New Nintendo Switch hardware versions?

Discussion in 'Console Industry' started by wco81, Oct 4, 2018.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. orangpelupa

    orangpelupa Elite Bug Hunter
    Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2008
    Messages:
    7,155
    Likes Received:
    1,307
    Hey I guess I'm finally become the lucky one!

    My joycons have no drift despite It got a ton of use. Be it in the bathroom (complete with splashes), played harshly by kids with their grimy hands in mosque every Friday, or when I detach them and put them in my pants pocket or my bag togethrr with tons of debris (mainly paper debris).

    Anyway, switch detachable controller is really awesome! Playing while eating had never been this comfortable hahaba
     
    Goodtwin likes this.
  2. tongue_of_colicab

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2004
    Messages:
    3,445
    Likes Received:
    655
    Location:
    Japan
    I doubt it. A pair of batteries and Bluetooth chips cost next to nothing. And there is absolutely nothing complicated about the sliding mechanism. Reworking the Tegra chip to only run at 720p makes little sense either as I doubt the cost of building a new chip out weights the minimal cost savings.

    There isn't much to save on the screen either and I'm not sure if going with a smaller and lower quality screen is something consumers want. A smaller screen will make games quite hard to play.
     
  3. milk

    Veteran Regular

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2012
    Messages:
    2,989
    Likes Received:
    2,560
    Well, googling switch's BOM I found this:

    https://www.kitguru.net/tech-news/p...-wont-line-nintendos-pockets-suggests-report/

    So the joycons cost almost another $50. Of course that includes their buttons and sticks that you wouldn't do away with by making them non detachable. But still, the simplicity of making them non detachable simplifies a lot of the main hardware. Power supply and recharging controllers can be simpler since the central unit does not have to control recharging of another two separate controllers. You can also put just a single accelerometer and gyro for the whole thing instead of one for each joycon. Also, don't underestimate the added manufacturing complexity of a slide and attach thingie. In isolation it is relatively simple, but it must end up precise enough to fit another piece and that has to be tested. It adds more cost than just the materials themselves. I still think you can shave off more than $50 easily by simplifying the system as a whole.
     
    #123 milk, Mar 30, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2019
    DSoup, cheapchips and orangpelupa like this.
  4. DSoup

    DSoup meh
    Legend Veteran Subscriber

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2007
    Messages:
    10,972
    Likes Received:
    5,799
    Location:
    London, UK
    There are cheap (and crap) versions of everything but Nintendo didn't put those into the joycons.

    Every discussion about cost ends up with grabbing onto the lowest, cheapest option, which generally isn't the component of choice in any of products anybody posting to this board would buy. There is a reason for that. :yep2:
     
    Goodtwin likes this.
  5. Entropy

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2002
    Messages:
    3,060
    Likes Received:
    1,021
    This reminds me of Atari testing the arcade survivability of the Missile Command controls by letting nearby construction workers play the prototypes for free on their lunch breaks.
    They survived adults using the controls with their feet, standing on the cabinets.

    One should never underestimate the destructive capability of a six year old. :-D
     
    Goodtwin and orangpelupa like this.
  6. orangpelupa

    orangpelupa Elite Bug Hunter
    Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2008
    Messages:
    7,155
    Likes Received:
    1,307
    Anyway, hopefully they won't skimp on the battery so switch can last longer, even when playing heavy games.

    Currently its way too short for some games. Like... It goes low battery in just 2 hours.
     
  7. Goodtwin

    Veteran Newcomer Subscriber

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2013
    Messages:
    1,120
    Likes Received:
    594


    Going by the results of overclocking the Nintendo Switch, the outlook for a Switch Pro providing a meaningful upgrade is better than I would have imagined. What was the most interesting is seeing games like Doom and Wolfenstein 2 receiving a nice boost in framerate by increasing the CPU clock speeds to 1.4 Ghz. Surprisingly, or unsurprisingly, the Switch is more CPU bound than GPU in these games. A Switch Pro could in theory iron out a lot of games framerate dips, and keep the resolution up for dynamic resolution games. I would buy it.
     
    Shifty Geezer likes this.
  8. AlBran

    AlBran Ferro-Fibrous
    Moderator Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2004
    Messages:
    20,722
    Likes Received:
    5,815
    Location:
    ಠ_ಠ
    I haven't looked at the vid yet, but I wonder if boosting the CPU has a non-linear effect in freeing up the memory bus (less of a bandwidth hit from reduced contention).
     
    #128 AlBran, Apr 9, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2019
  9. Pressure

    Veteran Regular

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2004
    Messages:
    1,337
    Likes Received:
    271
    I like how the video fails to state how doubling the memory bandwidth going from TX1 to TX2 will help boost performance across the board.

    NVIDIA states Max-Q (Maximum efficiency) for TX2 is GPU at 854MHz and Cortex-A57 at 1.2GHz. The current Switch TX1 is clocked at only 307MHz in handheld mode and 768MHz in docked mode.

    By the way, the improved fidelity comes from overclocking the GPU to 460MHz (in handheld mode) and not the the CPU.
     
  10. AlBran

    AlBran Ferro-Fibrous
    Moderator Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2004
    Messages:
    20,722
    Likes Received:
    5,815
    Location:
    ಠ_ಠ
    The Wolf II section seemed to indicate a boost to 720p with just the CPU overclock (docked, GPU@768MHz) @5m05s.

    It's interesting anyhow.
     
  11. dogen

    Regular Newcomer

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2014
    Messages:
    335
    Likes Received:
    259
    wouldn't boosting the CPU use up more memory bandwidth though?
     
  12. AlBran

    AlBran Ferro-Fibrous
    Moderator Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2004
    Messages:
    20,722
    Likes Received:
    5,815
    Location:
    ಠ_ಠ
    Assuming the work is constant - i.e. finishing the same workload faster. There's a framerate limit as well.

    I'm not entirely sure if it holds water, but I'm just thinking aloud as the CPU is likely given priority access on the shared bus since they're more sensitive to latency (more random vs GPU), which may be why we see something akin to a non-linear drop in performance the greater the CPU burden (See PS4 shared bandwidth trade-off slide/leaked SDK).
     
    #132 AlBran, Apr 9, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2019
    Entropy and BRiT like this.
  13. Sigfried1977

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2008
    Messages:
    4,926
    Likes Received:
    1,747
    Thank goodness the joy cons turned out to be fairly easy to fix. I bought a cheap replacement stick on amazon and put it in myself. Was €10 including all the neccessary tools. It was even a Prime article. Taking out 7 screws was all I needed to do. The parts are tiny, so the ordeal is rather fiddly (and the tools are obviously cheap. I hate non-magnetic screw drivers). The whole process took about 10 minutes. Anyone with a modicum of dexterity should be able to manage this. Certainly beats spending 80 bucks on new joy cons. This would be especially annoying because I have those lovely bright red Mario Odyssey edition joy cons you cannot buy separately.

    TLDR: don't buy new joycons. Fix 'em yourself instead.
     
    #133 Sigfried1977, Apr 16, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2019
    orangpelupa and Shifty Geezer like this.
  14. lefantome

    Newcomer

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2013
    Messages:
    155
    Likes Received:
    71
    C'mon Nintendo, give me a home only console, possibly with better performance and lower price.
     
  15. orangpelupa

    orangpelupa Elite Bug Hunter
    Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2008
    Messages:
    7,155
    Likes Received:
    1,307
    btw i just upclocked my switch from 768MHz docked to > 900 Mhz and the fan doesnt even run at max speed. It seems Switch while docked do have thermal headroom for higher clocks. It really helps in some games.

    i wonder, if thats the "secret sauce" nintendo used to render BOTW in 3D for labo VR? They upclocked the portable mode?

    the new switch probably would be cooler AND quieter, even at higher clock. While new games will run old switch in higher clocks to get the performance closer?
     
    Goodtwin likes this.
  16. wco81

    Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2004
    Messages:
    6,204
    Likes Received:
    264
    Location:
    West Coast
    So more recent rumors about a lower-priced model in the immediate future followed by a more powerful model next year.

    Understandable strategy but the success of this Switch paradigm (portable and dockable for more performance) could be put to the test next year assuming PS5 and XB2 come out.

    The performance delta will probably widen even more between Nintendo and the other consoles.

    Will the portable/dockable duality still trump next-gen power?

    There has to be a lot of pent-up demand for people who bought PS4 or XB years ago so there might be a surge for more powerful console segment of the market.

    That is unless the more performant Switch offers more than just better performance. Better screen would be a good start.
     
  17. bgroovy

    Regular Newcomer

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2014
    Messages:
    629
    Likes Received:
    493
    Keep in mind Nintendo chose to use clocks considering problems like thermal expansion and fatigue caused by sudden heating and cooling. There are already people who use the system mostly docked who have reported the casing below the screen has cracked from this effect. Just because a chip can run at a higher clockspeed without experiencing errors doesn't mean the whole device can withstand those thermal effects.
     
    Picao84 likes this.
  18. orangpelupa

    orangpelupa Elite Bug Hunter
    Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2008
    Messages:
    7,155
    Likes Received:
    1,307
    the weird thing is, nintendo simply doesnt want switch to stay cool. When i blast it with a small desk fan, its still hot. the internal fan simply ran ultra slow.
     
  19. Picao84

    Veteran Regular

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2010
    Messages:
    1,553
    Likes Received:
    698
    I don't think Switch will suffer a lot from next Playstation and XBox. It will still have it's USP of portability. People will have both one of those and the Switch just like now, as they can't still use their Playstation or Xbox while commuting to work, travelling around, queuing for something, etc.
     
    milk likes this.
  20. orangpelupa

    orangpelupa Elite Bug Hunter
    Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2008
    Messages:
    7,155
    Likes Received:
    1,307
    hmm i wonder how game streaming will affect that.

    phones have modem, so it can stream anywhere. while switch only have rather crappy wifi (why the heck did they even limit the channel? o_O)
     
Loading...
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page

  • About Us

    Beyond3D has been around for over a decade and prides itself on being the best place on the web for in-depth, technically-driven discussion and analysis of 3D graphics hardware. If you love pixels and transistors, you've come to the right place!

    Beyond3D is proudly published by GPU Tools Ltd.
Loading...