MS has no intention of making money off Xbox Next...

[I.S.T.]

Re: ...

Problem is, MS is worth 51 billion. If they lose enough money, they will say screw it.

The projection shows MS losing around $4 billion on Xbox Next. So is MS throwing the towel now????

Same with Sony, but I doubt MS is that stupid to try and wait out Sony.

The difference is that MS has no debt and has a bottomless bankaccount, while Sony is under heavy restructuring and is borrowing billions to finance CELL R&D. MS can play this money-losing game far longer than Sony could, its financial health is already poor to begin with.

I said IF. IF they lose enough money. And mind linking to something that says MS has no debt? And a link that says Sony had to borrow billions?

 

[Megadrive1988]

-the best Microsoft can possibly hope to achive is a Genesis-style sucess, *nearly* drawing even with Sony in next-generation marketshare (Xbox2 vs PS3, not counting all the PS1s and PS2s) but ultimately Sony will have the most next-gen marketshare with PS3. again, that is the BEST possible outcome for MS.

-PlayStation 4 development will comence before PlayStation 3 arrives in Japan. Sony will not kill PS4 even if it takes massive losses on Cell/PS3.
PlayStation 4 will come out no matter what.

 

[Teasy]

And they plan on keep losing billions until Kutaragi Ken sees the writing on the wall and exit console market...

So they plan to keep losing billions while not even competing with Sony (just like XBox didn't compete with PS2)? And that's supposed to make Sony exit the console market?

 

[Qroach]

Yet another deadmeat thread that should be locked. Can we get rid of this guy now? I'm so sick of his BS threads regarding PS3/Sony, and now he's still doing it in a slightly different way? no thanks.

 

[Megadrive1988]

believe it or not, some of the threads Deadmeat starts actually turn out to be interesting discussions.

this place would be alot less fun without him. he's not so bad, IMHO.

(don't hate me for saying that, lol)

 

[I.S.T.]

I hate you now. j/k


Most of the discussions he makes wind up being people trying to get him to see the error of his ways, like this one. Everyonce in a while a good one comes about though.

Back on topic, I just don't see how MS can force out Sony.

 

[Phil]

hmm, giving some though to what deadmeat is posting, I am left wondering, what are Microsoft's projectives?

Perhaps Deadmeat can answer this? (For the record, I have a few ideas of my own, but am really interesting to what you think, as it would certainly make it more clearer why you believe MS is out to ruin SCEI).

 

[marconelly!]

The wonderful thing about Deadmeat's predictions about Playstation is that they NEVER, EVER pan true. You could almost play the stockmarket by his posts on the internet forums - just do the exact opposite of what he predicts, and soon you'll be rich.

 

[jvd]

-the best Microsoft can possibly hope to achive is a Genesis-style sucess, *nearly* drawing even with Sony in next-generation marketshare (Xbox2 vs PS3, not counting all the PS1s and PS2s) but ultimately Sony will have the most next-gen marketshare with PS3. again, that is the BEST possible outcome for MS.

-PlayStation 4 development will comence before PlayStation 3 arrives in Japan. Sony will not kill PS4 even if it takes massive losses on Cell/PS3.
PlayStation 4 will come out no matter what.

Or they can have a playstation style of succes and the ps3 may end up the n64 of the next gen ?

 

[Megadrive1988]

Or they can have a playstation style of succes and the ps3 may end up the n64 of the next gen ?

well... *anything* is possible, I suppose. just highly unlikely that Xbox 2 is going to be the next Playstation while PS3 becomes the next N64

 

[aaaaa00]

That's just silly.

Microsofts growth rate might be past its prime compared with its early years... but duh, it's easier to grow a $1 million dollar business than it is to grow a $25 billion dollar business. This is simply the law of big numbers coming into effect.

Relative to Sony, with its razor thin margins, huge restructuring debt, and declining core business (consumer electronics), Microsoft is doing well.

 

[jvd]

Or they can have a playstation style of succes and the ps3 may end up the n64 of the next gen ?

well... *anything* is possible, I suppose. just highly unlikely that Xbox 2 is going to be the next Playstation while PS3 becomes the next N64

about as unlikely as a new party coming in and taking the market share away from the evenly split titans nintendo and sega right ?

No one expected that to happen.

No one expected nintendo to bring back the console market either. But it happens. Thats what life is all aobut .

 

[Megadrive1988]

I forcast one of three main possibilities

1.) PS3 decimates Xbox 2 and GCNext, actually INCREASING Sony's console marketshare to 80~90% from its current ~70%

2.) Xbox 2 does significantly better than Xbox, reducing Sony's marketshare by 10-20% from it's present ~70% to 50~60%. Nintendo does about the same with GCNext as its done with GCN.



3.) my real hope though, is, that both Nintendo and Microsoft do better by at least 10% each. giving them ~25% of the console market each. with Sony obviously clinging onto half the market.

 

[Evil_Cloud]

I thought Microsoft was around 51-ish some years ago and now is around 44-ish...

But let me get this straight. There is no way, Microsoft will be able to penetrate the Japanese market. And Sony is really strong in Europe, I don't see Microsoft going anywhere.

 

[aaaaa00]

Re: ...

And mind linking to something that says MS has no debt? And a link that says Sony had to borrow billions?

Microsoft:

SEC Filing Form 10-K 2003, Part 2, Item 7:

"We have no material long-term debt."

Sony:

SEC Filing Form 20-F 2003, P.6 :

Table: Balance Sheet Data: Long-term debt: 807,439 million Yen ($7,485,990,400 US)

Press Release:
http://www.sony.net/SonyInfo/News/Press/200312/03-055E

At the Executive Board held today, Sony Corporation ("Sony") has decided the issuance of the Euro Yen Zero Coupon Convertible Bonds due 2008 (bonds with stock acquisition rights, tenkanshasaigata shinkabu yoyakuken-tsuki shasai or the "Bonds") in the maximum principal amount of ¥250 billion (including those in the maximum amount of ¥30 billion to be issued upon exercise of the Greenshoe Option) with a contingent conversion feature.

Purpose of Financing
On October 28, 2003, Sony announced "Transformation 60" ("TR60"), a series of fundamental reforms across the Sony Group, consisting of two pillars; growth strategy through convergence of the Group's resources and technology; and a second phase of structural reforms aimed at enhancing the Group's operational profit structure. This financing is intended to provide strong support from a financial strategy perspective for the TR60, where growth strategy and structural reforms are simultaneously pursued, and should enable implementation of focused investments in growth areas.

 

[aaaaa00]

I thought Microsoft was around 51-ish some years ago and now is around 44-ish...

Microsoft SEC Filing Form 10K 2003, Item 6: Financial Highlights.

Revenue (millions US$)

$19,747 (1999)
$22,956 (2000)
$25,296 (2001)
$28,365 (2002)
$32,187 (2003)

Operating income (millions US$)

10,010 (1999)
11,006 (2000)
11,720 (2001)
11,910 (2002)
13,217 (2003)

Cash and short-term investments (millions US$)

17,236 (1999)
23,798 (2000)
31,600 (2001)
38,652 (2002)
49,048 (2003)

Total assets (millions US$)

38,321 (1999)
51,694 (2000)
58,830 (2001)
67,646 (2002)
79,571 (2003)

 

[Paul]

From this graph the goal of Xbox program was clear; its sole purpose of existence is to hurt SCEI by taking away market shares and not allowing SCEI to recoup its investment, and MS will do everything in its power to continue to hurt SCEI, profit be damned.

Kutaragi Ken might have met his match even he could not overcome....

An odd sense of De ja Vu has just overcame me, I could have sworn this was said around the year 2000.

 

[Squeak]

Re: ...

Bill Gates-san might have met his match even he could not overcome....

This is not a joke. SCEI is going up against an opponent with a bottomless bank account, a vastly superior development environment, and a long history of successfully eliminating its rivals. SCEI can't possibly hope to recoup its CELL investment against a rival willing to lose a couple billion to make sure CELL fails...

It's kind of strange that it will be PSX3 that will be forced out of market even though it is Xbox Next that's actually losing billions....

Call me crazy, but it seems to me that you are the happy bringer of the "news"?
Let me ask you a personal question Deadmeat, do you really want what you’re projecting to happen?
Do you really want ms to eat up another part of the computer industry?
Who exactly would that benefit?

Bill Gate's Kill List :

WordPerfect
Apple Macintoshi
Lotus 1-2-3
IBM OS/2
Novell Netware
Palm Pilot
Netscape Navigator
SCEI PlayStation3(TM)

Take notice that these product are all from areas (except the last one, and Palm AFAIK still lives on quite well) where ms is able to leverage their stranglehold on the PC industry.


Deadmeat, you’re insane, I really respect that.

 

[Evil_Cloud]

Thanks for clearing that up, my bad.

It's 79,571 billion dollars now or is it? They could buy Sony in the long term...

 

[Guden Oden]

Microsoft is a publically traded company, I am SURE its stock owners will not put up with their money squandered indefinitely just to MAYBE see a competitor hurt financially.

Businesses are in the business of making profit, not the opposite. MS has to answer to its owners like everybody else.

This thread is just dumb... Stop the hate, stop deadmeat.