John Carmack talked @ GDC

[Sxotty]

It's funny that he talked about making a Quake-remix, considering Raven is already working on Quake 4 with the Doom 3 engine.

Not necessarily, quake2 and quake3 are slighty different. I think quake2 has a vague story line while quake3 is complete shooting & killing game.

Man have you even played them quake3 is multiplayer only with bots.

Quake2 does have a story, it is a decent one actually if you played it. id has a problem of letting you skip all the cutscenes and briefings so that more than half the people never even saw the story. And I will admit the way the showed the story to the player was not really that great, but it was definitely there.

edit:
My understanding was that they considered redoing quake2, but then decided to let raven take it and make a sequel. Just like somebody else made return to castle wolfenstein.

 

[Simon F]

"gotten an nv40 card and plugged it into [his] dev system" and that "it rocks". It was a spontaneous aside, but boy, you can't beat that kind of endorseme

Couldn't that just mean that his AGP socket has worn out and that the card's a bit loose? 8)

 

[[maven]]

Good one Simon!

 

[Headstone]

recall that he really liked the nV30 a lot as well

 

[Tommy]

So does this mean Q4 is not using the Doom 3 engine?

Or is it really a lot different type game than Q2?

If no to both questions...then why did he even consider remaking Q2 at all?

 

[digitalwanderer]

So does this mean Q4 is not using the Doom 3 engine?

Someone actually told me a wild-assed rumor a couple of three days ago about Raven changing over from Id's engine to the UT2k4 engine, but it just seemed so far-fetched that I haven't put much stock in it yet. (Plus I haven't heard it anywhere else yet 'cept from the one source. Nothing against my one source, but they weren't totally confident about it either although they had it reported to 'em on what they considered reliable authority. :| )

I never made that connection before 'til you mentioned it, thanks.

 

[991060]

Does anyone know if there's a video/audio footage about JC's talk? The last footage from his quakecon2002 speech is really interesting.

 

[Hellbinder]

The TRuth is wether people are willing to admit it or not is he likes whatever Nvidia gives to him. They have a "Special" relationship. Just like Epic and Sweeney has with Nvidia.

 

[DemoCoder]

The TRuth is wether people are willing to admit it or not is he likes whatever Nvidia gives to him. They have a "Special" relationship. Just like Epic and Sweeney has with Nvidia.

Or Gabe and ATI right?

Please, Carmack is one of the most forthright and honest people in the entire industry. He's already rich, doesn't need anyone, and can do whatever the heck he wants. The guy's building a friggin rocket ship for christsakes, has given away the source code to many of his engines, and has contributed to Open Source GL drivers. He could have been alot wealthier if he wanted to, and "sold out", but he chose to stay at a small company and keep his freedom.

The fact that he didn't find the NV30 completely worthless and had some nice things to say about it really bugs you, but it is hardly indicative that he is a liar, has a hidden agenda, or is overly influenced by IHV relationships. He is also given cards by other IHVs as well, and he has heavy influence on the industry.

 

[digitalwanderer]

The TRuth is wether people are willing to admit it or not is he likes whatever Nvidia gives to him. They have a "Special" relationship. Just like Epic and Sweeney has with Nvidia.

Or Gabe and ATI right?

Please, Carmack is one of the most forthright and honest people in the entire industry. He's already rich, doesn't need anyone, and can do whatever the heck he wants. The guy's building a friggin rocket ship for christsakes, has given away the source code to many of his engines, and has contributed to Open Source GL drivers. He could have been alot wealthier if he wanted to, and "sold out", but he chose to stay at a small company and keep his freedom.

The fact that he didn't find the NV30 completely worthless and had some nice things to say about it really bugs you, but it is hardly indicative that he is a liar, has a hidden agenda, or is overly influenced by IHV relationships. He is also given cards by other IHVs as well, and he has heavy influence on the industry.

I used to agree with your opinion of the Carmack, but ever since that fiasco of a Doom3 benchmark that he took part in I haven't felt quite the same.

Be careful who you make your idol, they may just have feet-o-clay.

 

[DemoCoder]

What Doom3 benchmark "fiasco" are you referring to? Are you talking about doing a NV30 fragment shader path for a DX8-level engine (made originally for the GF2/3 level HW) that wasn't built for PS2.0 and high precision, and therefore not making the NV30 look really bad by running at high precisions that his engine doesn't require?

Or are you talking about the ATI leak of the D3 alpha?

 

[John Reynolds]

What Doom3 benchmark "fiasco" are you referring to? Are you talking about doing a NV30 fragment shader path for a DX8-level engine (made originally for the GF2/3 level HW) that wasn't built for PS2.0 and high precision, and therefore not making the NV30 look really bad by running at high precisions that his engine doesn't require?

Or are you talking about the ATI leak of the D3 alpha?

He's referring to the Doom 3 benchmarks a select few sites were allowed to publish when the FX 5950 launched last year. People are quick to blame the developer when the publisher might be the more likely culprit.

Edit: And culprit probably isn't the right word I'm looking to use. If id is guilty of favoring nVidia then Valve is just as guilty of favoring ATI.

 

[digitalwanderer]

He's referring to the Doom 3 benchmarks a select few sites were allowed to publish when the FX 5950 launched last year. People are quick to blame the developer when the publisher might be the more likely culprit.

Edit: And culprit probably isn't the right word I'm looking to use. If id is guilty of favoring nVidia then Valve is just as guilty of favoring ATI.

Yes I am, and Carmack himself even said the damned thing wasn't a good way to benchmark the cards yet he let it happened and helped 'em.

To the best of my knowledge, Valve didn't say anything that wasn't true nor did their results contradict all the synthetics....the D3 benchmark was nothing like that! (ATi wasn't even contacted in advance? Please! )

 

[hoom]

Its also worth noting that he said the r3x0 mode does somewhat better effects (per pixel, mathematical rather than per vertex, texture lookup) than the nv3x mode & that he was impressed with the difference.

 

[John Reynolds]

Yes I am, and Carmack himself even said the damned thing wasn't a good way to benchmark the cards yet he let it happened and helped 'em.

Well, I'm hardly a id Software zealot but in Carmack's defense he might've been under a little pressure from Activision and, on a more personal note, still peeved at ATI for the D3 leak.

To the best of my knowledge, Valve didn't say anything that wasn't true nor did their results contradict all the synthetics....the D3 benchmark was nothing like that! (ATi wasn't even contacted in advance? Please! )

The Shader day event probably wasn't the best forum for some of the comments that were made, IMO. As for the D3 benchmarks, I had a larger issue with the sites willing to publish the #s generated within a rather 'unclean test environment' for the inevitable traffic they would generate than I did nVidia, id, or Activision.

 

[Pete]

No, Carmack said nV's included timedemo probably wasn't fair, and he created one of his own to use for benchmarking. And he did complain about the FX Flow's noise.

As much as we may think R300 is superior to NV30 in most games, JC probably prefers nV just because it works (and NV3x's superior performance in D3 can be explained by the architectures apparent overtures to JC's games). As a software engineer, JC probably prefers solving with problems of his own design, rather than dealing with others' boo-boos. I don't blame him for the D3 benchmarks, as they were just a gratuitous sneak peek (man, I miss Hook's performance blogs)--a nice gesture, even though nV was pushing it for probably less considerate reasons. The blame for any misinterpretations of the D3 (or HL2) alpha benches lies more with the ignorant reader or reviewer than the developer or benchmark itself, IMO. And it's not as if JC didn't say NV3x was less than perfect for straight DX9 coding.

 

[Doomtrooper]

Edit: And culprit probably isn't the right word I'm looking to use. If id is guilty of favoring nVidia then Valve is just as guilty of favoring ATI.

Possibly Valve was trying to tell the truth, I think Microsoft also endorsed the HL2 benchmarks. What Valve did by exposing the cheating was LONG overdue as Futuremark couldn't handle it.

 

[DemoCoder]

Possibly Valve was trying to tell the truth

I just wish they'd tell the truth about the Half-Life 2 delay. Valve doesn't have any credibility with me as a guardian of truth and justice.

 

[Fodder]

Someone actually told me a wild-assed rumor a couple of three days ago about Raven changing over from Id's engine to the UT2k4 engine, but it just seemed so far-fetched that I haven't put much stock in it yet.

I call shenanigans on that one. Raven have a little seat to the left of Carmack's throne labelled 'premier development partner', which gives them unprecedented access to pre-release engines and ID staff know-how. Add to that that their publisher, Activision, has a similar little seat to the right, and it seems they have a very healthy and favourable relationship with ID. As well, by the time Q4 makes an appearance (2005, I'd guess), UE2 is going to be looking just a little dated without a major revamp. And of course, ID own the Quake name and I very strongly doubt they'd allow Raven to go off and make it on a competitors engine.

 

[digitalwanderer]

Someone actually told me a wild-assed rumor a couple of three days ago about Raven changing over from Id's engine to the UT2k4 engine, but it just seemed so far-fetched that I haven't put much stock in it yet.

I call shenanigans on that one. Raven have a little seat to the left of Carmack's throne labelled 'premier development partner', which gives them unprecedented access to pre-release engines and ID staff know-how. Add to that that their publisher, Activision, has a similar little seat to the right, and it seems they have a very healthy and favourable relationship with ID. As well, by the time Q4 makes an appearance (2005, I'd guess), UE2 is going to be looking just a little dated without a major revamp.

Hey, I did say it was a "wild-assed rumor"...didn't I? :|