Can they get away with it though? It’s one thing to cater to a few gamers with deep pockets when you already have a ton of volume going to crypto. I don’t think there are enough price insensitive gamers to replace that crypto volume and that’s exactly why prices are cratering now.
Nvidia Shows Signs in [2022]
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Can they get away with it though? It’s one thing to cater to a few gamers with deep pockets when you already have a ton of volume going to crypto. I don’t think there are enough price insensitive gamers to replace that crypto volume and that’s exactly why prices are cratering now.
Oh yea, they can get away with it. They know how to play their gaming market for all its worth.
You listening to people talking right now? People have spent thousands on GPUs in the past 2 years... They see a $1500 4080 that's like 2x faster than their 3080 that they spent $1200+ on a year and a bit ago... it starts to look like a good deal. They want that power, and then they're also worried crypto could come back and raise prices massively again.
After the crap I've seen for the past 2 years, $2000 for a top of the line GPU that smokes everything else is a god damn deal.
You completely forget that with the current world crisis + couple bubling under would-be-crisises(spelling?), people aren't throwing money around like they did just few months back. I would add a lot more about it here but it's really more suited to another subforum here.
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How many people though? Enough to replace crypto revenue?
Well they haven't sold FE cards on their store for a long time, it goes to BestBuy, their official FE partner. They weren't allowed to raise the prices of the FE cards, but it was a slow trickle of GPUs to BestBuy. Then Nvidia allowed them to paywall the FE cards behind a BestBuy subscription.
Its not short term. They have ordered these wafers and components last year. nVidia want to sell to gamers. So they have to overproduce their GPUs to get something into the hands of gamers. Now we have a new time with higher interests, a looming recession, a much smaller crypto market and one year old orders which has been overpaid by nVidia.
DegustatoR
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The results of 1Q23 clearly says that they can't.
arandomguy
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The majority of people willing to pay mining level prices for graphics cards to game on in the last 1.5 years were doing so due to being able to offset the cost difference via mining on the side and/or the increased resale value of their existing graphics card. This might seem surprising to some but don't be surprised if a lot of gamers themselves actually came out ahead with the mining situation. A clear cut example of this is people who chose to upgrade basically for free with 5700/xt to 6700xt.
There will of course be less price sensitive buyers in general and always has been (people complain about high prices for single graphics cards now, but where do you think the triple/quad GPU buyers of years past went?) and product segments for those. However the market for the majority as shifted with alternatives. There will competition from existing cards. There will competition with actual console availability. There will be competition from general discretionary spending (as compared to the covid situation, "gamers" were competing against people stuck at home who used to spend elsewhere). The macro situation is simply different.
Demand will be down for sure, but pricing will be more complicated. Do you try to capture as much as you can from shrinking demand? Do you try to induce more demand via lowering price? It's not that simple.
One thing to note is that there is a tendency for people to get trapped into too narrow of lens within their own basically social circles. Hardware enthusiast for example tend to view the entire GPU market through a similar lens and assume everything is like that. But most buyers aren't actually excited about the fact a new GPU puts out say 2x the FPS. They buy based on whether or not they feel there is a direct translatable functional need (unless they are maybe in the "high roller" segment). So a GPU that say does put out 2x the FPS at way higher prices isn't really attractive unless that is communicable as an actual functional benefit.
Nvidia selling FE cards directly from their website doesn't ensure that it ends up with gamers, not sure why anyone would think this was the case? Miner's were not just very large scale operations buying at the distributor or higher level. Small-mid size mining operations had to buy lower including at retail.
There will of course be less price sensitive buyers in general and always has been (people complain about high prices for single graphics cards now, but where do you think the triple/quad GPU buyers of years past went?) and product segments for those. However the market for the majority as shifted with alternatives. There will competition from existing cards. There will competition with actual console availability. There will be competition from general discretionary spending (as compared to the covid situation, "gamers" were competing against people stuck at home who used to spend elsewhere). The macro situation is simply different.
Demand will be down for sure, but pricing will be more complicated. Do you try to capture as much as you can from shrinking demand? Do you try to induce more demand via lowering price? It's not that simple.
One thing to note is that there is a tendency for people to get trapped into too narrow of lens within their own basically social circles. Hardware enthusiast for example tend to view the entire GPU market through a similar lens and assume everything is like that. But most buyers aren't actually excited about the fact a new GPU puts out say 2x the FPS. They buy based on whether or not they feel there is a direct translatable functional need (unless they are maybe in the "high roller" segment). So a GPU that say does put out 2x the FPS at way higher prices isn't really attractive unless that is communicable as an actual functional benefit.
Nvidia selling FE cards directly from their website doesn't ensure that it ends up with gamers, not sure why anyone would think this was the case? Miner's were not just very large scale operations buying at the distributor or higher level. Small-mid size mining operations had to buy lower including at retail.
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DegustatoR
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The biggest trap people fall into when they talk about "GPU price increases" is the constant comparisons between completely different products only because they are "from the same series".
This has to stop already as comparing "3070" to "4070" only because both of these have "70" in their purely made up names with zero actual meaning has about the same sense to it as comparing 4070 to a Ti 4400 - because of the same reason.
Once you stop looking at names and start to look at things which actually matter - performance and features you get for the price, the increase in these some new product brings with it to its price range - you start looking at the market as it is instead of being a tool for marketing guys who want you to pay more for the "new model of the same series" - because that's their job.
This has to stop already as comparing "3070" to "4070" only because both of these have "70" in their purely made up names with zero actual meaning has about the same sense to it as comparing 4070 to a Ti 4400 - because of the same reason.
Once you stop looking at names and start to look at things which actually matter - performance and features you get for the price, the increase in these some new product brings with it to its price range - you start looking at the market as it is instead of being a tool for marketing guys who want you to pay more for the "new model of the same series" - because that's their job.
Tail end of the 30 series generation after gamers already bought their expensive as hell GPUs.. in the same year when a new generation of GPUs is set to release.. of course the ones who are going to spend big money on GPUs already did long before... and now they're waiting for the 40 series to do it again.
DegustatoR
Veteran
Most games seem to be buying 30 series GPUs only now. The rest of them spent months if not years trying to find one at a reasonable price. What does that tell us? To me it seems that crypto induced prices were not sustainable for gaming customers.
Or they are waiting to buy 50-100% faster GPUs for the same money. "GPUs" there means anything from $200 and up, not just "4090Ti" only.
Pretty sure the $200 and lower range cards aren't set to release this year.
And yeah... the same money they paid for the previous gen cards... hundreds of dollars overpriced.
DegustatoR
Veteran
Yep. Which is why some people are buying 3060 and lower cards now for MSRP.
There are literally no "insane prices" to speak about at the moment and there are no reasons why this would change with 40 series.
Agreed. Even increases due to inflation would not bring about any "insane pricing" for 40 series.
What's insane pricing to you?
Crypto pricing. Inflation would increase prices but not to the extreme of the crypto craze.
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Give me some numbers.
Basically what do you expect the 4090/4080 to cost?
There's inflation... and then Nvidiflation on top of that.
I'd like to see the MSRP for the 4090 to be $1200+ and the 4080 $800+ though memory configuration will effect the price upward. With ongoing price drops (temporary inventory clearance) I think Nvidia is signaling pricing for Ada will be lower. I don't anticipate any large price tier increase due to performance over previous generation, ie (4070 Ti performance on par with 3090 Ti).
I can't find it right now but there was a price graph at 3DCenter.org that showed introductory prices since inception with each generation and the increases seemed within reason.
We'll see. I'm skeptical.
I think they will bump it up and they'll say "You want cheaper GPUs? We've got some for you.. the 30 series.
Anyway I hope you're right.
DegustatoR
Veteran
Which is also fine in a situation where many people are still using 10 and 20 series because of miners.
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