A1xLLcqAgt0qc2RyMz0y
Veteran
S|A validates Fudzilla's original article on the GTX 780, 770 and 760Ti
As much as it pains me to mention anything S|A an article on that site (you will have to read past the anti-Nvidia rant and bile in it) clearly validates Fudzilla's original article on the GTX 780, 770 and 760Ti.
Geforce GTX 780, 770 coming in May
http://www.fudzilla.com/home/item/31167-geforce-gtx-780-770-coming-in-may
Question: What and when will AMD have anything to counter these parts (especially the GTX 780)?
Question is about hardware only not talking bundles.
As much as it pains me to mention anything S|A an article on that site (you will have to read past the anti-Nvidia rant and bile in it) clearly validates Fudzilla's original article on the GTX 780, 770 and 760Ti.
Geforce GTX 780, 770 coming in May
http://www.fudzilla.com/home/item/31167-geforce-gtx-780-770-coming-in-may
Question: What and when will AMD have anything to counter these parts (especially the GTX 780)?
Question is about hardware only not talking bundles.
UniversalTruth
Veteran
In the end of the year or in the beginning of next?
Maybe more in the end of Q3 .. I imagine they have do this delay for release faster the next generation of what could have been expected. Specially if now Nvidia is coming with "new GPU's" . I dont know exactly, at first, Nvidia was just to release Titan. Now they release a new lineup, AMD is maybe just waiting that.
Now the problem is if they release a card who is only equivalent to Titan on October-December, And Nvidia is coming with Maxwell 5-6 months later. And there again, Nvidia will have the possibility to adapt their lineup Performances on all level vs the AMD ones.
iMacmatician
Regular
There are the rumored Hainan and Curacao parts (and Aruba = 2x Curacao) that may be released later this year.
Hainan is around a double Bonaire (1792 SPs, 256-bit bus) and that should reach low-mid GK104 territory (going by these charts).
Curacao supposedly has 2560 SPs and I'm not sure what they'll do with the memory (since they're already at 6 Gbps and I doubt they'll go larger than a 384-bit bus). I guess that the high-end Curacao would be somewhere around the 780 in terms of performance.
I'm not sure if any of the initial Maxwell part(s) will be higher performing than Titan, although (as you also say) they can use those parts to make their lineup more competitive overall.
UniversalTruth
Veteran
Oh, the mid range Maxwell will 100% be faster than Titan. Unless they rebadge a 100-150 mm^2 as high-end part, there is no chance of what you claim.
DuckThor Evil
Legend
Incredible...
boxleitnerb
Regular
Not necessarily if Maxwell is released at 28nm first as was suggested as a possibility before.
A1xLLcqAgt0qc2RyMz0y
Veteran
Later this year is still 28nm for both AMD and Nvidia.
AMD finally released their dual HD 7990 so I doubt they will release another dual GPU card this year so scrub the Aruba for 2013.
You seem to expect Curacao to compete with the low end Titan (GK110) yet Curacao will still be on 28nm. To compete with the GK110 AMD would have to produce 550 sqmm parts like the GK110 and be able to stay below 300 watts.
Maybe next year when 20nm comes available but no way can or will AMD produce a 28nm competitor this year to the GK110.
Why not?
DuckThor Evil
Legend
There is no chance in hell that a mid range Maxwell at 20nm would be 100% faster than Titan. a Midrange Maxwell should probably be around 2x transistors of GK104 or little more, so around the same ball bark as Titan, but would have to be 2x or more in performance... yeah right. GK104 is a very good chip, but it isn't even close to being 2x 580. Ti 560 wasn't even close to being 2x GTX 285.
They no doubt could, but they won't, they don't see the point in monolithic chips. Next gen will be most likely 20nm, they shouldn't have any issues making chip faster than GK110 with it without going monolithic chips.
He meant it will definately be faster than Titan, not 100% faster.
I'm still not sure I agree with that though. High end Maxwell will obviously be faster but mid range (860Ti level at best) I'm not so sure.
I'm not so sure. The 7970Ghz may be a lot smaller than Titan but there's not much difference in TDP. How could AMD bump up performance by 30% without going above 250w?
DuckThor Evil
Legend
Yeah I misread it, sorry about that. Typically the new mid range chip has been faster than the old big chip and I expect that to be the case again, but Titan is quite a beast... We'll see
I hope it's true but if the 760Ti is basically just a rebranded 670 then Titan will be around 50% faster than it. And I'm not sure we'll get a 50% performance improvement between the 760Ti and 860Ti. It's possible but I wouldn't put money on it.
They probably canned 10-15% faster last October because it wasn't good enough for a refresh. Beating Titan on TDP won't be easy but then again if it's as fast and half the price who is gonna care over 20W?
We won't see anything until very late Q4 or more likely, Q1 2014 at CES anyway. I'll be surprised if the 8970 isn't at least as fast as Titan by then.
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The architecture are a bit different and balanced differently. GCN is closer of GK110 of GK104, but in term of SP is just in between. Titan when running in "game mode" is running more like a GK104 with 2688SP with a larger memory bus and cache. ( im not even sure the bump on other parts are for a lot in term of gain )
- Titan have low speed core but with many shaders count ( compared to kepler ), ROPs, and is way bigger.
- When TDP of the Titan is fixed and the turbo limit not, GCN dont run anyway at 250W ( max board power ).. in general the card run largely under of it. ( same for Titan, but the difference is smaller with the limit fixed ) ( just because Ghz edition have a fixed max clock speed, TDP vary a lot )
- GCN run with a good amount of shaders, a bit limited on ROPs, and is smaller, but the clock speed is way higher.
- The difference in DP Tflops is not big, and GCN have an higher SP Tflops count. ( dont forget they are not at ~ 1/3, but 1/4 )
- memory controller side, they are both using a 384bits bus. ( Titan come with 6gb ofc )
- Titan benefit too of his massive L2 cache.
AMD dont need a 500mm2 chips for goes after Titan... A bigger chips of GCN yes, but no need to go on the 520mm2 ( SP is not what take the most place anyway in a chip )..
Higher Rops count + rethink a bit the cache + more SP + Tweaks on efficiency on some parts.. For be honest, i dont think there's really a lot of problem for AMD to come with a ~ 416-450mm2 chips ( depend the process ).
For the first time since a long time, i have the feeling AMD and Nvidia have 2 architectures very similar in term of Shaders performance ( can even put GK104 in the equation for get the whole idea ). . I can imagine the difference will be really low if GCN had 2560SP ( 40CU ) and at lower clock speed for reduce the TDP ( First 7970 was running in the 160 to 190W mostly in games at 925mhz, The GHZ edition take a big bump on TDP due to his higher Vcore 1250mv instead of 1112-1117mv ).
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iMacmatician
Regular
I was assuming this when I wrote my post, and forgot to put it in. Sorry about that….
Why would they? Curacao doesn't need to compete against a full GK110, it only needs to compete against a GK110 with (if the rumors are true) 2 SMXs and 1 memory interface disabled.
