Rumor: Xbox 360 CES Announcements Leaked

[expletive]

With regard to USB hard drives, the trend in DRM seems to be a preference for a 'closed box' environment where the hardware manufacturer (in this case, MS) can ensure a 'sealed path' from internet to display for the content owners.

For example, in the new vista PCs, users wont be able to add cablecard hardware, theyll need to buy a pre-configured system that has had the data path certified by cable labs.

I imagine that MS would put off a lot of content partners by allowing too much flexibility and introducing unknowns to the storage of 3rd party content.

 

[Platon]

I eally hope that they will soon allow storing on either an extrenal USB HDD or on your PC, however in order for them not to loose sales maybe you would still have to have a "regular" xbox360 attached HDD or something for you to use the extrenal HDD or PC...

 

[Rolf N]

Do replacements for broken units add to the count?
Do refurbed units add to the count again when they ship back out?

get back on topic please.

Read the OP again.

 

[Kryton]

With regard to USB hard drives, the trend in DRM seems to be a preference for a 'closed box' environment where the hardware manufacturer (in this case, MS) can ensure a 'sealed path' from internet to display for the content owners.

For example, in the new vista PCs, users wont be able to add cablecard hardware, theyll need to buy a pre-configured system that has had the data path certified by cable labs.

I imagine that MS would put off a lot of content partners by allowing too much flexibility and introducing unknowns to the storage of 3rd party content.

They have a closed key in the box though, that's what matters. The HD could be encrypted on-the-fly by one of the CPUs, with the other 2 doing video playback or whatever. For games, this would have a performance impact, but games don't store sensitive material (really). For video/audio/whatever else they care about, unless they need all 3 CPUs, it should work fine.

 

[Johnny Awesome]

10.4 million sold to retailers is pretty good. I imagine they were hoping to be closer to 12-13 million by now (ie. 1 million/month) , but the $399 price point has made this a little more difficult, particularly in the off season. With great games, a price drop, and solid marketing MS should be able to sell 1 million units/month (on average) for most of this generation. I'm thinking they'll sell between 50 and 60 million units altogether over 5 years.

 

[Ginko]

Just to clear up any confusion, Microsoft's "sold" is that which has been sold to retailers. So they have sold 10.4 million to retailers.

Q: It’s 10 million shipped, right?
A: Yeah. In our case, it’s reasonably close to sold through. To make sure we’re clear, Sony does shipped from factory. We don’t. Our shipped means it has left a distribution warehouse in Memphis to a retailer. There is a big lag of six week to eight-week lag between what we called shipped and what Sony calls shipped. That’s the way we do the accounting.

[Link]

To the news at hand, bravo. The IPTV thing was mentioned around this time last year, but now it seems they're ready to divulge some details. I can't wait.:smile:

 

[Qroach]

Do replacements for broken units add to the count?
Do refurbed units add to the count again when they ship back out?Read the OP again.

perhaps you need to read the original post? discussing what constitutes sold/shipped is NOT on topic. specifically when we know exactly what MS means by 'Sold" after it's been debated a million times and despite MS clarifying this themselves.

 

[Rolf N]

perhaps you need to read the original post? discussing what constitutes sold/shipped is NOT on topic.

Interesting opinion.

specifically when we know exactly what MS means by 'Sold" after it's been debated a million times and despite MS clarifying this themselves.

I must have missed where my questions have been adressed a million times.

 

[Qroach]

Interesting opinion.I must have missed where my questions have been adressed a million times.

just do a search for every other thread that mentions Xbox 360 sales numbers.... that discussion/argument/questions regarding what "sold" means is in every one.

 

[Carl B]

I think the IPTV is good/big news. I've fully been xpecting IPTV functionality to make it's way into the PS3 at some point in the future (and look forward to it), but didn't think MS would pursue a route like this. It's a bold move and I like it.

It does sort of make me whince though the way MS kept spinning Sony's multimedia pursuits prior to launch as being essentially a waste of time as far as gamers were concerned; yet their actions have been reflective of nothing if not trying to cram as much non-gaming functionality into the box as possible as quickly as possible.

 

[Tap In]

cool!

I think I will be using this box as much for DL'ing HD movies/TV and IPTV as gaming. Combined with my HD DVD player (and the fact that my Hollywood video is carrying HD DVD rentals starting later this month :smile This is very exciting news.

oh and congrats MS on moving 10 million consoles... they have a very solid plan it seems and have unveiled it relentlessly with new partnerships as well as leveraging current partnerships and ideas with their technology.

Add to that a game library that is growing in diversity (Viva Pinata, Blue Dragon, Guitar Hero etc..) and an attach rate close to 6, hardware that is flexible and extremely downward price scalable, they are poised for a nice 4-5 year run of solid market penetration.

 

[rabidrabbit]

yes shipped to stores/retail. in other words counted as sold. Jeez why the heck does this stupid discussion keep coming up when we clearly know what they mean?


get back on topic please.

yea sorry, i am continuously confused as to what are shipped and what are sold, I'd thought until now the shipped meant those "shipped" or delivered to stores or warehouses, and sold meaning those sold to actual end users from the stores.
Seems I have been wrong in the description of shipped until now.
Makes sense now.
Sorry everyone.
Edit: Ok, I'm still confused, but what the heck, let's continue with the topic

 

[patsu]

I think the IPTV is good/big news. I've fully been xpecting IPTV functionality to make it's way into the PS3 at some point in the future (and look forward to it), but didn't think MS would pursue a route like this. It's a bold move and I like it.

It does sort of make me whince though the way MS kept spinning Sony's multimedia pursuits prior to launch as being essentially a waste of time as far as gamers were concerned; yet their actions have been reflective of nothing if not trying to cram as much non-gaming functionality into the box as possible as quickly as possible.

The key thing to watch about this announcement, if true, is the pricing structure. And yes, this won't be the last we see in this area.

As for MS and its fanbase spinning the irrelevance of non-gaming applications before, I think it's partly related to the higher list price, and Sony's inability/reluctance to orchestrate its values and PR.

But at least this kind of news is better than sensational/fake/out-of-context articles engineered to make Sony look bad.

 

[Tap In]

But at least this kind of news is better than sensational/fake/out-of-context articles engineered to make Sony look bad.

this was originally posted on MercuryNews by Dean Takahashi (reliable info) but was evidently removed as it was post dated and prematurely posted (allegedly )

but yea.... Kotaku usually posts crap. :smile:

 

[blakjedi]

As for MS and its fanbase spinning the irrelevance of non-gaming applications before, I think it's partly related to the higher list price, and Sony's inability/reluctance to orchestrate its values and PR.

But at least this kind of news is better than sensational/fake/out-of-context articles engineered to make Sony look bad.

I think you miss the points the "fanbase" has tried to make in relation to this argument.

MS says the x360 is a games console firstand can play movies in in SD or HD, download games or act as a centerpiece for other media.

Sony hasnt created a cogent view of what its device is. Its a media hub, its a cheap bluray player, its a cheap linux computer and oh yeah have you seen the games?

MS says upfront there will be one online service to serve all, both users and devs; and for the high end service, it costs money - a single flat rate once per year.

Sony says our service is free ( as in beer) but devs may reserve the right to charge you...

MS says HiDefinition Video disk playback is an affordable option if you are inclined at this point in time. The premium is $200 for this option. Save $200 upfront until you want it.

Sony says HD Video Disk is a standard (requirement) of next generation gameplay. The premium currently is a $100 (over any level X360) for that requirement.

MS says our online service is mature and is increasing in breadth and quality every day.

Sony says Our online service is nascent but we plan on matching Xbox's service sooner than later.

MS says if you want to compute use the pc you probably already have - there is synergy between our console and the PC.

Sony says you can get Linux and use it for our system if you are so inclined or hate MS. Only geeks hate MS, consumers are frustrated by computers in general...

I dont see the spin you talk about and there are fairly compelling arguments in both camps.

 

[Carl B]

I think you miss the points the "fanbase" has tried to make in relation to this argument....

....I dont see the spin you talk about and there are fairly compelling arguments in both camps.

Well then you didn't pay close enough attention in the lead-up to the PS3 launch though. No one's talking about (or cares) what the 360 fanbase was saying up to launch; but rather, what MS themselves was saying. And I honestly don't want to get into it, because I was just bringing it up as a wistful observation, but MS is the master of marketing in this digital age, not Sony. For the last year or so they've been able to talk about one thing while doing in tandem the exact thing they criticized Sony for pursuing. MS wants the 360 to be a digital media hub every bit as much as Sony wants the PS3 to be, make no mistake. The only difference is MS won't discuss this publicly, they just keep rolling out the features and pointing attention to Sony for discussing it publicly.

It's similar to how politics have been going in this country for the last couple of years, but that's a topic for a different sub-forum...

Anyway I have a marketing background, so in all honesty I respect the way MS has been able to deliver their message and paint Sony as 'out of touch.' It's worked in a lot of ways, and the media was right there in lockstep over the last year or so. But just because I respect their tactical achievement in said regard, doesn't mean I don't find it disengenuous and a little bit insiduous to boot. It's those same sorts of tactics that have me all over Amir on AVS when he tries to spin a story into something the f@nboys will run with.

 

[Tap In]

I think you miss the points the "fanbase" has tried to make in relation to this argument.

MS says the x360 is a games console firstand can play movies in in SD or HD, download games or act as a centerpiece for other media.

Sony hasnt created a cogent view of what its device is. Its a media hub, its a cheap bluray player, its a cheap linux computer and oh yeah have you seen the games?

MS says upfront there will be one online service to serve all, both users and devs; and for the high end service, it costs money - a single flat rate once per year.

Sony says our service is free ( as in beer) but devs may reserve the right to charge you...

MS says HiDefinition Video disk playback is an affordable option if you are inclined at this point in time. The premium is $200 for this option. Save $200 upfront until you want it.

Sony says HD Video Disk is a standard (requirement) of next generation gameplay. The premium currently is a $100 (over any level X360) for that requirement.

MS says our online service is mature and is increasing in breadth and quality every day.

Sony says Our online service is nascent but we plan on matching Xbox's service sooner than later.

MS says if you want to compute use the pc you probably already have - there is synergy between our console and the PC.

Sony says you can get Linux and use it for our system if you are so inclined or hate MS. Only geeks hate MS, consumers are frustrated by computers in general...

I dont see the spin you talk about and there are fairly compelling arguments in both camps.

wow I think that is a pretty good summary of how reasonable people can view the situation, yes. At least that's my take on it as well. I hate neither manufacturer nor system and have no problem looking at both options for my gaming/media needs and have been making my choices solely on my perception of value and so far MS has offered me a solid map that I can see and follow along with them.

At this point I think Sony's approach has been less focused and it appears more uncertain of it's purpose. IMO.

 

[scooby_dooby]

We can now discuss if these "sold" are actually sold, shipped to retailers, shiped from the factory or how many variations of "sold" there now are.

I hope they bring that IPTV thing to Europe soon, that would be quite cool...

MS has already explicitly defined their sales figures. They report 'sales' as consoles that have been purchased by retailers and left the main warehouses, whereas sony's report shipments to the main warehouses.

The most interesting thing is that MS has hit 10million sold without a pricedrop, at $400 it's quite impressive imo, given the weaker brandname of the xbox.

 

[scooby_dooby]

For the last year or so they've been able to talk about one thing while doing in tandem the exact thing they criticized Sony for pursuing.

Maybe you scould provide some quotes, as I have no idea what you're talking about. They criticised Bluray but that's all, Sony hasn't even put forward a comprehensive overview of what they are planning on doing with regards to digital distribution, so I don't see how MS could be criticizing Sony for something they haven't even defined.

MS has been leading the charge since day 1, with the inclusion of music video's and trailers, streaming audo from PC, supports for MP3's players like IPOD, PVR and video streaming support with windows MC all on day 1, followed by announcements of DirectTV support, followed by announcements of downloadable TV shows, and now the announcement of IPTV.

AFAIK, Sony has shown little more than a few powerpoint slides.

 

[Rolf N]

just do a search for every other thread that mentions Xbox 360 sales numbers.... that discussion/argument/questions regarding what "sold" means is in every one.

That wasn't actually what I was inquiring about. I don't think we have replacements and refurbs accounted for either way.
The laws of PR dictate that your numbers need to be as high as you can possibly make them and you'd count, err, on the high side of common sense. Unless of course you think that in itself might cause you more trouble than it's worth. I don't believe we have explored that yet (on B3df at least).
If there's an MS official on record somewhere clearing that up, I'd appreciate a link.