Reverend's NV3x architecture article

[Doomtrooper]

I very clearly remember Rev. getting labelled as 3dfx biased by Nvidia fans a few years ago. Now he's pro-Nvidia, eh? Do an article that's even remotely favorable toward one IHV's product

Show me a Matrox, ATI or any other IHV review he did besides Nvidia based product (since 3DFX went under) and maybe you have a point John.
Constant reporting from one IHV only doesn't exactly speak mounds for objectivity.

 

[Reverend]

Constant reporting of a IHV (or its products) means I have a good relationship with that IHV. I am proud of this fact, NVIDIA or other wise.

It so happens, of course, that you are pro-ATi (and definitely anti-NVIDIA) and you are either blind to this fact or you are stupid.

Not reporting on competitive IHVs does not mean I choose to not report on these IHVs.

I stated that non-NVIDIA IHVs have not been cooperative with me.

All of this has got nothing to do with the contents of my articles/reviews/etc. "Objectivity" comes from what you read in my articles, not which IHV I "exclusively" report on. Are my articles objective?

Is your skull that thick, DT, or are you that stupid or that incredibly blindly biased?

Last useless response before I crash.

 

[Joe DeFuria]

You're arguing for the sake of arguing... or for some other motivation.

I'm giving constructive criticism because you usually take it well. My motiviation is to see better and more informative articles coming from you. I'm sorry if you feel my critisicm is arguing for the sake of arguing. I stated what I liked and disliked about your presentation.

What NVIDIA briefed me on is "definitive" - they told me what they told me, it is "definite" that they told me what they told me.

Then why ask ATI anything at all. Is it "definitive" that R-300 doesn't support swizzling? CAN nVidia be "definitive" about their own product that insofar does not yet exist? I'm sure PR can "say" it's definitive....

Please learn the business. I am not about to quote "ATi told..." unless I ask the ATi engineer "Can I quote you as an official ATi statement?".

Please learn the businees?

IHey, I can certainly appreciate that situation with your contacts. However, I "know enough about the business" to know that PR presentations are often very misleading (ESPECIALLY when they contain info about competitive products) if not factually incorrect, and always present the best possible scenario to their own advantage.

And "engineers" typically give more of the straight answer than PR folk.

if other IHVs are not cooperative, there is nothing I can do, is there?

I don't know. Perhaps you need to "learn the business" a little better yourself, and they will cooperate. Sorry, but you deserved that one.

I "chose" not to write an article about the R300 instead of this article because ATi doesn't seem to think I'm important enough to be given a similar briefing. What do I do?

Exactly what you did. Does that mean I can't criticize what I think is "wrong" with the article?

 

[Andergum]

Why don't you people so obsessed with hating every article you read about Nvidia products just write your own articles about your favorite ATI products and quit whining all the time.

sheesh...

Do you guys work for ATI or are you heavy investors in ATI stock or something???

 

[Doomtrooper]

Constant reporting from one IHV may mean that to you, but to the General public it shows a distinct favorism towards one company not to mention other IHV visitors.
In fact looking at your website:

Markus Maki, CTO of MadOnion and Remedy Entertainment 08/20/01
Tim Sweeney on Max Payne, graphics tech and model animation 08/15/01
Tim Sweeney on Tile-Based Rendering 04/17/01
Gary Tarolli, Co-Founder of 3dfx, now with NVIDIA - Getting Personal 01/17/01
Dean Sekulic, Croteam Programmer/Designer for the game Serious Sam 01/09/01
Brian Burke, Senior PR Manager of NVIDIA 12/01/00
Gary Tarolli, Co-Founder of 3dfx Interactive 10/31/00
Chris Donahue, Developer Relations Manager for nVidia Corp 06/18/00
Tim Sweeney, Founder/Lead Programmer for Epic Megagames 03/31/00
Scott Sellers, Co-Founder of 3dfx Interactive 01/24/00
Keith Galocy, Developer Relations Manager for 3dfx Interactive 11/12/99
Gary Tarolli, Co-Founder of 3dfx Interactive 9/12/99
Ryan"Ridah"Feltrin, Programmer for Xatrix Entertainment 8/11/99
Mystery Anti-Aliasing methods? 12/06/01
Anisotropic Filtering Part 2 - GeForce3 05/20/01
Anisotropic Filtering Part 1 - GeForce3 05/19/01
Edge Anti-Aliasing - GeForce3 vs Voodoo5 05/15/01
Wicked3D eyeSCREAM Stereoscopic Technology - A quick take 03/22/01
Giants - GeForce2 vs Voodoo5 01/16/01
3dfx T-Buffer Technology Demos - EXCLUSIVE! 01/10/01
Reviewing video cards - How I approach it 09/28/00
Gary Tarolli/3dfx on T&L and vid card longevity 06/02/2000
FSAA/S3TC with nVidia 508 beta drivers - A look-see 03/08/00
16bit vs 32bit plus 22bit post filter - by Gary Tarolli of 3dfx 12/14/99
P3, Peltiers and stuff - by JoeM 11/22/99
Voodoo4/Voodoo5 Comdex99 Announcement - A Look-See 11/17/99
3dfx's T-Buffer - Its namesake, Gary Tarolli, explains 10/26/99
Framerates - A 3dfx White Paper 10/15/99
WickedGL vs 3dfx's ICD - Which has better Image Quality? 10/14/99
Some 3D buzzwords and what they mean in certain games 8/18/99
Wicked3D MiniGL - Is it better than 3dfx's? 8/14/99
Voodoo4/T-Buffer - A mini Scoop/Review 7/31/99
3dfx's 21 July 1999 Voodoo3 drivers - A Review 7/23/99
3dfx's MiniGL vs ICD driver - A Speed Comparison 5/10/99
A Value Proposition by Gary Tarolli/3dfx 10/28/98

Not one other interview with other IHV's, I don't even work for a website besides moderate a little and I have contacts at most IHV's ..I can't believe you can't get a interview from some ATI guys, Matrox or 3Dlabs.

 

[Hellbinder]

Regarding the NV3x/R300 comparisons. NVIDIA's briefing and the slides contain references/comparisons with the R300. I mention this and provide comments that refute certain aspects of what NVIDIA understands about the R300. This article is about the CineFX presentation + briefing. It is about what NVIDIA gave me. I report what they gave me. If I wanted to, I could have gone on a lot more about the R300 but, really, this article isn't about the R300. Capish?

No I capish just fine. Basically you have turned into a Nvidia PR pimp and have decided to join the lofty ranks of Anand, Ed and others. Congrats.

Notice no article from you on the R300 an exsisting piece of Hardware mere days from public release.. No instead you wtite and entire article about a Product 4 months away at best.. referencing how much better it is than the R300 as many times as you possibly can.

All very convienently as i said Mere days/hours before all the 9700 reviews start flooding in, and quakecon starts. You can try to paint this any color you want... But tis pretty clear to me what you are all about these days.

 

[Qroach]

...and you wonder why I keep telling DT to pipe down.

Basically you have turned into a Nvidia PR pimp

Oh great a classic Hellbinder post.

 

[MDolenc]

Is it "definitive" that R-300 doesn't support swizzling?

Of course R300 supports swizzling but you can not say mov r0, r1.rabg for example. That's called arbitrary swizzling.

 

[Joe DeFuria]

Of course R300 supports swizzling but you can not say mov r0, r1.rabg for example. That's called arbitrary swizzling.

Now here's a good exmaple. Assuming what you are saying is true, that explains the discrepancy between rev's "understanding" of R-300 (R-300 supports swizzling) and Nvidia's comparison (R-300 doesn't support swizzling.)

This is the type of thing that I would have liked to see come out of Rev's article....

 

[alexsok]

So what's new in that article anyway?

It's the paper available on Nvidia's website, fully examined and commented upon, a very good read, but it's all been around for a while, I expected at least some new tidbits!

 

[DemoCoder]

Constant reporting from one IHV may mean that to you, but to the General public it shows a distinct favorism towards one company not to mention other IHV visitors.
In fact looking at your website:


Gary Tarolli, Co-Founder of 3dfx Interactive 10/31/00
Scott Sellers, Co-Founder of 3dfx Interactive 01/24/00
Keith Galocy, Developer Relations Manager for 3dfx Interactive 11/12/99
Gary Tarolli, Co-Founder of 3dfx Interactive 9/12/99
Gary Tarolli/3dfx on T&L and vid card longevity 06/02/2000
16bit vs 32bit plus 22bit post filter - by Gary Tarolli of 3dfx 12/14/99
3dfx's T-Buffer - Its namesake, Gary Tarolli, explains 10/26/99
A Value Proposition by Gary Tarolli/3dfx 10/28/98


Not one other interview with other IHV's, I don't even work for a website besides moderate a little and I have contacts at most IHV's ..I can't believe you can't get a interview from some ATI guys, Matrox or 3Dlabs.

'Nuff Said'.

Yeah, you have "contacts" with most IHVs. Is that the support guy you called to help set up your video card, or your dad's brother's aunt's sister's best friend's cousin who works there?

 

[Kristof]

Is it "definitive" that R-300 doesn't support swizzling?

Of course R300 supports swizzling but you can not say mov r0, r1.rabg for example. That's called arbitrary swizzling.

Right, so what you say is that R300 only supports a "subset" of the possible swizzling combinations. Probably to save on encoding bits. Can anyone from ATI confirm this ?

K-

 

[Doomtrooper]

Oh I have lots Coder, more than you think... NV pom pom wav

 

[RussSchultz]

Now, now children. Lets not be snarky.

 

[Richthofen]

"
Why don't you people so obsessed with hating every article you read about Nvidia products just write your own articles about your favorite ATI products and quit whining all the time.

sheesh...

Do you guys work for ATI or are you heavy investors in ATI stock or something???
"

full ack!
nothin more to say.
It is his article and he does not have to defend anything. If people do not like it - well then do not read it

 

[McElvis]

move along, nothing to see here...

 

[Galilee]

Is it possible to mute people on this forum? I just wish I didnt have to read DT's and Hell's constant wartalk. Why don't you let Rev write his own stuff? and if you feel that there should be more Ati articles, write them yourself.

 

[Doomtrooper]

Is it possible to mute people on this forum? I just wish I didnt have to read DT's and Hell's constant wartalk. Why don't you let Rev write his own stuff? and if you feel that there should be more Ati articles, write them yourself.

And a pom pom wavey for you too

The old Nvnews group to the rescue.

 

[jb]

Hey Rev,

the article was not bad at all. People lets give Rev the benifit of the doubt. I dont have a problem with the article. It may have not painted the 100% absolute truth but it was close. Taken from the good ol B5 serries:

A vorlon once told me that Understanding is a three edge sword. There is your side. There is there side. Then there is the truth.

Lots of parallelism here. That being said I hope we can all calm down a bit....

 

[John Reynolds]

Sigh. I should've known better than to start this thread. I just thought I'd be nice by pointing the article out for those who don't visit VE on a regular basis (if at all).

Thread closed.