Mmmmmm Droool

Yeah, that'd be sweet. They have a lot of ground to make up to Nebula in terms of EPG and TIVO features, IMO.

Nebula just released a beta driver (3.10) that allows a PC with a DigiTV card to act as a LAN freeview server. It's pretty neat - you install the software on client machines and they can receive a single channel or an entire transport stream, P2P or multicasted to all clients simultaneously. There are a few teething problems (e.g. multicasting currently impedes almost all TCP connectivity!) but it works and works well.

MuFu.
 
DaveBaumann said:
The Baron said:
I like the Wi-Fi idea, but Wi-Fi alone doesn't make it a Killer Thing.

No, it makes it very useful for numerous applications that I would want to put it to.
Hm. Now that I think about it, I can think of a few incredibly good uses for Wi-Fi that would require a computer (or maybe just cheap computers near the TVs and a server with 400 gigs of HD space). Having TiVo-like devices that automatically shared shows would be the sexiest thing imaginable. However, Wi-Fi's just not fast enough yet. G is definitely a step in the right direction, but we probably need actual (read: not theoretical) speeds of around 50Mbps before having a Wi-Fi HTPC really becomes a great thing. That would change everything, honestly...

Dave Baumann said:
The Baron said:
Now, if there were a wireless spec that allowed ultrafast communication over short distances, so you could replace some digital connections,

Well, there's always Bluetooth - many wireless keyboards and mice are bluetooth these days.
I think Bluetooth is between 300 and 400kbps max. So, that'd work for MP3s, but it wouldn't be fast enough to even transfer the sound from a CD (~1170 kbps, I think). So, if you could use something analogous to the wireless Firewire that some company demoed, that too would do a lot to make the HTPC more useful, as it would provide a realistic way to connect all devices to the HTPC, which would then connect to an amp/preamp and TV. Only problem with this is that it will never happen--corporations would be too worried about copying DVD-Audio or whatever. Still, that's the direction that we need to go in order to really make the HTPC into something that's not just a cooler-looking VCR with better video quality.

Dave Baumann said:
The Baron said:
that's be one thing, but at the end of the day, you'll be hard pressed to replicate the sound of high-end audio stuff from a computer. A shame, really. If I could magically combine a TiVo, an Xbox, an SACD player, and a DVD-Audio player without making any compromises, I'd do it in a second.

There's a gap opening between "real" high end audio and and consumer high end audio and that because real high end audio is analogue, whereas many sources these days are moving to digital. All the the sources you list (which can be done on the PC now, or will soon) are digital sources and if you pas the digital signal out then you are free to decode that as you please. Your main concern as far as the PC is concerned is probably the transport quality, but then thats not too important in comparison to th quality of your DAC which is external anyway.
I was under the impression that there were no drives that could play DVD-Audio or SACD on the computer. If some are on the horizon, HTPC looks a lot better than it does now (since it really would combine several different higher-end devices, rather than only replacing lower-end devices and requiring the use of higher-end devices with a lot of overlapping functionality). And yeah, I know about analog high end, but for the purposes of this argument, I'm only referring to high end as consumer high end--I'd be worried that the electromagnetic field put out by the computer would cause the cables-with-six-inches-of-shielding-all-the-way-around to not conduct as well.

HTPC seems like one of those things that's getting there hardware-wise, since it requires a lot of additional functionality as opposed to your normal desktop PCs. Software-wise, I don't really know--people are always working on it, and the Linux stuff is always improving, but we'll see what happens.

edit:

MuFu said:
Nebula just released a beta driver (3.10) that allows a PC with a DigiTV card to act as a LAN freeview server. It's pretty neat - you install the software on client machines and they can receive a single channel or an entire transport stream, P2P or multicasted to all clients simultaneously. There are a few teething problems (e.g. multicasting currently impedes almost all TCP connectivity!) but it works and works well.

That's the kind of thing that makes me want an HTPC.... jeez. That'd be nice.
 
MuFu said:
Nebula just released a beta driver (3.10) that allows a PC with a DigiTV card to act as a LAN freeview server. It's pretty neat - you install the software on client machines and they can receive a single channel or an entire transport stream, P2P or multicasted to all clients simultaneously. There are a few teething problems (e.g. multicasting currently impedes almost all TCP connectivity!) but it works and works well.

I've just been looking at the ATI Eazyshare documentation that I have - I though it was just about transferring video files, but its not - you can send live TV broadcasts over the Eazyshare network as well and the remote PC's can request to control the stations as well. It'd be rather cool to have a MediaCenter PC powered by and All-In-Wonder that is acting as the Eazyshare server as well.
 
Having TiVo-like devices that automatically shared shows would be the sexiest thing imaginable. However, Wi-Fi's just not fast enough yet. G is definitely a step in the right direction, but we probably need actual (read: not theoretical) speeds of around 50Mbps before having a Wi-Fi HTPC really becomes a great thing. That would change everything, honestly...

Well, I’ve heard that Easyshare is operable over Wi-Fi, but I’ve not checked out the quality yet.

I was under the impression that there were no drives that could play DVD-Audio or SACD on the computer.

They’re not, but they are invariably never far behind.

Another thing that bugs me about TiVo is the fact that it has to dial up everynight to get the schedules – what happens when TiVo fold? (Hardware has already been stopped in the UK) With Media Center the schedules are all downloaded from the net via MS, so with a Wi-Fi enabled media center PC it’ll just be able to download them straight from the broadband home network.
 
Dave Baumann said:
Another thing that bugs me about TiVo is the fact that it has to dial up everynight to get the schedules – what happens when TiVo fold? (Hardware has already been stopped in the UK) With Media Center the schedules are all downloaded from the net via MS, so with a Wi-Fi enabled media center PC it’ll just be able to download them straight from the broadband home network.
Apparently, once you have a network-enabled TiVo, it can get the schedules through the net. Admittedly, yeah, it's from TiVo, but considering the extent of the hacks to this point, if TiVo were to fold, the community would figure out a way to host the schedules online.
 
The Baron said:
I was under the impression that there were no drives that could play DVD-Audio or SACD on the computer.

Any DVD drive can play DVD-A; the big obstacle is licensing. The latest version of WinDVD can decode and reproduce full resolution, copy-protected DVD-A, but only when certain Creative products are installed (Audigy 2, A2 ZS etc). With all other hardware platforms it downsamples to 16/48. Depending on the card you have and the quality of it's driver-based downsampling, this may actually sound worse than a similarly mastered CD. AFAIK, unprotected DVD-As play back fine at 24/192 on the M-Audio Revo etc.

MuFu.
 
MuFu said:
The Baron said:
I was under the impression that there were no drives that could play DVD-Audio or SACD on the computer.

Any DVD drive can play DVD-A; the big obstacle is licensing. The latest version of WinDVD can decode and reproduce full resolution, copy-protected DVD-A, but only when certain Creative products are installed (Audigy 2, A2 ZS etc). With all other hardware platforms it downsamples to 16/48. Depending on the card you have and the quality of it's driver-based downsampling, this may actually sound worse than a similarly mastered CD. AFAIK, unprotected DVD-As play back fine at 24/192 on the M-Audio Revo etc.

MuFu.
AHHH. That answers a big question I had--could you copy a DVD-Audio disc? I was always under the impression that they were not special hardware-wise, but I've never seen anything that could play a DVD-A disc. Thanks, MuFu. Now, if they would just let me play SACDs in a computer since I have a lot more of those...
 
DVD-Audio are protected by a new encryption scheme called CPPM. It is very different from the CSS which protects DVD-Video. Since CPPM is a completely new design to address the DeCSS issue, I think it is likely to be much stronger. I don't think there will be a way to copy protected DVD-Audio in near future.

There is another protection for DVD-Audio, watermarking. Some (if not all) protected DVD-Audio has watermark in its audio content, which can be extracted and checked. If they don't match, the player will refuse to play it. Since you can't burn CSS/CPPM information into a DVD-R, you can't copy protected DVD-Audio discs to a DVD-R even if you break/bypass its CPPM protection (such as recording analog output from a DVD-Audio player with a high quality digital recorder). However, watermark may degrade the audio quality and some people seems to be able to hear that.

To fight against "unlawful" DVD-Audio players, the CPPM has a MKB which can be used to revoke them. So if a DVD-Audio player is cracked, it may not be able to play future DVD-Audio discs with renewed MKB. MKB is renewed every three months.

SACD is another story. Currently the decryption scheme in SACD can't be implemented in software (forbidden by the license). So I think it's unlikely to have a PC SACD player. Trused computing with some special hardwares may make it happen, though.
 
Dave I found something for you... would make a nice (and expensive) xmas present to yourself :p

http://atxstore.hushtechnologies.com/

homepic.gif


It is meant to be silent too.
 
SACD, the silliest standard ever ... it is not like they dont use PCM in the studios. Pulse width modulation is good for megaphones, but not for music.
 
Yeah I don't like SACD either. I still think PCM is more "natural." It also easier to work with PCM, such as downmixing, which is required by all DVD-Audio players.
 
MfA said:
SACD, the silliest standard ever ... it is not like they dont use PCM in the studios. Pulse width modulation is good for megaphones, but not for music.

Better call off the digital amp revolution then. :LOL:

MuFu.
 
That is just like delta sigma A/D conversion ... the only way either can work for high bitdepth is if it's hybridized with multilevel conversion.

24-bit 96 kHz makes for a slightly too high sample rate with 2-level PWM.
 
mega.jpg


If they could update this one I'd be in heaven. Right now there seems to be problems with the CPU HSF butting against the AGP card, and with the remote and front LED panels, radio, mp3 player etc only working when the computer isn't booted up. It would be nice if they could put together an AMD model too.
 
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