Nintendo Switch Tech Speculation discussion

[Goodtwin]

I agree with your post, except to say that I recall the performance of the Dark Souls games (certainly the original that I saw) to be utterly, utterly, utterly dreadful. I recall and underground swamp at something like -5 fps and with updates at such irregular intervals it made the Andes look like a sine wave. So good enough for the dev could be abysmal and nauseating by real people terms.

I just watched DF's update look at version 1.03 of DS3, and the framerate is actually pretty steady at 30fps, its apparently an issue with frame pacing that gives the stutter. Hopefully the developer works this out when they release the Trilogy. Your absolutely correct though, what the developer considers to be acceptable performance could be anything playable. Who knows, maybe they think 20fps is adequate.

Its also difficult to say how developers will utilize the extra performance when docked. I believe Nintendo's intention is for games to render 720p when portable, and the extra performance when docked makes 1080p rendering possible. I'm sure this will be the case for the majority of Nintendo's first party games, but there isn't really anything to stop developers from targeting 720p when docked, and either reducing resolution to sub HD or accepting poor performance when in portable mode.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I think 1080p docked will be a must. Unlike 1080p v 4K, or 900p v 1080p, 720p is definitely on the blurry side, and more so as average display size get bigger. I wouldn't be surprised if docked performance was managed by API and devs didn't have access to pick and choose, unlike the PS4Pro where it's resources the devs have to implement manually.

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

I'm pretty sure Nintendo will make it mandatory for games to have similar performance in docked and handheld mode, at the expense of resolution and overall IQ.

 

[AlNom]

Can't wait for the Light Switch revision.


...................

....or the Power Switch.


siiiiigh

 

[Goodtwin]

I think 1080p docked will be a must. Unlike 1080p v 4K, or 900p v 1080p, 720p is definitely on the blurry side, and more so as average display size get bigger. I wouldn't be surprised if docked performance was managed by API and devs didn't have access to pick and choose, unlike the PS4Pro where it's resources the devs have to implement manually.

That sounds good in theory, but could also be an issue when porting AAA games. Look how many Xbox One games do not render at 1080p, and seeing as how the Switch is most certainly less powerful than the Xbox One, that would be unfair to developers by limiting their flexibility. 720P is still a viable resolution in my opinion. I know its hard to fathom, but your average consumer isn't quite as sensitive to resolution as your hardcore tech enthusiast is. I game on a 1080P 42" LG LCD TV, and I can switch between 720p and 1080p while PC gaming in Batman Arkham Knight without noticing a big difference. This is subjective to everyone's personal opinion, but I think 720p while docked should remain a possibility, just as it is with the other consoles.

 

[Osamar]

I do not think it is possible to have so wide range of clocks (not counting bandwidth) to deliver x2.25 pixels at same quality on TV vs Handheld. But 900p vs 720p is doable.
At the same time, I hope Nvidia&Nintendo launch a real 1080p TV console.

 

[Rootax]

Even if (and that's a big if) raw power is here, what do you do to port AAA games without a hdd and with 4gb of ram ? I guess you can put the game on 64 or 128gb cartridge, if they are fast enough, but the ram... And, how do you do big patches ? R/W cartridge ?

 

[orangpelupa]

That sounds good in theory, but could also be an issue when porting AAA games. Look how many Xbox One games do not render at 1080p, and seeing as how the Switch is most certainly less powerful than the Xbox One, that would be unfair to developers by limiting their flexibility. 720P is still a viable resolution in my opinion. I know its hard to fathom, but your average consumer isn't quite as sensitive to resolution as your hardcore tech enthusiast is. I game on a 1080P 42" LG LCD TV, and I can switch between 720p and 1080p while PC gaming in Batman Arkham Knight without noticing a big difference. This is subjective to everyone's personal opinion, but I think 720p while docked should remain a possibility, just as it is with the other consoles.

Yup, they also aren't sensitive to low res textures, low frame rate, etc.

So developers in addition to render in 720p, they also can do the usual performance improvement cheats to make their games look good enough and plays well enough.

Especially for games with cartoony looks that Nintendo always excels.

I just wish developers will render the UI at 1080p

 

[eastmen]

Even if (and that's a big if) raw power is here, what do you do to port AAA games without a hdd and with 4gb of ram ? I guess you can put the game on 64 or 128gb cartridge, if they are fast enough, but the ram... And, how do you do big patches ? R/W cartridge ?

Flash ram would be as fast as the hardrives in the xbox one and ps4 or very close to it.

Micro SD cards will do 70-120MB/s depending on the make and price point you want to grab.

Nintendo's flash carts for the game may be faster than that even.

As for the 4 gigs of ram the xbox one and ps4 only really allow 4-5 gigs of ram for their games the rest is off limits for app switching. If Nintendo doesn't allow app switching like that (which I think is fine in a mobile ) they shouldn't have real problems porting titles over. Also remember you can use lower res textures if your targeting 720p on a 6 in screen vs targeting 1080p on a 50 + inch screen. You will notice a lot more on such a big screen than you will on a little one.

Anyway I think even with all those things there will be a visual difference between the ps4/xbox one and the switch aside from resolution wise. However I think the 3 almost 4 years of time between them have allowed the switch to look much better than it would have been if it came out earlier.

For me I can accept it for the on the go gaming. I loe my surface but its getting old and the newer surfaces can run games well they just can't offer the experience it seems the switch will be able to at least on the go. Perhaps the pro 5 will change that.


Give me 720p fallout 4 , skyrim , Zelda , Mario with a 4-5 hour battery life and usb charging and I am a happy camper. On longer trips I will just take my 20k MaH battery along for the ride and I am sure most wont mind investing in power banks. Everyone I know has one anyway for their iPhone or ipad or android gear.

 

[Rootax]

Yeah on the go it can be enough, but as a home console ? Plus, it's not only about what the console can do, but, if it is easy enough so the devs can port their games without too much to do. It's always the problem with Big N...

 

[cheapchips]

Yeah on the go it can be enough, but as a home console ? Plus, it's not only about what the console can do, but, if it is easy enough so the devs can port their games without too much to do. It's always the problem with Big N...

We know it's either an x1 or derivative with nVidia's support on APIs/dev environment. None of the titbits of info we've had suggest Nintendo have borked it into something less modern and more difficult to develop for.

From a hardware perspective I'm pretty sure the 'only' real issues will be relative power, memory and storage.

The main issue with receiving ports will be around what sells. I think the comments from From Software will be the default position of a lot of pubishers

It's uncharted territory for Indies this time round. Digital distribution wasn't quite mature with the WiiU and it didn't facilitate easy ports. The switch does from what a few devs have said.

Software wise, beyond 1st party, a rich pool of indie ports would make it an utterly essential piece of hardware.

AAA sells but it's generally quite dull. Stuff like Nidhogg and Gang Beasts would be awesome.

 

[Pixel]

It's uncharted territory for Indies this time round. Digital distribution wasn't quite mature with the WiiU and it didn't facilitate easy ports. The switch does from what a few devs have said.

Software wise, beyond 1st party, a rich pool of indie ports would make it an utterly essential piece of hardware.

AAA sells bit it's generally quite dull. Stuff like Nidhogg and Gang Beasts would be awesome.

Are there any rumors the Switch will have some internal flash storage? Anywhere USB ports seen on the dock so an HDD could be hooked up to download indie games from the digital store?

 

[Rootax]

32gb internal is a rumor.

 

[cheapchips]

It has an SD slot so game storage isnt going to be an issue. Patching non digital titles might be, as discussed further up the thread.

 

[function]

Unless loading times are all over the place with gltitchy assed streaming, Nintendo are going to have to mandate some kind of minimum speed for games running off SD. There are certainly SD carts fast enough to match or beat mechanical laptop drives (as pointed out above), but there's going to have to be some kind of test done on formatting an SD for use with game installs (like the 360 with USB flash drives, iirc).

Nintendo branded cards or Nintendo approved cards might be helpful, and even allow a little additional revenue (in the case of branded).

 

[cheapchips]

Insisting on the new A1 standard would help in that regard, assuming it has sufficient adoption.

http://arstechnica.co.uk/gadgets/2016/11/sd-card-app-performance-ratings/

 

[eastmen]

Yeah on the go it can be enough, but as a home console ? Plus, it's not only about what the console can do, but, if it is easy enough so the devs can port their games without too much to do. It's always the problem with Big N...

But in the past Nintendo has gone with PowerPC tech while the industry goes else where . That worked with sony and the ps2 because of how popular the ps2 was. I worked for MS and Sony the next gen because they both used similar cores with Sony having issues because of the rest of cell. Now Nintendo is using ARM and the major software engines already support that.

Also for most home gamers 720p or even 920p in boosted dock mode would be enough. These are the people who bought wiis that was 480p when 1080p sets were already becoming the norm.

 

[Goodtwin]

Anyone who is thinking Nintendo is trying to go head to head with the other consoles is kidding themselves. If Nintendo wanted to create the best possible experience for the TV, they wouldn't have made the system portable. The key feature is the portability, and if course Nintendo unifying their first party efforts on to a single device. I can promise you, Nintendo is not under the illusion that Switch will be the device that plays the best looking versions of AAA games, but if the Switch is able to acquire a wide variety of software that can be played anywhere, they have potential to offer consumers something no one else really is. We already know how well Nintendo portables can do without western publishers, now imagine that portable with a decent amount of western support, tv play, and a unified Nintendo software offering. It's tough to not be optimistic as a Nintendo fan.

Sent from my SM-G360V using Tapatalk

 

[wco81]

So what's the price going to be?

If they come in at $299 forget it. Even $249 may be stretching it.

 

[BRiT]

My guess is around $349 or higher, with $329 as the lowest end.