCs enjoy much of an advantage as far as displays are concerned. TVs are getting better, and FP TVs use the same basic tech as the corresponding computer displays. Network play will improve, but isn't likely to be as good or varied as with PCs. The other advantages of PCs are likely to remain.
Consoles will retain their traditional advantages over PCs.
So as gaming devices, consoles certainly look positioned to improve their standing vs. PCs, but that doesn't mean that PCs won't offer unique advantages, nor that there isn't room for a strong PC games industry for the foreseeable future.
Targeting a range cuts both ways, it also allows increased visual quality at the other end of the performance spectrum, and later in the lifetime of a game. Which is nice. Also, as the PC platform moves (slower and slower) forward during the lifetime of a console, the relative visual quality will also improve. Until the next console generation makes its appearance, of course.
PC games have traditionally held advantages in resolution, memory sizes, game modding/upgradeability, a better user interface for some types of games, typically better display devices, and better network gaming potential.
Consoles will clearly close a couple of these gaps, resolution is not likely to be much of an issue at HD res + AA. Nor will PCs enjoy much of an advantage as far as displays are concerned. TVs are getting better, and FP TVs use the same basic tech as the corresponding computer displays. Network play will improve, but isn't likely to be as good or varied as with PCs. The other advantages of PCs are likely to remain.
Consoles will retain their traditional advantages over PCs.
So as gaming devices, consoles certainly look positioned to improve their standing vs. PCs, but that doesn't mean that PCs won't offer unique advantages, nor that there isn't room for a strong PC games industry for the foreseeable future.