Grall put forth that MS thinks they are apple and the kinect pricing is out of line. I am clearly showing its right in line with its competition. Apple is not in line with its competition.
Kinect price confirmed 150USD plus arcade model priced
- Thread starter Alkohallick
- Start date
Grall put forth that MS thinks they are apple and the kinect pricing is out of line. I am clearly showing its right in line with its competition. Apple is not in line with its competition.
I'm disappointed. It'll still sell like mad in bundle form, but the standalone really is too much. It's difficult to justify a peripheral costing 75% the full console cost. Then again this is Microsoft.
I'm most annoyed by the UK price. The 360S is rrp 200GBP here (picked mine up for 180). Which is favorable. Whereas the kinect bundle will be 250 GBP...
When all is said and done, I expect it'll still sell out over christmas. The question is if the price will come down afterwards.
I'm most annoyed by the UK price. The 360S is rrp 200GBP here (picked mine up for 180). Which is favorable. Whereas the kinect bundle will be 250 GBP...
When all is said and done, I expect it'll still sell out over christmas. The question is if the price will come down afterwards.
Actually you kept speculating that the flash was built in...and I think I predicted/speculated the 4GB number/USB stick thing first
While the 4GB Arcade is a great idea, the Kinect pricing is disappointing as I kept hoping they were going to spring a fast one on us.
Also I'm thinking Kinectimals will be the casual killer app for Kinect at launch, and maybe should have been the pack in. Interesting theyre not going with a generic sports collection ala Nintendo and Sony. Thinking about it though, I imagine you need to at least throw the men of the "family" a bone with the pack in, which Kinectimals doesn't.
Making the Arcade a lot more capable with enough flash to dabble in XBLA/DLC is a killer stroke though, I really think so. It will make average consumers see 199 as a much less gimped entry model.
But, no news on the rumored possible 399/250 gb Kinect bundle?
As for all this talk of MS gouging, pricing too high etc, I have to think the Kinect price is mostly based on it's cost. The unit is simply costly, and probably cost $150 to manufacture. In time this will come down.
Another interesting thought is, if it doesn't sell well because the price is too high, some immediate price cutting could occur.
If theyre announcing all these prices for fall though, I guess that also rules out any base sku hardware price cuts this year. Also disappointing.
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(((interference)))
Veteran
Quite pathetic
They waste our time making us hang on only to announce a price that we've already known for the past two or so months.
It really is ridiculously expensive considering how much the hardware has been downgraded, $150 for a 320x240 30 fps camera!
Definitely not an attractive proposition for existing owners, we may even have to pay extra for the separate power adapter needed for older 360s or have they said that'll be included in the Kinect package?
They waste our time making us hang on only to announce a price that we've already known for the past two or so months.
It really is ridiculously expensive considering how much the hardware has been downgraded, $150 for a 320x240 30 fps camera!
Definitely not an attractive proposition for existing owners, we may even have to pay extra for the separate power adapter needed for older 360s or have they said that'll be included in the Kinect package?
Silent_Buddha
Legend
Wives/girlfriends of gamers that already have an X360? Although I can already imagine the arguments.
Husband - It's my Halo Reach time!
Wife - It's time for me to do exercises, no sex for you if you don't get off the Xbox.
Anyways, as I've speculated before this is just typical launch pricing with MS predicting they'll still sell ever single Kinect they can make this holiday season. Then sometime next year they'll drop the price to 99 USD, along with announcing some core type games at E3. Possibly Forza 4 (tech demo already demonstrated), a Capcom core game (hinted at by Capcom), a Sega core game (hinted at by Sega), etc...
99 USD + core games would then be more attractive to the current install base where the launch units are all geared towards people that do not already own a console. 150 USD additionally makes an X360 console bundle that much more attractive. "Look honey we can save 50 USD when we buy the bundle." Which again plays to Microsofts stated intention of expanding the user base rather than targetting the existing user base.
If it works it's absolutely brilliant. If MS has misjudged how many non console owners are interested in a console but don't like existing controllers, it could be anything from lukewarm to a failure.
Regards,
SB
The $299 Kinect package is a great value. I had already assumed Microsoft wouldn't include the 250gb drive. I'm just surprised they are going with 3 different SKUs again. A 250gb with Kinect bundle is woefully missing. That definitely sends out a signal that Kinect is totally not for the hardcore. Though considering the type of games they've announced you can't blame them. Maybe they'll release Kinect with their premium SKU once they start getting those kind of games sometime next year.
Tommy McClain
Tommy McClain
I don't see teh point of having a $400-$450 sku on the market. Will make them look over priced compared to thier competition.
If they could afford it, they should just throw kinect in by default free. I still think you run the risk of dreamcasting these peripherals when you dont include them in every console sold.
And to think, at one time I saw that (kinect free pack in) as worst case scenario :lol
For $150 dollars I'm really not sure about a personal Kinect purchase now.
The move PS3 is 399. Actually, maybe that's what MS was thinking about. They look $100 cheaper. And Kinect buyers probably do not care about a hard drive.
Looked at another way, I paid 299 for my launch Core, now you can get a 360 with 4GB memory, built in wi-fi, and Kinect for the same price. Of course, it's five years later.
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wtf do you mean by dreamcasting ? Surely you should use power gloving , eye toying or something more relevent. The dreamcast sold well and had a ton of great software.
Right , the good thing on the 360 is you have no mandatory installs at all , so a 4GB xbox 360 can actually work. I still think they shoul have added 8 gigs of flash though. Hopefully next year they will update it.
I bought my 360 launch day. $400 for the 360 + a media remote and 20 gig drive. Now for $300 you get the 360 + 250 gig drive + wifi. So not bad in 5 years. You also get a better system in the end.
That's one of things I considered: how much I paid for my systems. Holiday 06 I paid $400 and got a 20gb with no HDMI or wireless(though I did I get a free $100 gift card to buy 2 games). Then in May 2009 paid $400 for a 120gb with HDMI, no wireless and 1 game I didn't want(though I did trade that pack-in and sold the old system for $200 with a game and some accessories to help pay for it). Spending $150 on a peripheral and a game is no big deal in the grand scheme of things and the same could be send for spending $300 for a whole system with Kinect.
As for not having a $400 model, I definitely understand the perception that would have. Much better to show Kinect & a system less than the PS3 Move bundle. They are already having problems in an apple to apple comparison at the current prices. There's no need to make it any easier by having a $400 SKU.
Tommy McClain
MS' competition is the Wii as well. In fact, it's mainly the Wii. Why don't you mention the Wii in your argument?
specwarGP2
Regular
$299 is a great price for the bundle. $150 for the standalone is like a slap in the face to the core crowd. It's just weird how a camera is half the price of the pro console.
Silent_Buddha
Legend
He linked to them. He compared the expensive Move to the expensive Kinect and went 'gee, they're both expensive, they're directly comparable' while ignoring the elephant in the room -- probably because of the target shifting I mentioned earlier. MS doesn't have to just beat out Sony for this different audience's attention, they have to beat Nintendo.
I didn't specificly address the wii because its diffrent. Motion control is part of the core experance on the wii and has been. With both the ps3 and 360 its a secondary experiance. The wii does not offer a standard core controller by default and doesn't offer traditional new gaming with core controllers. Its hard to directly value the core games of the ps3 / 360 (cods , halos , god of wars and what not ) vs the motion only experiance of the wii (zelda has no traditional control scheme neither does mario and so on). The wii also lacks HD graphics. How does one st a value to any of these things when they are not comparable.
I did however include charts that had it on there.
Silent_Buddha
Legend
Nintendo is definitely going to be the closest competitor to Kinect, however, I really don't think the Wii owners are the direct target of Kinect. The games certainly bear some resemblence to Wii games, after all both the intended target for Kinect and the majority of Wii buyers are casual gamers looking for an alternative.
Ah, but that means they're the same. Well it certainly seems that way. And perhaps the no-controller versus controller is too fine a distinction for some, but apparently MS is absolutely convinced that there's a large group of people out there that haven't even bought a Wii due to the controls, even as casual as it is.
I'm not saying they are right or wrong in that assumption, but that's what they are going after. Any Wii/PS3/X360 converts along the ways are just ancilliary bonuses at this time.
Regards,
SB
Could the pricing a decisions related to the Kinect, console and bundled prices have anything to do with manufacturing realities? If they cut the price of either or both Kinect and the consoles they may not be able to meet the demand for both in the short term to Christmas, which would mean they would effectively lose revenue without any gain. So with that in mind, did they put Wifi and a larger flash capacity in the Arcade because they knew they couldn't cut the price anyway?
In 2011 with the prices of various components coming down and their NRE being amortized over a number of consoles sold they could reassess earlier in the year, perhaps towards the end of Q1 where they want to be in regards to pricing for the coming year. I believe they aren't averse to cutting the price more than once as they did that in early 2008 in the United States and then later again in the same year if I recall correctly. Im not 100% certain as I cannot say what their objectives might be, but I would do it if I were in their position.
Personally I feel something like $169 standalone Arcade, $119 Kinect and $249 for both 250GB and the bundle wouldn't be too bad, especially as it would mean they could price the full bundle with everything at $299 to coincide with core game releases as I suspect they have been pushed towards 2011.
In 2011 with the prices of various components coming down and their NRE being amortized over a number of consoles sold they could reassess earlier in the year, perhaps towards the end of Q1 where they want to be in regards to pricing for the coming year. I believe they aren't averse to cutting the price more than once as they did that in early 2008 in the United States and then later again in the same year if I recall correctly. Im not 100% certain as I cannot say what their objectives might be, but I would do it if I were in their position.
Personally I feel something like $169 standalone Arcade, $119 Kinect and $249 for both 250GB and the bundle wouldn't be too bad, especially as it would mean they could price the full bundle with everything at $299 to coincide with core game releases as I suspect they have been pushed towards 2011.
Move bundle
$100 for game + movev controller + eye toy.
$50 for move controller
$150 for two players on move with a game vs
$150 for two players and a game on kinect.
Though I still think $130 would have been a better price.
http://www.pressstartgames.com/2010/07/motion-gaming-price-comparison.html
Of course there are side cases like what if you already have an eye toy. However the kinect prices seem to be in line . Still think $130 would have been best
That chart is pretty comical; Sony's marketing department produced similar analysis to compare the initial investment on a PS3 to the 360 with their point being that while the PS3 had a higher upfront cost once you added in all the needed options to your 360 (wireless, play and charge kit, Live subscription, hard drive and Blu Ray player) that the PS3 was cheaper. At the time many argued that Microsoft's modular approach gave gamers choice and didn't force features on gamers while those who saw the value in Sony's approach agreed with the chart.
This round Sony gives gamers the lower initial cost along with more flexibility and Microsoft's interpretation of motion control will require additional upfront cost but not require additional investment later. It will be interesting to watch those who argued so passionately about the pros/cons of each approach previously comment on the relative value of each companies value/choice propositions for motion control integration.
Silent_Buddha
Legend
It's a bit difficult to make a modular camera system, no? It isn't as if Microsoft could have chosen to sell parts of the Kinect camera system seperately because the majority of people would never use it. Let the people with money to burn pay for the extra's. Why punish people that don't need those features?
Additionally Sony did that to attempt to justify its extravagent price, yet in this case with Kinect the X360 bundle is still 100 USD cheaper than the PS3 bundle.
So the analogy doesn't really fit in any way, at least when applied to the X360 and PS3.
Wii on the other hand is 100 USD cheaper, as long as you don't mind playing by yourself.
Regards,
SB
It isn't as if Microsoft could have chosen to sell parts of the Kinect camera system seperately because the majority of people would never use it. Let the people with money to burn pay for the extra's. Why punish people that don't need those features?Additionally Sony did that to attempt to justify its extravagent price, yet in this case with Kinect the X360 bundle is still 100 USD cheaper than the PS3 bundle.
So the analogy doesn't really fit in any way, at least when applied to the X360 and PS3.
Wii on the other hand is 100 USD cheaper, as long as you don't mind playing by yourself.
Regards,
SB
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