NV50 being optimized for UnrealEngine 3?

[PaulS]

I for one enjoy choice, the PC platform is supposed to be open..always was. Now it is IHVs paying XXX amount of cash to make the other IHVs look inferior. In the end the consumer is the loser here, especially if you don't have the super duper anti-matter powered video card that is sponsoring the title, then you won't see the 'special effects'....the product we as the consumer is 'the effects' it is intangable but still is the product itself.

...did you read any of this thread?

It's likely, almost certain, that it's nothing sinister. Epic and the IHVs work closely together anyway, and the IHVs want to know what direction Epic are heading, and vice versa. This is no different to ATi and nVidia having Doom 3 optimisations in the hardware. They want their next-next generation products to work well with the software that's going to be around when they debut, so obviously they'll try and work in some hardware that's going to help a big engine like Unreal.

No idea where you're heading with your comment, since it doesn't seem to have any basis in reality or this discussion.

 

[Doomtrooper]

Ok I will make it simple for you then, Optimizing for one IHV in the PC industry will increase warez movement greatly.


Thankyou.

P.s I obviousally read better then some.

 

[micron]

No idea where you're heading with your comment, since it doesn't seem to have any basis in reality or this discussion.

That applies to 99% of the comments he makes....just ignore him

 

[V3]

It's bad business. Unless you can guarentee a near monopoly as MS has on the home desktop.

You don't get monopoly, by sitting silently. This could be NV ploy for monopoly, or they're just taking care of their customers.

If this is a blunder on NV side, so be it, they'll go the way of the Dodo.

 

[3dilettante]

After reading Uttar's last editorial, the thought occurred to me that maybe this is just the result of some Nvidia manager promising some intern at Epic the moon.

Perhaps it's not even a marketing ploy or power grab, but simply more evidence of fragmentary communications and infighting.

Of the three possibilities that I can think of: mis-statement of a general optimization of a method, much like how Ultrashadow is sometimes considered a Doom3 optimization, even though it is available to anyone willing to use it; evidence of actual hardware dedication to a specific program, or signs of internal miscommunication--I think the most preferable one would be a marketing slip-up.

 

[Eolirin]

It's likely, almost certain, that it's nothing sinister. Epic and the IHVs work closely together anyway, and the IHVs want to know what direction Epic are heading, and vice versa. This is no different to ATi and nVidia having Doom 3 optimisations in the hardware. They want their next-next generation products to work well with the software that's going to be around when they debut, so obviously they'll try and work in some hardware that's going to help a big engine like Unreal.

Doomtrooper was following a discussion thread that's spun off from the main topic. He's effectively OT, but he wasn't saying anything that didn't make sense given what he was talking about. Currently there are several games, which Doomtrooper pointed out, that do exactly what he's complaining about.

 

[Arun]

After reading Uttar's last editorial, the thought occurred to me that maybe this is just the result of some Nvidia manager promising some intern at Epic the moon.

Actually, I personally believe the whole thing is rather legitimate. How much it is being exaggerated though, I don't know.

I'd say this is extremely similar to how IDSoftware had input into the NV35 design: remember "UtlraShadow" was a direct request of the man himself; John Carmack. And NVIDIA implemented it.
Why do you think ID seems to love NVIDIA so much?

I'd say this is similar. Nothing big. But considering the monumentum Epic currently has, NVIDIA must have asked them to say they're contributing to the NV50 design, which would in fact be true.


I'd say Marketing making it look bigger than it already is, perhaps without understanding it's not all that big ( although when it comes to that, they GENERALLY still got a slight clue ). Eh.


Uttar

 

[3dilettante]

I can see the sense in having developers who work with the latest 3d features having an input in a chip's design.

I concur that the "UnrealEngine 3 specific optimizations" is overstating the situation that exists, or at least I hope it is.

I don't know how I'd feel if in the future the NV50 die plot has UnrealEngine3 and Doom4 execution units.

 

[Pete]

I'd say this is extremely similar to how IDSoftware had input into the NV35 design: remember "UtlraShadow" was a direct request of the man himself; John Carmack. And NVIDIA implemented it.
Why do you think ID seems to love NVIDIA so much?

I seem to remember a certain J. Carmack pushing for 64-bit color, too. What do you know, the FX line seems to like FP16 a lot more than FP32.

 

[vb]

64 bit IS fp16

 

[Sxotty]

That was his point friend...

And it is a humorous one at that...well b/c Nv did it and now everyone is mad that it isn't enough, but I bet that is why J.C. couldn't care less whether he has fp34, or fp16 since he specifically asked for fp16...it is actually amazing he can push things forward so much, and I am happy that software people can.

 

[vb]

my bad

But, still, he asked for 64 bits integer. This is asking for 16 bits precision per color. nvidia is oferring, what, TEN? Range is a non existant problem on Carmack engines. They are too dark.

Hdr outdoors?
what outdoors?

Meanwhile Ati is oferring 16 bit precision procesing (whether you want it or not) + range

 

[Xmas]

bits of mantissa != "precision"

 

[bloodbob]

Yeah there is 10 bits of precision between power ranges 2^X and 2^(X-1) so there is 10 bits of precision in the range 2.0-1.0 when you go between two ranges I don't know how high the precision would scale if you can quantifiy it at all.

What I think carmack wants is 16 bits RAMDACs as well as ample intermediate precision.

I tell you I can still see the yuckness of 8 bit compontents in various situations espically when having a single hue and going from black to full luminance.

bits of mantissa == precision in worest case.


Well thats all in my humble opion I could just be stuipid today I guess.


Ignore ranting that got deleted.