More praise for x360 from Japanese developers

[Barbarian]

The problem with PS3 is not how hard it is to learn, rather how hard it is to use and develop for and how stable the development environment is. The whole architecture is new, new CPU, non-finalized GPU, multi core, new (two) compilers, Linux environment, buggy devkit, buggy libraries etc.
Plus, Sony has the habit of screwing up "mundain details" - like having 64bit pointers, which I find incredibly brain dead on a 256Mb machine.
Anyways, fame and glory come and go and it's all based on people's perceptions. If Xbox360 keeps getting labeled as cheaper to develop for and gains 1+ year market lead, that's a dangerous combination. There is a lot of paranoia going on among big development houses about development costs, and there are very few big publishers left. Little players are pretty much already dead or about to go out of business. If Xbox360 becomes the primary development platform, and titles are "ported" to PS3 that can have a siginificant long term imapact to Sony.

 

[Nesh]

.... buggy devkit, buggy libraries etc....

Buggy?Why buggy?

 

[Barbarian]

Buggy?Why buggy?

Software-wise buggy. I don't think there are any reports of HW bugs yet. But the software used to run the devkit and the libraries are very new and naturally have bugs and usability issues.

 

[jvd]

This reasoning is so flawed. People didn't buy the PS2 because it had more games. It was all about popularity.
We'll just have to wait until Sony starts preparing for it's Japan PS3 launch to get a clearer picture of what's really happening.

The first buyers bought for sony , those following bought for the games . They didn't hit 100 million units shiped because of thier name . As you can see thier walkman line is failing compared to the ipod . Name only moves so many units

Only reasoning thats flawed here is yours .

 

[zidane1strife]

I dont want to hear "it's easy to program for".

I want to hear "it's incredibly powerful".

That's what matters, the latter not the former.

Yet it is said that a console can be easy to program, but hard to tap... thus not showing the uber hidden power. It's quite interesting.

 

[_phil_]

no developpers are whinning.only wannabees.

 

[Thegameman]

That may be true.. But overall their graphics are still quite behind the Xbox. Especially the slightly blurry, lower detail tendency of their textures. I also see that they still have some pretty significant jaggy issues even with current games. Something that seems to have been getting ignored for some time now.

I just bought a new slim line PS2 with a few games. I have been playing an Xbox and a PSP for a while now. The Games are fun on the PS2. The Graphics are lacking. I don’t see where any master developer has overcome this yet.

The best looking games on PS2.

Tekken 5,GT4 are not far from the best xbox ones,even that the xbox is almost 2 years newer.


The average games look worst on PS2 but for the most part most multiconsole games look almost identical on both consoles.

 

[High Lander]

EE is way more problematic, and we got what ? 3000 games so far ??? At least 500 good ones ???

WHO NEEDS MORE TITLES ???

If we get 1000 games for PS3, being 300 really good ones, we´ll be very happy if we actually play 10% of it.

 

[Edge]

You know, at Starbucks it takes more effort to make a Latte, but that does not stop them from selling more Latte's than regular coffees. Once you know how to make a Latte, it's very simple to make the next one. Same goes for CELL programming.

When most people want Latte's, you make sure you know how to make them, or you go out of business.

Many of the graphical flaws of the PS2, is a result of the GPU, and the PS3 GPU easily solves all those graphical issues.

I borrowed my friends copy of Tekken 5 yesterday, and I was blown away, that the PS2 can do that. It's amazing, and you certainly will not see any jaggies.

 

[expletive]

You know, at Starbucks it takes more effort to make a Latte, but that does not stop them from selling more Latte's than regular coffees. Once you know how to make a Latte, it's very simple to make the next one. Same goes for CELL programming.

When most people want Latte's, you make sure you know how to make them, or you go out of business.

Many of the graphical flaws of the PS2, is a result of the GPU, and the PS3 GPU easily solves all those graphical issues.

I borrowed my friends copy of Tekken 5 yesterday, and I was blown away, that the PS2 can do that. It's amazing, and you certainly will not see any jaggies.

Starbucks charges more for Lattes becuase it takes them longer to make them. The cost assocaited with all this has always been at the crux of the debate.

 

[Edge]

Starbucks charges more for Lattes becuase it takes them longer to make them. The cost assocaited with all this has always been at the crux of the debate.

Some things in life are worth paying more for, and if you have greater sales for a product, it's worth spending the time and dollars to get the most out of the hardware. If that was not the case, we simply would not have consoles, but only PC's as gaming devices.

The PS2 is proof of this. Just shows you, people are willing to pay more for a Latte, because of it's perceived greater value.

 

[drpepper]

The PS2 is proof of this. Just shows you, people are willing to pay more for a Latte, because of it's perceived greater value.

Offtopic:
Another example of this and more akin to CE is the iPod. Surely one of the most expensive music players out there yet Apple is selling them in the millions. People are willing to pay more if it's worth the value.

 

[Johnny Awesome]

Not on YOUR TV with an RF modulator. LOL.

 

[Edge]

Not on YOUR TV with an RF modulator. LOL.

I guess maybe some people should put cream and sugar in their coffee, and maybe the taste won't be so bitter. Time to move on Johnny, and put your past grievances aside.

 

[ihamoitc2005]

Good PS2 Graphics

The best looking games on PS2.

Tekken 5,GT4 are not far from the best xbox ones,even that the xbox is almost 2 years newer.


The average games look worst on PS2 but for the most part most multiconsole games look almost identical on both consoles.

Best PS2 graphics are exclusive titles with very nice graphics also many with 60fps and Anti-Aliasing:

Soul Calibur 3
Tekken 5
Ace Combat 5
Jak 3
Ratchet and Clank 3
Ghost Hunter
GT4
WRC 5
Transformers
ZOE 2
Ikusagami (newest game)
Dragon Quest VIII
Kingdom Hearts 2
Champions 2

 

[expletive]

Some things in life are worth paying more for, and if you have greater sales for a product, it's worth spending the time and dollars to get the most out of the hardware. If that was not the case, we simply would not have consoles, but only PC's as gaming devices.

The PS2 is proof of this. Just shows you, people are willing to pay more for a Latte, because of it's perceived greater value.

That wasnt your point though. Your point was that once you know how to make a latte, its simple to make the next one. My point is that it isnt any cheaper to make a latte just because youve made one before. Starbucks charges more, probably for a number of reasons but one of them is that higher labor costs to make a latte. Same thing with frozen drinks at restaurant like milkshakes pina colaldas etc.

Man this discussion feels silly.

I think Sony will be sure to maximize their hardware but 3rd parties are going to plug all the factors in their magic formula and spit out which platform will maximize profits. That wont be the ONLY thing they use but it will figure prominently in most companies' thinking.

 

[ADEX]

no developpers are whinning.only wannabees.

I find it funny all this Cell is really difficult while XCPU is really easy.


In order to optimise for XCPU you need to know how to do multithreading, vector programming, cache management and efficient pre-fetching / streaming.

In order to optimise for Cell you need to know how to do multithreading, vector programming, local store management and efficient pre-fetching / streaming.

XCPU cores use an enhanced version of VMX with 128 registers.

Cell SPEs use a modified version of VMX with 128 registers.


There are differences sure, but I think they are being more than a little overplayed.

 

[Magnum PI]

don't forget to take account the environment development used on each plateform, it contributes making developping easier or more difficult.

 

[Farid]

Reminder:

Topic: More praise for x360 from Japanese developers

 

[dubyateeeff]

Plus, Sony has the habit of screwing up "mundain details" - like having 64bit pointers, which I find incredibly brain dead on a 256Mb machine.

What is wrong with 64-bit pointers on a 64-bit CPU? Cell is 64bit. BR has 25/50GB of space. Space that needs to be addressed. It may get a harddrive etc. And Cell will likely be used in other environments where it will have more mem (though I vaguely recall hering something about an upper limit...)

I dont think 64-bit pointers are wasting memory/bandwidth either either. So any other points than that?

EDIT: Not that I think its that important really, but Id like to hear your answear