Question about Sony's tech demos vs. the real games.

[mckmas8808]

The KZ movie had, BTW, insane polygon counts, and this has been beaten to death several times already.

Laa-Yosh do you think its possible for Guriella to make a way to fully represent the video that they showed at E3? Keep in mind some people (I don't think you though) thought that Bandai couldn't possibly make a game that looked like the Gundam video showed at E3.

But Bandai is finding a way to make their game look like the E3 video. Please don't think that I'm trying to start an arugement or trying to troll. I really want to hear a person in your position (Laa Yosh) explain how Guriella could pull it off.

I think its possible, but since you work in the industry maybe you can explain in a more technical way how its possible.

 

[scooby_dooby]

If that is the case then I wonder why Sony and Nvidia talked about it so long at the conference? Not say that your wrong but why spend so much time talking about something if you know it isn't going to be used.

Umm for the same reason they spent time talking about 1080p output knowing full well that every TV on the market only upscales from 1080i...

The biggest problem with the KZ demo is it looks like a movie. It doesn't look like a game, HS looked like a game, like someone is actually playing, Wardevil also looks like someone is actually playing. The first Gundam looked like a movie, then the newest trailer released looks like someone is actually laying.

Is it really hard it tell the CG from the In-game stuff? I find it pretty damn obvious what is CG and what is in-game.

 

[Mefisutoferesu]

A thing to note about bandai being able to pull that kind of a difference between generations... the PS2 isn't the most developer friendly enviroment in the world. Perhaps the stark difference is perceptable ability might have more to do with the EASE of programming for the PS3 rather than the potential the PS3 offers. Mabe it is potential, but I'm just trying to point out it isn't so simple as saying if they can do this now, they'll be able to do much better down the line. Difficulties in programing could be enough.

 

[zidane1strife]

Umm for the same reason they spent time talking about 1080p output knowing full well that every TV on the market only upscales from 1080i...

The biggest problem with the KZ demo is it looks like a movie. It doesn't look like a game, HS looked like a game, like someone is actually playing, Wardevil also looks like someone is actually playing. The first Gundam looked like a movie, then the newest trailer released looks like someone is actually laying.

Is it really hard it tell the CG from the In-game stuff? I find it pretty damn obvious what is CG and what is in-game.

If final KZ differs from the cg-concept in the same way the Gundam demo does, and in the same way the latest Wardevil footage/pics does from the prior cg-concept footage, they'd have delivered.(edit: also let's not forget that, IIRC, both HS and wardevil are aiming at 1080p, so if both manage to deliver then it won't be so outlandish.)

Personally, iirc, the clothing of most characters did not move(the ones that moved were not that far from today's clothing animation), so they can simply use normal maps for most char.s bodies, environment wise I don't see the problem(there were even some slightly-blurry textures here and there.). The high-poly faces are only likely to be done for extreme-close-ups during cutscenes and the rest of the chaos was something, I think, shouldn't be beyond something like cell's abilities.

Lighting's the only question remaining, will they be able to fake it? Does the rsx have some special-nougaty tricks to help bring such about? At worst we'll see a slight hit there, IMO.

 

[mckmas8808]

If final KZ differs from the cg-concept in the same way the Gundam demo does, and in the same way the latest Wardevil footage/pics does from the prior cg-concept footage, they'd have delivered.(edit: also let's not forget that, IIRC, both HS and wardevil are aiming at 1080p, so if both manage to deliver then it won't be so outlandish.

This is a great point. Remember they did say rendered to spec. Obviously Bandai were rendering to spec with their video at E3. Obviously Digi-Guys were able to do exactly what they did in their video from last year so...

 

[BTOA]

Both wireframe shots are from Zbrush, an application widely used for sculpting million-polygon models (we also have a Maya-to-Zbrush pipeline here). Neither wireframes are from a realtime engine. And probably both games are using only a few thousand polygons per character.
Upping poly count has other ramifications, from shadow rendering to skinning and such. Don't expect a jump of three orders of magnitude (ie. from thousands to millions)...

I can't see how the two images and this are related...

The Koei demo showed a render of a face before applying normal mapping, which looked similar to the project offset engine before being mapped. When the demo was running it had HDR lighting and looked amazing. I'm sure that it was running with a FP16 engine, and its my wishful thinking that the PS3 can handle HDR FP16 with no problem once the final hardware is completed.

BTW, The Gundam E3 demo was a remake of the Mobile Suit Gundam: Journey to Jaburo intro, but was changed in some areas.

 

[jvd]

Then we should shut the fuck up talking bullshit alltogether about the next gen console games... PGR3, Gears Of War, Killzone, Motorstorm, 99 Nights... all those discussions should be classified bs
No footage yet shown for any next gen console has been on real hardware.
...all those threads speculating and discussing the games in their devkit states... pointless and utter bullshit...

Full auto was shown on beta kits at the award show . Gears of war was shown on a sli 6800ultra rig in real time we already know it ran on x800s and nv40s 2 e3s ago now


Anyway killzone has been said by the developer to be a representation of what hte game will look and play with in an interview with ign. I don't know why people are still going on about it .