PS5 Pro *spawn

[XboxKING]

I am already very content with PS5 and Series X performance, normally after nearly 4 years you’d have many effect missing, often atrocious framerates, low resolution not to mention low textures and overal you could see from a single screenshot comparison which is the console version.

Whereas now you’d need to slow the footage down and zoom 200-300% and point at an edge to explain which is which, with the consoles often doing the ultra textures.

This brings me to my point, is the PS5 pro actually needed? Never has the difference in direct x and shader levels been smaller compared to the current generation.

Also the SSD was already excellent 4 years ago so loading times are also not a reason to switch platforms, nor upgrade to the “pro” or “Scorpio” equivalent

If the price point remains the same and the older ps5 and series X drop in price, then it makes sense to just have that little extra for the enthusiasts that could be the only reason

 

[techuse]

I am already very content with PS5 and Series X performance, normally after nearly 4 years you’d have many effect missing, often atrocious framerates, low resolution not to mention low textures and overal you could see from a single screenshot comparison which is the console version.

Whereas now you’d need to slow the footage down and zoom 200-300% and point at an edge to explain which is which, with the consoles often doing the ultra textures.

This brings me to my point, is the PS5 pro actually needed? Never has the difference in direct x and shader levels been smaller compared to the current generation.

Also the SSD was already excellent 4 years ago so loading times are also not a reason to switch platforms, nor upgrade to the “pro” or “Scorpio” equivalent

If the price point remains the same and the older ps5 and series X drop in price, then it makes sense to just have that little extra for the enthusiasts that could be the only reason

All of this is because the majority of developers are only releasing higher resolution last gen games. This is, without a doubt, the worst console generation. If PS5 pro can put FSR away for good, it will at least have been of some use.

 

[Seanspeed]

This brings me to my point, is the PS5 pro actually needed?

Like 70% of this entire topic is basically going over that question. lol

I think general consensus, at least among gaming enthusiasts who would be most likely to be interested in this, is that the main appeal is going to be 60fps modes that dont require drastic resolution cuts. Much has been made of how many games are 60fps this generation on PS5/XSX, but you'll not uncommonly need to pay a fairly noticeable price in terms of image quality for it. Having a genuinely good reconstruction method as rumored would go a long way in fixing this issue on top of the moderate GPU power increase.

But I also think most people would have been fine with the PS5 Pro never existing. There certainly isn't the same case for it as there was the PS4 Pro/XB1X.

I dont see any chance that price will be the same as base consoles. I'm expecting $499 for a non-disc model. Not amazing, but a small enough premium that it'll have a market.

 

[Karamazov]

I need it to get rid of frame interpolation in psvr2 games.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

This brings me to my point, is the PS5 pro actually needed? Never has the difference in direct x and shader levels been smaller compared to the current generation.

That's not a very useful discussion here as needed by whom for what? The reason it exists is because Sony hopes to make money selling to people who want it. Luxury goods are never 'needed'.

I think the real question, and certainly for this thread, is what areas are the current consoles notably weak where the skills-gap can be plugged with a hardware update? RT would be one, although without the software to back it, it may not see much use. VR is another - NMS on PSVR2 is apparently still pixelated and it'd take a Pro upgrade to make it renderer nicely. Finally, running 'quality modes' like they are 'performance modes' is an immediate win and of value to the enthusiast with spare cash, even if not terribly exciting.

 

[XboxKING]

That's not a very useful discussion here as needed by whom for what? The reason it exists is because Sony hopes to make money selling to people who want it. Luxury goods are never 'needed'.

I think the real question, and certainly for this thread, is what areas are the current consoles notably weak where the skills-gap can be plugged with a hardware update? RT would be one, although without the software to back it, it may not see much use. VR is another - NMS on PSVR2 is apparently still pixelated and it'd take a Pro upgrade to make it renderer nicely. Finally, running 'quality modes' like they are 'performance modes' is an immediate win and of value to the enthusiast with spare cash, even if not terribly exciting.

It was merely a general observation of different platforms not being differentiated as much as they used to. Imagine if PS5 and Series X could not do any form of hardware accelerated ray tracing for example; that would be a clear reason to upgrade as it would bring a visual difference beyond image quality or framerate

For me i would sell my current gen PS5 as it will be 4 years old and out of warranty and essentially pay 2-300 euro to have a pro with a new controller and new batteries and whatnot and also 2 years of extra warranty. Which would personally be worth it even if the pro didn’t offer any performance increase and only have better cooling or a smaller overall package

 

[XboxKING]

I need it to get rid of frame interpolation in psvr2 games.

Personally if GT7VR on the Pro is as sharp as it’s interface then it will be an instant buy

 

[jlippo]

I need it to get rid of frame interpolation in psvr2 games.

Jump to 90hz mode in more games would certainly be nice improvement.

 

[Globalisateur]

I think that's well outside the scope of this thread, the relevant thing is that while 30fps only games are rare now, they do exist, and Starfield was one for months and when it was racking up it's initial sales.

PS5 Pro has a very limited CPU bump, and only then if you surrender a little GPU boost headroom. If games start to move to 30fps only on PS5 due to the CPU, Pro won't be able to do anything to change that.

We are 4 years in the generation right now. Anytime now.

 

[function]

We are 4 years in the generation right now. Anytime now.

Well fingers crossed, 60 fps modes are a great thing.

This could be a long generation though, and if PS5Pro is approximately "mid gen" and we don't get PS6 till ~2028, we could start to see the desire to push games (particularly on the PC) lead to minimum processing requirements that mean 60 fps is no longer reliable/manageable on PS5/XBS. You don't need to dip all the way down to 30, just enough below 60 enough of the time to make a 60 fps mode unworkable or undesireable.

A lower overhead API will help of course, and already is helping, but whether it's scripting or a render thread or physics or updating an RT BVH, I think the challenges to 60 fps modes grow as the generation goes on.

 

[Seanspeed]

We are 4 years in the generation right now. Anytime now.

Developers seem largely uninterested in using these CPU's to actually push things. It's a huge shame, and a big reason this generation feels fairly underwhelming in my opinion.

I really thought there'd have at least been some tentpole release showing off what could be done and showing that 30fps is still 'worth it' for the benefits, but nobody has really done so yet. GTAVI may be that title, but it's coming quite a bit later in the generation than I thought it would.

 

[Sonic]

I appreciate the amount of 60 fps in games even though it's alleged that most gamers would rather have 20 fps strobe light slideshow and shiny graphics. But nay, I don't blame a lack of 30 fps games on the stagnation of titles at those frame rates. Maybe if the RT modes included more than just shadows or reflections it would be the preferred way for gamers to play. But the data seems to suggest that 60 fps has caught on with a large swathe of console gamers. At least according to those actually helping develop console hardware.

 

[Globalisateur]

Developers seem largely uninterested in using these CPU's to actually push things. It's a huge shame, and a big reason this generation feels fairly underwhelming in my opinion.

I really thought there'd have at least been some tentpole release showing off what could be done and showing that 30fps is still 'worth it' for the benefits, but nobody has really done so yet. GTAVI may be that title, but it's coming quite a bit later in the generation than I thought it would.

I think the main reason is we have definitely reached some real diminishing returns level where 60fps can look better than 30fps if done well (in motion as most games should be compared, for the majority of gamers). I do think Horizon Forbidden West showed it on PS5. I think some of those well done reconstruction methods allowed this and I see no reason why we should get back now. More like we are on the road to the 120fps level right now. Going above 4K doesn't make much sense now for IQ reasons.

 

[Seanspeed]

I think the main reason is we have definitely reached some real diminishing returns level where 60fps can look better than 30fps if done well (in motion as most games should be compared, for the majority of gamers). I do think Horizon Forbidden West showed it on PS5. I think some of those well done reconstruction methods allowed this and I see no reason why we should get back now. More like we are on the road to the 120fps level right now. Going above 4K doesn't make much sense now for IQ reasons.

Developers are still barely scratching the surface of what can be done with more CPU power. They just dont seem to care. Or perhaps I'm being too harsh on the devs themselves, cuz I wouldn't be surprised if it's just that publishers aren't greenlighting any developer pitches that involve more ambitious game design. Everything has to be safe safe safe.

When I talk about what can be done with 30fps, I'm talking more than just graphics.

I appreciate the amount of 60 fps in games even though it's alleged that most gamers would rather have 20 fps strobe light slideshow and shiny graphics. But nay, I don't blame a lack of 30 fps games on the stagnation of titles at those frame rates. Maybe if the RT modes included more than just shadows or reflections it would be the preferred way for gamers to play. But the data seems to suggest that 60 fps has caught on with a large swathe of console gamers. At least according to those actually helping develop console hardware.

I'm not talking about just pushing ray tracing harder or some nonsense like that. That's not what I mean by 'pushing things at 30fps'. I'm talking using the CPU's to push game design ambitions. It was understandable in the XB1/PS4 era that game design didn't take huge leaps, cuz the CPU's were kinda weak. This generation could have been different, though.

That said, there is certainly a fair bit more graphically that could be done with a 33.3ms budget as well. And again, not talking just pushing ray tracing harder. While diminishing returns exist, we're still nowhere near the point where there isn't still huge improvements to be made in graphics, dealing with things like draw distances, LODs/pop-in, sheer density of detail, massive (actually intelligent) NPC counts, or having things like physicalized objects that can break and whatnot even if they aren't part of any kind of gameplay mechanic/design or whatever.

 

[Karamazov]

8 years ago today, ps meeting presenting the PS4 pro was announced.

 

[Globalisateur]

8 years ago today, ps meeting presenting the PS4 pro was announced.

View attachment 11836

Not quite. 7 years 11 months ago!

 

[davis.anthony]

8 years ago today, ps meeting presenting the PS4 pro was announced.

How quick has that time gone, only seems like yesterday I walked to Argos and bought mine

 

[I'mDudditz!]

How are they rendering a minimum of 70% more pixels from a 45% increase in GPU power? (1270p vs 1700p).

Because resolution doesn't scale 1:1 with overall rendering performance. It will vary from game to game

We will see. From credible insiders, RDNA4 is just the current core with improved ray tracing. And that improved RT (whatever that is) is what's being bolted onto the PS Pro. In general though, you're right, I'm expecting around 7800xt levels of RT perf as a best case for PS Pro

7800xt at best??? Yeah, this will age like spoiled milk, at best.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

It's not really intended to 'age'. It's supposed to provide ancient PS5 standards with a little more pep; not go toe-to-toe with the best a PC has to offer. Success criteria will be 'does PS5Pro make notably better pretties than PS5'.

 

[Globalisateur]

It's not really intended to 'age'. It's supposed to provide ancient PS5 standards with a little more pep; not go toe-to-toe with the best a PC has to offer. Success criteria will be 'does PS5Pro make notably better pretties than PS5'.

It doesn't matter. For years people will find ways to compare PS5 Pro with 7800xt using the right game (for instance without dedicated RT, PS5 BC running on PS5 Pro will be a very easy way for that). Some youtubers succeeded at comparing PS5 with 1060 after it released using a few cherry picked games / scenes.