JJ Abrams to demolish another sci-fi franchise

[Mariner]

DS9 would have been better without Sisko's preposterous overacting. Well, the actor who played Sisko - you know what I mean. I also thought the grand finale of the series was just rubbish.

Voyager wasn't bad, either. As with most of the modern ST shows, some of the episodes were rubbish po-faced claptrap but generally, I enjoyed watching most of them.

That said, I never got around to watching more than about a series and a half of Enterprise though I thought that was pretty decent. Much more humour than the other shows. That reminds me, I really need to get around to watching the rest of Enterprise.

Anyway, regardless of that, I'm hoping Abrams does a bit of a better job with the new Star Wars than he managed with Star Trek!

 

[Davros]

Speaking of scfi Davros thinks everyone should watch Battlestar Galactica (not the 70's show)
then Caprica

 

[Squilliam]

This is something that splits the fans to 2 groups really, you either like DS9 or Voyager, but rarely both (conveniently, those who like DS9 often also like Babylon 5 :neutral: )

I prefer Voyager to DSL and I also like Babylon 5.

 

[swaaye]

Whoa a Trek discussion on B3D. I like all of the series to varying degrees. TNG is definitely my favorite. DS9 has some really entertaining supporting actors. Voyager is OK but was mostly a missed opportunity to do something fresh, as was Enterprise.

None of the TNG movies did much for me though. Actually Generations may be my favorite of them because it still had the glorious D. Love the TOS movies, even 5.

JJ Trek was a bit of a bummer but better than nothing I guess. I doubt anyone can do worse than Lucas for Star Wars.

 

[digitalwanderer]

I've been following Star Trek since the 60s, and I really liked Abrams reboot...sorry.

I'm excited to see what he brings to Star Wars, I figure it just can't be worse than the prequels were.

 

[Mariner]

Speaking of scfi Davros thinks everyone should watch Battlestar Galactica (not the 70's show)
then Caprica

The first series of the Galactica reboot was pretty good, the second not too bad but things went rapidly downhill from there. I ended up watching them all because I thought I ought to but looking back, I really do see it as quite a big chunk of my time wasted.

Never bothered with Caprica as I was sick to death of BSG by the time that show came out. It did receive very good reviews but then so did BSG.

 

[Grall]

I'm a trekker, always have been. Not terribly overenthused of the original series, that was not the world I grew up in. Liked all the shows that followed though, but like Swaaye I feel Voyager and Enterprise was somewhat of a missed opportunity. Too much reliance on alien-of-the-week stuff instead of a cohesive story arch. When Enterprise did story in the third season it went to shit, because they picked such a ludicrous premise to do a story about. Final season was Enterprise's best though, by FAR. I was really sad when they cancelled the show, the new producer whatsisname seemed to really have a grip of it. I wish more would have given Enterprise a chance, but Braga/Moore wrecked too much earlier on.

Speaking of Braga, he did pretty darned well with Galactica early on, I totally loved the first two seasons and then the decline started. Slowly at first but then accelerating. As soon as they started underemphasizing all the mythology they'd built up in previous seasons the credibility went out from under their feet. Also, there were too many unsympathetic and/or whiny characters on the show, that fat slob deck chief whatsisname for example - who was really cut in the pilot lol - I really hated him. I wished he'd just throw himself out of an airlock or something but then they went and made him a cylon... *sigh*

Oops. Did I spoil for anyone? Sorry. No I'm not. The series pretty much sucked, overall, with the totally disappointing final season or two.

 

[Davros]

Never bothered with Caprica as I was sick to death of BSG by the time that show came out. It did receive very good reviews but then so did BSG.

Caprica is totally different from bsg there is no space and no fighting, its about the birth of the cylons.

 

[Bouncing Zabaglione Bros.]

Whoa a Trek discussion on B3D. I like all of the series to varying degrees. TNG is definitely my favorite. DS9 has some really entertaining supporting actors. Voyager is OK but was mostly a missed opportunity to do something fresh, as was Enterprise.

And this is where the "Trek Fatigue" came in at the end of Enterprise. The same people involved in running and writing TNG were also doing the same job in DS9, Voyager and Enterprise. For someone who's seen all of everything, it's pretty obvious that those creatives were eventually running on empty, reusing the same stories and character templates from previous series.

Trek was always constrained between rules of "what should be Trek", and in some ways the Abrams reboot had not much choice but to break out of those rules and the heavy weight of forty-five years of canon. This is especially the case if you want to use some of the best loved characters, but with an up to date style. I can't see how they would have gone for a slower, more thoughtful and character based movie, because it would have been seen as just more of the "old Trek".

So Abrams went for big flashing lights and hair on fire, and that's probably better suited for a two hour movie. I can't see how he could have gone any other way in that format, whilst making it new and different from old Trek, but still re-using the known characters.

A longer, more thoughtful and character driven vehicle is probably more suitable for a series. Look what happened to Stargate Continuum, which was great for many reasons, but which got cancelled in two seasons, or Firefly that didn't make it to one. That kind of grown-up, character driven, SF that's suited to a series tends not to do well, probably because TV execs don't think it attracts enough kids or sells enough merch.

 

[Grall]

So Abrams went for big flashing lights and hair on fire, and that's probably better suited for a two hour movie.

You're absolutely right. Action and drama is what you need for a good popcorn movie experience. It doesn't entirely fit with Star Trek legacy (even the highest-rated Trek movies were always rather talky), but that's a sacrifice you have to make. For better or for worse, it depends on your point of view, but I fully support the format JJ chose for his first Trek movie.

...Now, the script was kinda crap, and the plot didn't make much sense, but the action was good, the characters were great. Casting was really awesome IMO. The crew carried the whole movie.

 

[tuna]

The third season of BSG when they had suicide bombers and everything was pretty ballsy I think.

 

[Davros]

And very well timed, what with the war on terror going on...

 

[nutball]

The first series of the Galactica reboot was pretty good, the second not too bad but things went rapidly downhill from there. I ended up watching them all because I thought I ought to but looking back, I really do see it as quite a big chunk of my time wasted.

Never bothered with Caprica as I was sick to death of BSG by the time that show came out. It did receive very good reviews but then so did BSG.

Blimey, that's spooky. Did you hack my wireless keyboard and steal my keystrokes? I were to express an opinion about BSG and Caprica, it would be character for character what you just typed there

 

[Mariner]

Blimey, that's spooky. Did you hack my wireless keyboard and steal my keystrokes? I were to express an opinion about BSG and Caprica, it would be character for character what you just typed there

Great minds etc etc...

As for the comments about Abrams ST reboot I thought that stylistically, it was pretty well done. It was certainly a good looking movie with some decent acting and casting.

Unfortunately, the beyond dumb plot was a real let down. I get the feeling that the Abrams/writers combination thought

Spoiler

"I know, let's destroy Vulcan!!!!! Nobody will be expecting that!!!!!"

then bolted together an incoherent mess of a storyline around that one event with a few action sequences added in for effect.

That said, I'll go and watch the next one later this year. Hoping for better, fearing the worst! (What else can you do when the writers also have a couple of Bay's Transformers movies on their credits!)

 

[swaaye]

Yeah there is no doubt the writers involved with 90s Trek and Enterprise were drained of ideas. But that Manny Coto fellow who took the reigns of Enterprise for season 4 and was given some Berman freedom as a last ditch effort did a decent job. Except for the horrible series finale...

JJ Trek as you all say did what needed to be done to revitalize the franchise, aside from the dumb, almost Nemesis-like plot. I would have preferred new characters but of course it is obvious why they went reboot.

I too look forward to the next movie.

 

[Kaotik]

JJ Trek as you all say did what needed to be done to revitalize the franchise, aside from the dumb, almost Nemesis-like plot. I would have preferred new characters but of course it is obvious why they went reboot.

I too look forward to the next movie.

Taking out everything that made the franchise that franchise (aside from char names and ship shape) and making another 13 in a dozen adhd action (with added lens flares) isn't "revitalizing franchise".

 

[Grall]

Hurm, not sure why you think everything was taken out... Kirk's a slugger, Spock's a thinker and Bones is a curmudgeon (or is that a chirurgeon? ) Things seem pretty similar overall, don't you think?

 

[Andrew Lauritzen]

I've been following Star Trek since the 60s, and I really liked Abrams reboot...sorry.

Nah I'm with you there digi. TNG is off in its own world of awesome, but frankly all the rest (DS9, Voyager, TOS and especially craptacular Enterprise) were not really the same style, and were not really very good. And the movies were even worse... even the TNG ones (*perhaps* excepting First Contact, but that's pretty much what you hate - action-fest it appears). TNG's brilliance simply does not work as well in that format, and simply does not occur in the other series' anyways.

And yeah, the point here is that before there was zero hope for Star Wars being good again. Now there is some But who am I fooling, I just want a new X-Wing game!

 

[John Reynolds]

I'd prefer a Whedon Star Wars movie, but he's too busy shepherding Marvel's franchise for the next Avengers movie.

The Abrams Trek movie was really marred by the silly time travel crap that the milieu just can't seem to avoid abusing.

 

[Mariner]

I wouldn't get too excited about any of Whedon's stuff. I ended up catching a couple of episodes of Buffy the other weekend (too bored to change channel!) and realised that they were turgid shite!

That reminds me, I need to get around to checking out a couple of episodes of Dollhouse to see what that is like. I've heard mixed reviews but from what I know, it's an interesting enough concept.