MS stuck in the middle?
- Thread starter EndR
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The Core SKU is, ironically, the thing that might save them. If Sony really goes whole-hog for technology, they won't be able to combat the Core SKU for 4 years.Lysander said:Two words for MS: "KILL CORE" !
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Lysander said:I just want to say again, MS must make those 20gigs HD mandatory and start to sell only premium. They also must start selling (optional) 50 and 100 gigs HD. And then there is HD-DVD behind the E3 corner and I hope that their speed will be done with software in mind
Nope. What they need to do, is get that price of the core down to $199 as fast as possible and drop teh price on the hdd. Price is much more important than mandatory HDD's or hd disc players.
Why on earth would they drop the price while they're still selling each and every unit they have manufactured? It's selling as it is in North America, and it's not the price that's keeping them from selling in Japan.
I would like to see a Core + Viva Pinata bundle in autumn for $199
I would like to see a Core + Viva Pinata bundle in autumn for $199
assen said:Why on earth would they drop the price while they're still selling each and every unit they have manufactured? It's selling as it is in North America, and it's not the price that's keeping them from selling in Japan.
I would like to see a Core + Viva Pinata bundle in autumn for $199
Yes, In the states the sales are healthy but as I understand it, in EU the sales have lagged a bit. To encourage people to buy machines, a price reduction is a way to do it.
In japan, well, it might work as well, it cannot be selling worse if the price is lowered (or can it?
Well, the japanese issue is a software issue)But that was not my point. My point was to lower the price so that they could sell as many units as possible before PS3 comes out on market. This will help them selling more software and getting more people getting into XboxLive. Like I said, the whole point with launching before PS3 was to have a lead as huge as possible and be able to establish the machine before PS3 comes out.
to the others, lots of good and valid comments from several people.. nice to see the different kind of views and opinions.. :smile:
I really can't see them "ditching" the core SKU. That is the SKU they will use for their price fighting, there they don't have the HDD to concider which will be a cost that will not scale down as the rest of the hardware.
As for a price reduction I can't see them going down in price yet. Maybe later this year before christmas and most probably only the core SKU to try and target the mainstream more...
As for a price reduction I can't see them going down in price yet. Maybe later this year before christmas and most probably only the core SKU to try and target the mainstream more...
Not if you can avoid it. There's other ways to get interest in your product besides price drops, more effectual ways at that. In fact price drops are the last resort as they cut into your profit margins. New games that appeal to those without an XB360, with strong advertising as such, is the way to go. XB360 could be £50 and I wouldn't buy it as there's no games on it that I want at the moment. The product is basically worthless to me as it standards, so no price will get me buying it. Whereas iPod shows high prices don't stop people buying your product if you've drummed up enough interest. A price drop 6 months after launch isn't a good 'tone' to set with the public.EndR said:
EndR said:
Only to a certain point.
Are gamers not buying 360 because it's too expensive? If that's the only reason, then a lower price will help. But i can safely say that price is the last of people's worries.
People don't buy 360's at the moment either because they just don't want one (either because there are no games that interest them) or because they just can't, due to shortages.
In the circumstances, lowering price will not change the situation. It's simple economy really.
Shifty Geezer said:
I know..
The 360 is now beginning to get some really good content, GRAW and Oblivion to be precise.
About "the tone" that it sends about lowering the price, I don´t think it will matter. What tone does MS send if they lower the price when PS3 arrives? By lowering the price now, MS puts more pressure on Sony, maybe even making them have the HDD as an add on so they can compete with MS with price.
But yeah, MS needs more software and more software that can push sales..
(The IPod analogy isn´t quite the same, IPod don´t have the software issues as a console have, but I still get your point)
london-boy said:
Correct! No matter how cheap the machine is, if there isn´t any software, the machine won´t sale.
Now, there are software out there and there are people that needs some "tipping" to make them buy the machine. Maybe they think that the machine is nice, have some ok software but still kind of uncertain. Lowering the price will maybe the the push they need to think: "Ahh, I can take the risk and buy the machine, It isn´t that expensive anyway"..
But like Shifty mentioned, its software-driven. With good software, a machine can still sell very good at a high price range.
But some people need the extra push and lowering the price is a push..
the best bet for MS is to have lot of good sofwares for chrismass, and no supplies issues.
Even if sony achieve is goal, lot of fans will be stuch whithout a machine for quiete a long time.
If the quality is sowhat in par on both systems, some can give the xbox a try.
Anyway it's obvious, MS will be stuck in the middle, Sony will win again this round, but if sale and marketshare grows, it 'll be more "Ms is in the middle" or have become a strong challenger.
Even if sony achieve is goal, lot of fans will be stuch whithout a machine for quiete a long time.
If the quality is sowhat in par on both systems, some can give the xbox a try.
Anyway it's obvious, MS will be stuck in the middle, Sony will win again this round, but if sale and marketshare grows, it 'll be more "Ms is in the middle" or have become a strong challenger.
EndR said:
Heh, all i can say is that MS must be thankful they don't have you as their CFO!!
A price drop in the console world is a strategic move that needs to be timed absolutely correctly, or the company risks losing money for no reason.
Customers buy what they want to buy, not what's cheapest at the moment. If they don't want a 360, they won't get it no matter how cheap it is. That's the same reason Sony never lowered the PS2 price for AGES, and only did so very sporadically.
And it's also the same reason why the numerous and BIG price drops both GC and Xbox had during their life time, didn't help them much.
If MS wants to do something about 360 sales, they need to produce more of them, secure huge titles, mostly japanese, inundate our media with adverts with games that people actually want to play (different from the many PC-style war-related games which are "cool" for geeky american teenagers, but never sell much worldwide), and keep the price as it is.
Dropping the price of the console doesn't mean that much to the customer, because he knows he'll be spending much more money on the games than he did on the hardware.
Of course there are those who buy the console for just one or two games, but they're not what these companies are targeting at. And the average customer finds it hard to justify putting down any amount of money for a single game and a console, unless it has other functions too beyond gaming thjat he'll find useful for that amount of money (PS2 DVD play as an example).
Of course there are those who buy the console for just one or two games, but they're not what these companies are targeting at. And the average customer finds it hard to justify putting down any amount of money for a single game and a console, unless it has other functions too beyond gaming thjat he'll find useful for that amount of money (PS2 DVD play as an example).
Where is this coming from? Do we have sales information to chart EU sales falling or remaining flat?EndR said:
I think the meme started out because we have posters from Europe claiming "there is no demand" because they find Xbox 360's sitting on shelves in stores. But given that the UK sales have been strong (or started out strong) and that Ubisoft announced very strong sales of GRAW in the EU, I would think that sales are actually good.
Sis said:
Not that it really matters, but i got lots of emails from different retailers, online and high-street, telling me that the Xbox360 Core is back in stock!!1
Them and their bleeping Core systems...
Link?liolio said:MS has said that sales in France Italia and one other country i can't remenber are very bad. Xbobx was sucessfull in UK, the xbox360 seems to follow the same path
EDIT: The only information I could find (doing a simple search for "Xbox 360 sales France Italy" showed this:
http://money.cnn.com/2006/03/17/technology/ballmer_fortune/?cnn=yes
Which only says that the original Xbox did poorly. Ironically, another link I came across was the GRAW sales record news report which stated that GRAW was the fastest selling Ubisoft game in France.
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london-boy said:Heh, all i can say is that MS must be thankful they don't have you as their CFO!!
A price drop in the console world is a strategic move that needs to be timed absolutely correctly, or the company risks losing money for no reason.
Customers buy what they want to buy, not what's cheapest at the moment. If they don't want a 360, they won't get it no matter how cheap it is. That's the same reason Sony never lowered the PS2 price for AGES, and only did so very sporadically.
And it's also the same reason why the numerous and BIG price drops both GC and Xbox had during their life time, didn't help them much.
If MS wants to do something about 360 sales, they need to produce more of them, secure huge titles, mostly japanese, inundate our media with adverts with games that people actually want to play (different from the many PC-style war-related games which are "cool" for geeky american teenagers, but never sell much worldwide), and keep the price as it is.
I understand your comments BUT I don´t agree entirely.
Price is a important factor for those undecided. For example, I have a friend that was very Pro-Sony. When Xbox launched here in Sweden, he didn´t care. (it was to expensive) but when MS lowered the price (by half) then suddenly he felt that it was ok, he could test and buy it to see what the fuzz was about (and by this time, there weren´t so many good games).
There are several people out there that are like this, that can be convinced if the price is attractive.
Now, the comparison between PS2 and Xbox360 regarding price reduction isn´t entirely correct, as I see it. The PS2 was the machine to own and thanks to the demand, Sony could go on and not lower the price because of the good demand. MS and 360 is in an entirely different position. If I was MS, I would want the 360 sell as good as possible, preferrably sell better than last gens machine. Now, this is also a supply issue but if sales of 360 don´t pick up when production is good, then something is wrong.
Software only cannot drive hardware. If the machine is to expensive, people will wait (this is for mainstream, hardcore buys no matter what).
So how can MS stimulate sales now? Software will come, MS cannot do something about that. They want to release games as good as possible so they give devs as much time as possible (but with limits of course). There are some good games for the machine right now and with a lower price on the hardware, MS could have a boost on both hardware and the current software.
According to my thoughts, a 299 dollar premium with 1-2 games for the same price as a premium costs now IS a very good deal and that helps alot on selling both hardware and software.
I think that MS needs to stimulate hardware sales more and the only way they can do that is to lower the price now. There are people out there who can be convinced just by seeing a lower price on the hardware.
The purpose for a price reduction now is to be able to sell as many units as possible before PS3 arrives. MS wants to be leader with this generation, they need to be more aggressive. Sure, lowering the price would mean that the loss each machine incur is greater but people can afford to buy 1-2 games with the machine for the same price as it is now. Also, this gives MS more potential costumers on XboxLive. With time, more and better software will come and by then, lots more machines have been sold and thus, more software, peripherals and such can be sold.
MS has the money to take the heat, this is one of the ways MS can compete aggressivly against Sony, with price. By always have "better price" and have good games then it will do well...
But for now, to stimulate sales even further and sell as many units as possible as soon as possible, a price reduction should be implemented...