Revs virtual console: No Rare games?

[EndR]

http://blogs.ign.com/Matt-IGN/2006/03/26/7367/

Well, here's something interesting from the Game Developers Conference 2006. Met with some Rare / Microsoft people who confirmed once and for all that Revolution's Virtual Console will not see any Rare-owned licenses. What does that mean? No-gos include Jet Force Gemini, Perfect Dark, Banjo-Kazooie, Banjo-Tooie, and Conker's Bad Fur Day. Not happening on Revolution. Neither are gamers likely to see Goldeneye 007, unless both Rare and new license holder EA commit it to Nintendo's platform.

On a brighter note, any title developed by Rare that is fully owned by Nintendo could very well show up on the Virtual Console. Donkey Kong 64. Diddy Kong Racing. You get the point.
----------

Are the wholly owned N64 games below 50MB in size? Maybe they would be available through XBLA?

 

[BlueTsunami]

either are gamers likely to see Goldeneye 007, unless both Rare and new license holder EA commit it to Nintendo's platform

It may be one game, but I know alot of Nintendo fans who want to see Goldeneye on the Virtual Console (with Wi Fi support). That would be a blow in some ways.

 

[EndR]

It may be one game, but I know alot of Nintendo fans who want to see Goldeneye on the Virtual Console (with Wi Fi support). That would be a blow in some ways.

Goldeneye seems to be the toughest to get. Both EA and Rare must agree, and apparently, Rare don´t want to be on Virtual console.. for some reasons...

 

[BlueTsunami]

Goldeneye seems to be the toughest to get. Both EA and Rare must agree, and apparently, Rare don´t want to be on Virtual console.. for some reasons...

Yep, i'm sure EA would probably be game with this but Rare not so much. I'm sure XBLA or some sort of service where you can download full console game will go into effect with the Xbox360. When that happens I fully expect past Rare games to popup.

 

[EndR]

Yep, i'm sure EA would probably be game with this but Rare not so much. I'm sure XBLA or some sort of service where you can download full games will go into effect. When that happens I fully expect past Rare games to popup.

Yeah, that has to be the reason.
MS did have a 50 MB size limit on XBLA games, but N64 games rarely went about 50Megs after compression or am I off here?

 

[Teasy]

Rare don't have to agree for Goldeneye to be on the system, they don't own the license and the game itself was produced by Nintendo. As far as I can see Nintendo still own the ROM and so could release it on Revolution (as long as no modifications were made to the original game). At worst Nintendo might have to seek permision from the owners of the James Bond license, but I doubt it.

Are the wholly owned N64 games below 50MB in size? Maybe they would be available through XBLA?

You might see some modified versions of those games if Rare can be bothered. You won't be seeing the actual N64 roms emulated though unless Nintendo agreed to it.

 

[BlueTsunami]

but N64 games rarely went about 50Megs after compression or am I off here?

I think around 32MB was the norm but I could be wrong. I believe there was some type of compression invovled with the carts. There may very well be 50Meg+ N64 games though (not sure about Rare games though).

You might see some modified versions of those games if Rare can be bothered. You won't be seeing the actual N64 roms emulated though unless Nintendo agreed to it.

Thats exactly what I was thinking. It can't be straight emulated since Nintendo would have issues with that. The game would probably have to be reworked to work as a standalone game with the Xbox360 hardware.

 

[EndR]

Rare don't have to agree to anything for Goldeneye to be on the system, they don't own the license (obviously) and the game itself was produced by Nintendo. There



You might see some modified versions of those games if Rare can be bothered. You won't be seeing the actual N64 roms emulated though unless Nintendo agreed to it.

True!
If Rare can be bothered by it.. when the userbase of 360 grows then there might be some incentives to do so.. but at the moment, maybe not..

 

[fearsomepirate]

It doesn't matter whether or not Rare would be bothered. It matters whether or not Microsoft will be bothered, and obviously, X360 needs all the sales help it can get. Rereleasing popular games for a competing console won't help.

 

[Powderkeg]

Rare don't have to agree for Goldeneye to be on the system, they don't own the license and the game itself was produced by Nintendo.

Rare owns the game engine. (Same engine as Perfect Dark used) Nintendo only published the game, they don't own it.

And publishing deals are limited. If they wanted to re-publish the game for a different system than what their original contract called for they would have to renegotiate that contract, and that would require MS's approval.

You might see some modified versions of those games if Rare can be bothered. You won't be seeing the actual N64 roms emulated though unless Nintendo agreed to it.

They could simply port the titles to the 360. That's all it takes, and there is nothing Nintendo can say about it.

 

[c0_re]

I can't belvie anyone thinks people are going to pay to play these old games.

 

[BlueTsunami]

I can't belvie anyone thinks people are going to pay to play these old games.

People BUY and PLAY Joust and other old games on XBLA, whats so different about this? Nostalgia is a powerfull thing.

 

[Powderkeg]

People BUY and PLAY Joust and other old games on XBLA, whats so different about this? Nostalgia is a powerfull thing.

How many people do you think actually bought Joust? A couple of thousand?

 

[BlueTsunami]

How many people do you think actually bought Joust? A couple of thousand?

Not sure but the IPs Nintendo has accumulated over the years is going to make up a robust catalog of games. Virtual Console is supposed to span from Nintendo all the way up to N64 (with Revolution having direct Backwards Compatability with Gamecube). Also add in Sega and TurboGFX games (from a recent deal) into the mix. All that together should make up a good amount of sales.

Note: Supposedly XBLA has been a big hit, so the want for downloadable games (which Virtual Console actually is) seems to be there.

 

[Griffith]

They could simply port the titles to the 360. That's all it takes, and there is nothing Nintendo can say about it.

I think that they can port n64 titles very easly, and with better graphics, they can add msaa and hdr easly, for example, they can add fur shading easly to their engine, and port all rare'e n64 games in a new light via XBlive

 

[c0_re]

People BUY and PLAY Joust and other old games on XBLA, whats so different about this? Nostalgia is a powerfull thing.

OK for one thing 99.99% of marketplace games(Old and new) can be played online on Live w\voice with millions of other people. How many poeple do you think you are gonig to find playnig Joust online on the Nintendo equivelent Marketplace?

How many copies of thes old crappy gamses actually sell on marketplace even with the new features? In comparison to somthing like geometry wars or other much much more advanced High Deffinition Marketplace\arcade games that poeple actually play, well not to many.

Note: Supposedly XBLA has been a big hit, so the want for downloadable games (which Virtual Console actually is) seems to be there.

Yes but not because of old rehashed games from 1991, the sucessfull Arcade marketplace games are NEW and in HIGH DEFFINITION not old arcade games. Not to mention all these "IP's" are available for download free online I and many have the entire, NES, SNES, SegaMA, Genesis, TB16, Jaguar, N64, bla bla on our PC's or modded Xbox's. I mean probably 25% of these games are free to play online with Java sites. That combined with the fact that 360 owners have money to spend, the bulk of the Nintendo's fan base isn't even old enough to have a credit card.


I'm not saying they can't make money on it but they'll have to be pretty smart with their marketing and game choices, I don't think there's enough money in it to put that much effort into it and try to use it for a selling point for the system. To me it just reeks of desperation not "Innovation"

 

[Powderkeg]

Not sure but the IPs Nintendo has accumulated over the years is going to make up a robust catalog of games. Virtual Console is supposed to span from Nintendo all the way up to N64 (with Revolution having direct Backwards Compatability with Gamecube). Also add in Sega and TurboGFX games (from a recent deal) into the mix. All that together should make up a good amount of sales.

I think you are drastically overestimating the size of the "I want to play 20 year old games on my $200+ console" market.

This is a niche market. The only people who want NES games are long time, hard core Nintendo fans who have a thing for those old games. Small market, and isn't going to do a thing to bring new gamers to the system.

Note: Supposedly XBLA has been a big hit, so the want for downloadable games (which Virtual Console actually is) seems to be there.

The vast majority of games on XBL, and the best selling ones are all less than 3 years old. They are the exact same games that are very popular on MSN's gaming zone. The two most popular games so far are Hexic HD and Geomitry Wars 2, both relatively new games.

 

[BlueTsunami]

OK for one thing 99.99% of marketplace games(Old and new) can be played online on Live w\voice with millions of other people. How many poeple do you think you are gonig to find playnig Joust online on the Nintendo equivelent Marketplace?

How many copies of thes old crappy gamses actually sell on marketplace even with the new features? In comparison to somthing like geometry wars or other much much more advanced High Deffinition Marketplace\arcade games that poeple actually play, well not to many.

1) I'm not sure exactly how the games will be setup. It seems that its going to be a straight download process and playing the games directly off the Revolution Offline. Though, games spaning from NES to N64 wouldn't need to be Online.

2) Crappy old games? The sentiment may be held by you but I KNOW there has to be a market out there for older games (Super Mario Brothers 1-3, NES RPGs etc).

3) I'm not saying Virtual Console is XBLA in that Developers can develop games at low cost. I'm stating that the fact you can easily download games is a thing thats shared between the two systems and is a very good thing

Yes but not because of old rehashed games from 1991, the sucessfull Arcade marketplace games are NEW AND in HIGH DEFFINITION not old arcade games. Not tme mention all these "IP's" are available for download free online I and many others have the entire, NES, SNES, SegaMA, Genesis, TB16, Jaguar, N64, bla bla on our PC's or modded Xbox's. I mean proanbnly 25% of these games are free to play online with Java site.

YOU can emulate these games but the general consumer out there probably doesn't even care about Emulation on their PCs. The fact that you can play these old games on a newer hardware on your 15" - 60" TVs makes it a very attractive setup. You also have the added benefit of playing these games in the living room on a couch, with a controller instead of on your computer.

bulk of the Nintendo's fan base isn't even old enough to have a fanbase.

Thats an odd thing to say. The Nintendo name is known by my Parents and even my Grand Parents. I would say the mindspace Nintendo has with the consumer is much larger than Microsoft with Xbox. The fanbase may not be as concentrated as with Xbox but almost everyone knows who Nintendo is.

 

[c0_re]

Originally Posted by c0_re
bulk of the Nintendo's fan base isn't even old enough to have a fanbase.

DOH! That becauseI"m an idiot and I can't type without my coffee first, replace fanbase with credit card



I think Nintendo can be sucessfull this generation teir just going about it the wrong way IMO, I wish they would just stick to portables and become a 3rd party developer. They just can't compete financially with M$ or Sony especailly on the R&D front.

I mean hey I'll be the first in line to get Rev for Zelda as long as their cheap enough

 

[Teasy]

Rare owns the game engine. (Same engine as Perfect Dark used) Nintendo only published the game, they don't own it.

And publishing deals are limited. If they wanted to re-publish the game for a different system than what their original contract called for they would have to renegotiate that contract, and that would require MS's approval.

Rare owns nothing more then some IP (code). Nintendo owns the implimentation of that code in Goldeneye. As I said as long as Nintendo doesn't change the code (simply makes the original N64 rom available) there is nothing Rare or Microsoft can do about it.

They could simply port the titles to the 360. That's all it takes, and there is nothing Nintendo can say about it.

What did you think I meant by modified version?.. a port (which requires reprogramming the game), as in not the original N64 ROM.

This is a niche market. The only people who want NES games are long time, hard core Nintendo fans who have a thing for those old games. Small market, and isn't going to do a thing to bring new gamers to the system.

I can see why you might think that if you don't know many gamers, but its simply not the case. All sorts of gamers want these kind of older games. My PS2 owning friends are always asking if I can have a look for SNES/Megadrive/Amiga (ect) games for them. How much people will pay for them is another question entirely.