Microsoft getting ready for legal action..

[digitalwanderer]

Umm, can someone point out the misleading information on that 'fact sheet'. Just had a look, and for the life of me, I can't see it!

From the original link:

We just confirmed with Microsoft that another Sony claim -- that you need a memory unit or a hard drive to use the WiFi adapter -- is also false. You can grab a Core pack with no memory card and plug in a WiFi adapter and get on your home network. Sheez Sony, did we mention we moonlight as fact checkers?

And is Sony planning to include a free HDMI cable with each P3?

Sony sooo screwed up on this one.

 

[rounin]

or perhaps, some people have no sense of humor when the joke's on them.

after all... being a consumer of the console gaming industry is SERIOUS business.

Maybe, but most people don't find companies slinging falsities at each other to be a source of humor much less be involved as to identify ourselves (or others!) to be part of "the joke"

For the rest of us theres racist jokes to laugh at ourselves for :smile:

 

[Seb555]

Wow way to turn a little thing into a giant fiasco.

I don't see sony implying anything in that document that says you NEED to buy the HD drive or the HD or anything to have a usable console. I read it as "If you want equivalent functionality". If you read it that way it makes so much more sense.


IE:

You NEED to buy the HD DVD drive for the 360 to have equivalent HD media capability.
You NEED to buy the live subscription to be able to play online, etc etc

And before anyone calls me a Sony ******, I own an 360 and I have an Live subscription, and I'm pretty damn happy with it.

 

[Avon_Implosion]

under what charges? False/misleading info? What the hell, I think MS has been up on that anti-competitive hill for a bit too long.

 

[ZWSnipboy]

http://boards.ign.com/ps3_lobby/b8269/129558922/p1

"How is it deceiving if they just compare their cheapest version with MS's cheapest version? everybody is sooo quick to bash sony that they forget that most every other company would do the same thing, why would sony compare their cheap version with MS's top of the line version? it'd make no sense"

I don't understand why everyone (not here but in the media) is jumping on the Microsoft band wagon. Have we forgotten how many times Microsoft srewed us over. God how many times did Microsoft sell users 'supposedly completed' operating systems that cost us god knows how many problems. Even the 360's overheated (a sign of a reliable company, cough cough).

And some of you guys are sayin that Sony is getting desperate. I think its more like Microsoft whose so desperate as to fight over one god damn word! That word being: [Requires] ... Users to Buy.

Oh and have we forgotten how Nitendo was going to release Zelda Twilight Princess on the Game Cube? Well Nitendo got desperate and decided to make it a Wii game only. I think if any legal suits should be made it is one in favor of mislead Zelda fans.

 

[Carl B]

I don't understand why everyone (not here but in the media) is jumping on the Microsoft band wagon. Have we forgotten how many times Microsoft srewed us over. God how many times did Microsoft sell users 'supposedly completed' operating systems that cost us god knows how many problems. Even the 360's overheated (a sign of a reliable company, cough cough).

And some of you guys are sayin that Sony is getting desperate. I think its more like Microsoft whose so desperate as to fight over one god damn word! That word being: [Requires] ... Users to Buy.

It's not a pro-Microsoft streak in the media so much, so much as an anti-Sony streak. I don't think we need to swing the axe in the other direction and start talking about how 'MS has screwed' us though; all companies screw up, and I think (and hope) what people realize is that no company intends to.

 

[Hardknock]

; all companies screw up, and I think (and hope) what people realize is that no company intends to.

I don't believe that's the case with any major company. A lot of times these companies know exactly what they're doing.

It's a risk vs. rewards type situation. Obviously Sony feels the risk of something like this is worth the reward (higher percieved value over 360).

 

[Carl B]

I don't believe that's the case with any major company. A lot of times these companies know exactly what they're doing.

It's a risk vs. rewards type situation. Obviously Sony feels the risk of something like this is worth the reward (higher percieved value over 360).

I'm not talking about this flier thing anymore, I'm talking about ZWSnipboy's comment of:

Have we forgotten how many times Microsoft srewed us over. God how many times did Microsoft sell users 'supposedly completed' operating systems that cost us god knows how many problems. Even the 360's overheated (a sign of a reliable company, cough cough).

Would you not say that those 'screw-ups' on MS' part were well-meaning and not intended? Even to the extent that they 'knowingly' ship out software full of holes, I mean I just as well forgive them. Since when have we all become such that we demand perfection in all things? We have to be capable of some give, because these guys work under real-world constraints.

 

[ZWSnipboy]

I'm not talking about this flier thing anymore, I'm talking about ZWSnipboy's comment of:

Have we forgotten how many times Microsoft srewed us over. God how many times did Microsoft sell users 'supposedly completed' operating systems that cost us god knows how many problems. Even the 360's overheated (a sign of a reliable company, cough cough).

Would you not say that those 'screw-ups' on MS' part were well-meaning and not intended? Even to the extent that they 'knowingly' ship out software full of holes, I mean I just as well forgive them. Since when have we all become such that we demand perfection in all things? We have to be capable of some give, because these guys work under real-world constraints.

I agree with you.
But also wouldn't you say that it looks like Sony's been simply visiting some forums (or just using basic logic). Their pretty much repeating what people have been saying all along. $50 a year for Live really adds up by the end of the console's life cycle. However, the comparison will always be lopsided, since the HDD isn't required for the 360 and it'll never require use of the HD-DVD. Now, if anybody ever wanted to use their 360 as an HD movie player, that really does kill the value compared to just buying the PS3 instead. That's a fact.
All in all I don't think its anything people should be all worked up about. Thats why i think some lee-way for these dumb inperfections should be made by the media. Basically the reason i reffered to Microsoft was to retaliate in the same way people are scrutinizing Sony.

 

[Powderkeg]

Wow way to turn a little thing into a giant fiasco.

I don't see sony implying anything in that document that says you NEED to buy the HD drive or the HD or anything to have a usable console. I read it as "If you want equivalent functionality". If you read it that way it makes so much more sense.

It's interesting how you read what is not written, and don't see what is.

 

[Carl B]

I agree with you.
But also wouldn't you say that it looks like Sony's been simply visiting some forums (or just using basic logic). Their pretty much repeating what people have been saying all along. $50 a year for Live really adds up by the end of the console's life cycle. However, the comparison will always be lopsided, since the HDD isn't required for the 360 and it'll never require use of the HD-DVD. Now, if anybody ever wanted to use their 360 as an HD movie player, that really does kill the value compared to just buying the PS3 instead. That's a fact.
All in all I don't think its anything people should be all worked up about. Thats why i think some lee-way for these dumb inperfections should be made by the media. Basically the reason i reffered to Microsoft was to retaliate in the same way people are scrutinizing Sony.

Two things.

First, I don't exactly understand what you're saying, so I'm just going to respond to the general ideas I think you're trying to convey. Which is the second thing.

These flyers, crap like this... it's just stupid all around; their creation and the reactions both. I go to the Inquirer every day, Engadget fairly often, DailyTech every day... because hell, I like to keep my finger on the pulse of the tech world at large. But these guys are *not* good at research, explaining what the story is about, or any sort of in depth analysis. That's my job as the educated reader. I mean look at Engadget with this story here - they had to contact Microsoft to confirm that the WiFi didn't need a hard drive? Dude what the hell - why didn't they call me instead? I could have told them! But believe me although I visit these places, I go through a lot of mental anguish every day even reading half of their headlines.

Anyway PS3 is - in my opinion - a great 'value.' And that's the bottom line for me. It does what I want; the Linux, the Blu-ray, the HDMI, the titles it'll get. Some people are convined that's like 1% of the population. Well, maybe it is (though I personally don't think so). But I'm smack there in that 1%, and I will use these features often.

PS - As for the media thing, well I think there's a combination of people that have an outright agenda against Sony out there setting the tone (like Charlie D at the Inq), and the fact that console ******s are *so* avid about discussing stuff like this - MasterDisaster's thread a case in point - that truly in any given day a PS3 story on these sites will be the most visited article they have. And the more negative the better in terms of hits... which of course is why most of these guys seem to try to have at least one Sony related story a day.

 

[ZWSnipboy]

Two things.

First, I don't exactly understand what you're saying, so I'm just going to respond to the general ideas I think you're trying to convey. Which is the second thing.

I'll try and elaborate on what i'm trying to say.

In response to what you wrote ealier:

Would you not say that those 'screw-ups' on MS' part were well-meaning and not intended? Even to the extent that they 'knowingly' ship out software full of holes, I mean I just as well forgive them. Since when have we all become such that we demand perfection in all things? We have to be capable of some give, because these guys work under real-world constraints.

Unclear:
All in all I don't think its anything people should be all worked up about. Thats why i think some lee-way for these dumb inperfections should be made by the media. Basically the reason i reffered to Microsoft was to retaliate in the same way people are scrutinizing Sony.

Rephrased:
As you were saying we have to be capable of some give in regards to the slight faults companies make. When instead we ought to be extolling their great acheivements aimed at improving/simplifying our lives (whether it be through entertainment, products or services). I agreed that my statement on the Microsoft O.P. was harsh but so is the scrutiny towards the PS3. And thats what i found intreguin. Its easy to criticize a company for their mistakes. Its also easy to take new advancements in technology for granted. In the end both companies are simply trying to please the customers. We ought to be less stingy with our analytical claims.

 

[onanie]

Anyway PS3 is - in my opinion - a great 'value.' And that's the bottom line for me. It does what I want; the Linux, the Blu-ray, the HDMI, the titles it'll get. Some people are convined that's like 1% of the population. Well, maybe it is (though I personally don't think so). But I'm smack there in that 1%, and I will use these features often.

Value is certainly subjective in some ways. The "Fact sheet" (i have not scrutinised it in detail) is created to convey Sony's perspective on the value difference between the two consoles (and have since taken liberal shots from the usual suspects here). It isn't without merit, in my opinion. If the core 360 was spec'ed to perform identically to the base PS3 model (add 20gb HDD, wireless control, gold subscription), how much would you have paid in the end? Even comparing the premium 360 to the base PS3 model - if you were to add a HDDVD drive (even for a non-gaming purpose in this unique case), what would the total cost be?

Obviously Sony feels differently to Microsoft about what is "required" accessory, though in this case I don't think it was so wrong to "require" more. Legally, is there even a case?

 

[Acert93]

I can forsee this turning into one of those 'whose the worst BSing company' threads. Ugh. All I can say it's a never ending downward turn. Dishonerable conduct all round.

Yeeeep.

It's not a pro-Microsoft streak in the media so much, so much as an anti-Sony streak. I don't think we need to swing the axe in the other direction and start talking about how 'MS has screwed' us though; all companies screw up, and I think (and hope) what people realize is that no company intends to.

I think part of it is Sony fans are not quite as used to it maybe? MS got a ton of heat last fall. Just pick a topic... ironically, some of the same rumors went the same way. e.g. 2.8GHz Xenon/Cell, and for certain posters whether to "believe" or "be offended" was a console preference issue.

Is Sony getting an unfair shake? Of course. But I think it is sign of the industry in general (i.e. the crap is floating to the top where Sony is). And of course there is one other reason: Sony has shown "chinks" in their armour. IMO Sony's execution on the PS3 lacks much of the polish that they demonstrated with previous consoles. A delay, high point of sale, shortages, clock reductions, game no shows, etc can of set the stage for those with other agendas to make junk stick. In the past Sony's execution would have made such coockie and crazy suggestions tossed to the wind... but now day, when someone runs a patent story about Sony and say, game rentals, and looking at Sony's DRM with BluRay and general consumer fears those things take a life of their own. When you delay wait until the last moment to delay, and then months later have to change your numbers AGAIN... and then delay in some areas... AGAIN!... all the time waiting until the last moment to say anything (reactive instead of proactive) it sets a simple stage:

People don't know what you are really going to do, and since people are anxious and you are late giving the word, they look to rumors. Rumors have been right before, so as STUPID and OUTLANDISH as most are (as discerning posters here can tell in most cases) the uncertainty that has become Sony PR in many ways creates a climate where FUD can permeat.

Kind of the same storm that MS/Nintendo live in due to being further down the pecking order and their various corporate factors. MS continues to have leak problems too, which really underminds their marketing skills in many ways and opens them up to the same sort of attacks and sensationalism. Nintendo just opens themselves up anytime Iwata or Yamauchi talks

 

[assen]

r me. It does what I want; the Linux, the Blu-ray, the HDMI, the titles it'll get.

Can you please elaborate, maybe starting another thread, what value do you see in having Linux on the PS3? It's something that has always eluded me (along with the whole "homebrew" thing on handhelds - wtf with the breakout/tetris clones?)

 

[digitalwanderer]

 

[sir doris]

have I missed something?

Right, I've read page 1 and skimmed page 3 of this thread, exactly what parts of this sheet are sooooo offensive?

I noticed they do seem to go into more detail on the PS3 and skim over some of the competitions specs but why allt he fuss?

 

[Carl B]

Can you please elaborate, maybe starting another thread, what value do you see in having Linux on the PS3? It's something that has always eluded me (along with the whole "homebrew" thing on handhelds - wtf with the breakout/tetris clones?)

I don't know what to tell you - if it eludes you, it eludes you.

It's the technology fan in me. I'm by no means saying it's for everybody (hell I put myself as potentially part of a 1% group), but I mean - I will use it, and there's just something aesthetically pleasing to me - in the most abstract sense - that this console will grant me this functionality. I was ready for a big let down if this didn't come through, and for me... it would have been a let down.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Can you please elaborate, maybe starting another thread, what value do you see in having Linux on the PS3?

You need another thread?! There's been a fair few of these already! In short, an affordable, functional alternative to Windows is something plenty of people would like to see, and in a closed and technically advanced box, the efficiency of the software could be very high. I think interest in Linux in PS3 is highest amongst former Amiga owners who appreciate how much hardware can be stretched to achieve amazing things when it's well designed and uniform across all users.

 

[Arwin]

(along with the whole "homebrew" thing on handhelds - wtf with the breakout/tetris clones?)

wtf with the shoutcast client (pspradio with lots of plugins), pdf reader (Bookr, which has no problems displaying 10mb Cell Programmer's Manuals), links2 browser (fast, nice keyinput,https support), rss text readers, email clients, IM clients, emulators (Steem is my personal favorite, and legal), full-res movie players, movie stream-players, Quake 2 with full multiplayer network support, and so on?

Seriously, some of the homebrew stuff is excellent quality and really deserves a full release. And all the above is just PSP software. On the PS3, there are almost no limits. I can't wait to see what people will manage on it, maybe even including yours truly.