Next Generation Hardware Speculation with a Technical Spin [2018]

[anexanhume]

so if hdmi 2.1 compliant devices are going to ship in 2019 should we expect ps5 shortly afterwards? christmas 2019?

Should have no impact either way. We are lucky to have it, as I don’t think they would have held back consoles for it. I would be shocked if they didn’t include it.

 

[Deleted member 13524]

New so if hdmi 2.1 compliant devices are going to ship in 2019 should we expect ps5 shortly afterwards? christmas 2019?

AFAIK, HDMI 2.1 is already present in the XBoneX, and every AMD card with HDMI 2.0 output (Polaris + Vega + Vega APUs) is getting support for HDMI VRR.

VRR is probably just a carbon copy of AMD's own FreeSync-over-HDMI, which in turn is just VESA's Adaptive Sync running through a HDMI cable anyways.

 

[anexanhume]

AFAIK, HDMI 2.1 is already present in the XBoneX, and every AMD card with HDMI 2.0 output (Polaris + Vega + Vega APUs) is getting support for HDMI VRR.

VRR is probably just a carbon copy of AMD's own FreeSync-over-HDMI, which in turn is just VESA's Adaptive Sync running through a HDMI cable anyways.

You need HDMI 2.1 to push past 60Hz and/or 8 bit color when running at 4:4:4 chroma on 4K, so it’s still important.

 

[Deleted member 13524]

You need HDMI 2.1 to push past 60Hz and/or 8 bit color when running at 4:4:4 chroma on 4K, so it’s still important.

I never said HDMI 2.1 isn't important. It's super important!
It's just not mandatory for VRR.

In fact, Quantum Dot TVs from Samsung releasing this year will be bringing VRR and FreeSync, and they're not carrying HDMI 2.1.

BTW, I refuse to upgrade my A/V receiver until there are units out there that are 100% compatible with HDMI 2.1.

 

[anexanhume]

I never said HDMI 2.1 isn't important. It's super important! I refuse to upgrade my A/V receiver until there are units out there that are 100% compatible with HDMI 2.1.
It's just not mandatory for VRR.

In fact, Quantum Dot TVs from Samsung releasing this year will be bringing VRR and FreeSync, and they're not carrying HDMI 2.1.

BTW, I refuse to upgrade my A/V receiver until there are units out there that are 100% compatible with HDMI 2.1.

Sorry, I was mostly clarifying hoping to add to what you said given the nature of that poster’s question. Not trying to imply anything on your part.

It’s a good step that Samsung is doing that, but even better that’s in the 2.1 spec so it can be guaranteed going forward for TVs with 2.1. Everyone should have it! This can be the gen of motion and image quality with dynamic HDR, VRR, and 4K or CB4K becoming commonplace.

I hear you on the receiver front. eARC is essential too for Atmos passthrough.

 

[Entropy]

What?

Butting in on the HDMI branch to clarify regarding time-line. Previous generation was 2005 - 2013. 8 years. This generation 2013-2019 or 2020, assuming 7nm process node and some time for it to stabilise in a suitable form for high power and reasonably large ASICs to yield well plus lead time to produce a decent stock for launch. That would make this generation last roughly 7 years. If we assume a global launch in 2020, that platform is likely to last at least as long as the previous two generations, particularly if practical benefits of lithographic advances slow down. So - from 2020 to roughly 2028. It might make economic sense to stick a slim version in there somewhere, or a spec bump model. Or not. Doesn't much matter since the base system will define the software target.
And a stable well defined target is one of the main benefits of consoles, even it seems a bit boring from a tech enthusiast point of view.

 

[phoenix_chipset]

I never said HDMI 2.1 isn't important. It's super important!
It's just not mandatory for VRR.

In fact, Quantum Dot TVs from Samsung releasing this year will be bringing VRR and FreeSync, and they're not carrying HDMI 2.1.

BTW, I refuse to upgrade my A/V receiver until there are units out there that are 100% compatible with HDMI 2.1.

Damn... might need to get one of those samsungs..

esp. since my sony x900e bit the dust lol.

 

[Deleted member 13524]

Damn... might need to get one of those samsungs..

esp. since my sony x900e bit the dust lol.

What happened with it?
My Hisense M7000 went to RMA because a vertical line of dead pixels appeared in the middle of the screen.
Hopefully, they won't repair it and I'll get at least some store credit.

I was thinking about replacing it with a X900 because it's the only cheap-ish (~1250€) HDR TV with a FALD instead of edge-lit (even Samsung's more expensive Q6F line are edge lit sigh...).

 

[phoenix_chipset]

What happened with it?
My Hisense M7000 went to RMA because a vertical line of dead pixels appeared in the middle of the screen.
Hopefully, they won't repair it and I'll get at least some store credit.

I was thinking about replacing it with a X900 because it's the only cheap-ish (~1250€) HDR TV with a FALD instead of edge-lit (even Samsung's more expensive Q6F line are edge lit sigh...).

It started making loud popping noises and then the screen just wouldn't turn on. Luckily i got amazon to take it back even though i had it for 2 months.

When it *was* working, i was extremely impressed with the brightness, black level and even the hdr was pretty great. I would say go for the 900e if the price is right.

I'm sitting here with an ancient 720p samsung atm if the new tcl 6 series is really good I might get that. But the samsung fald qleds are no doubt the best this year.

 

[Deleted member 13524]

I'm wondering:

How hard would it be for AMD to make a Zen-Jaguar hybrid? The Jaguar cores in the current-gens have no L3 cache, just a block of L2 for each quad for coherence. The cores have only L1 and shared L2.
What if AMD could make a 8-core CCX with no L2 per-core, and 8MB of shared L2?
That would leave it with the same amount of shared cache as Raven Ridge - which doesn't seem to suffer a lot in gaming performance per-core.

the samsung fald qleds are no doubt the best this year.

Well they're also as expensive as OLED TVs, and at that point you're left with the decision of having a TV that has perfect contrast at decent brightness (OLED ~600 nits) or good contrast with a brightness that burns through the retina (QLED >1000 nits).
And the choice might fall on how much light there is in the room where the TV is going..

Unless one of them has VRR, of course.

 

[phoenix_chipset]

Personally not a fan of oled because of brightness limitations and image retention. I'll stick with fald until micro led. I've seen the edge lit q7f in person and the colors are pretty incredible... add fald to that and it's 2000 nits (q8f!) vs. 600 on oled.

Imo oled really only wins in pitch black scenes when comparing hdr. It's not like the blacks aren't really really good on a quality fald, it's just not 100%.

 

[DieH@rd]

You need HDMI 2.1 to push past 60Hz and/or 8 bit color when running at 4:4:4 chroma on 4K, so it’s still important.

Not much relevant because consoles do not use 4:4:4 on 4K.

HDMI 2.1 will be important for PC users much more than for consoles.

 

[borntosoul]

Personally not a fan of oled because of brightness limitations and image retention. I'll stick with fald until micro led. I've seen the edge lit q7f in person and the colors are pretty incredible... add fald to that and it's 2000 nits (q8f!) vs. 600 on oled.

Imo oled really only wins in pitch black scenes when comparing hdr. It's not like the blacks aren't really really good on a quality fald, it's just not 100%.

Sorry off topic....
Having gone from a pioneer kuro plasma to a lg b6 OLED, the most rounded tv with the least amount of visible flaws is the kuro, the lg although is amazing and gives a very realistic - unveiled picture , can suffer from motion atrifacts, and the brightness in some scenes may annoy some old schoolers - especially if you like to watch movies in the dark. I’d never be interested in a tv with a qled brightness, way too much for me, the brightness makes the picture look less “classic” film like and more documentary like - take that as you want. It’s all what you’re used too.

Ps5 has to be great because Ps4 pro slim on budget price surely will happen at some point.

 

[Metal_Spirit]

AFAIK, HDMI 2.1 is already present in the XBoneX

What???

Says Who?

HDMI is 2.0b, the same as every other hardware out there! HDMI 2.1 is not out yet!

 

[DieH@rd]

Parts of HDMI 2.1 features can be used in HDMI 2.0. IMO, VRR is just adaptive sync [which is used in AMD's Freesync over HDMI].

 

[chris1515]

https://www.resetera.com/threads/mi...-gddr6-for-future-xbox-design-projects.37207/

GDDR6 for next Xbox via a job offer from Microsoft it begins.. Yeah

other job offer

We are seeking a qualified candidate for a Senior Engineer to lead the storage solutions for the Xbox console hardware development team. Storage solutions include HDD, SSD, and Flash based storage technologies. The successful candidate will be the primary technical focal point for existing and leading-edge storage technologies on currently shipping and future Xbox design projects.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Storage solutions include HDD, SSD,

Woohoo! (It really is a no-brainer as per this discussion). Might not be a full SSD and might go with some fairly voluminous fast flash, but at least they recognise the need for fast main storage. And if this is fast enough, RAM pressure will be reduced.

 

[chris1515]

Woohoo! (It really is a no-brainer as per this discussion). Might not be a full SSD and might go with some fairly voluminous fast flash, but at least they recognise the need for fast main storage. And if this is fast enough, RAM pressure will be reduced.

I think we will have a little SSD or flash based storage for help... We can't continue with only HDD...

 

[Shifty Geezer]

What's the minimum SSD size they could get away with? You'd want several games immediately to hand, but you wouldn't need the entire game. You could have enough of the game on SSD to start it and carry on where you left off, and the rest can be copied across from HDD as needed. I think 240 GBs could work, with it user replaceable for power users. Could 120 GBs be viable? Would it be worth the savings?

 

[iroboto]

I’ve always found M2 to be this sort of good console expansion slot.

You need a lot of space for 4K.

But MS is working on intelligent delivery, so perhaps the games might be more manageable in size.