Is there a reason why some of you prefer ATI and some Nvidia
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Richteralan
Regular
I don't really prefer any "company".
It's not worth my time
but when i see people can draw up a huge list of why they don't like nvidia, they need to get a life
It's not worth my time
but when i see people can draw up a huge list of why they don't like nvidia, they need to get a life
cloudscapes
Regular
Currently ATI over Nvidia for two reasons:
1. Drivers seem stabler and the CP quicker to respond.
2. Although both companies cheat with optimizations for games, I was floored with Nvidia's cheating in a benchmark tool some time ago to artificially bend the score in their favour with no benifit to the end user (unlike game cheats, which provide some benifit)
1. Drivers seem stabler and the CP quicker to respond.
2. Although both companies cheat with optimizations for games, I was floored with Nvidia's cheating in a benchmark tool some time ago to artificially bend the score in their favour with no benifit to the end user (unlike game cheats, which provide some benifit)
I have owned video cards from all companies. I always try to gauge what I need, what I am willing to spend and what features I want. Then I buy. Every NV, ATI, 3DFx and Kyro2 card that I have owned worked very well with no real issues. I think freature wise, vrs perfromace vrs cost for my range and needs both ATI/NV are the same.
*waits for a dissertation from WaltC*
I don't know that I have a preference at the moment --have to see these next cards.
For years, I followed a 18th century English foreign policy "support the 2nd strongest power", as I like to support competition continuing to exist in the market. So when 3dfx was king I was buying NV (Riva) and when NV became king I bought ATI (Fury, Radeon, R8500).
Then gaming became a little less compelling for me (didn't see any games I just *had* to play), and I actually skipped the 9700/NV30 generation.
By the time I bought a new card last fall for my AGP setup (finally just had to play FarCry, D3, HL2), the choice seemed very clear for my budget --6800GT. I could have afforded top of the line, but I tend to stay price/performancy, and that was it with really good performance for AGP. If X800XL AGP had been available 6 months earlier, it might have turned out differently.
Certainly right now from a "company strength" position, it is very hard to pick a "second strongest power" right now --talk to me in a couple months.
I certainly have grown accustomed to, and really missed, ATI's MMC when I went back to NV.
And, yeah, I do think NV plays the game with sharper elbows, on average, over time --even if one totally excludes the NV30 fiasco. This is a matter of degree, I mean --I've never tried to fit ATI for a halo. And I've never been real comfortable with NV doing that.
I do get amused by "ATI didn't kill 3dfx" reasons tho --war neverending, amen. And I do think that kind of thing plays into over-heating some of the rhetoric when things are at the marginal spot where folks have a choice of cranking down a notch to preserve peace and dialogue, or cranking up a notch over the line into vendetta. But then clearly the NV30 thing still has resonance for people too, and will for many years (particularly if they bought one!).
It would be interesting --tho I don't think it can ever be really established-- to try to figure out what percentage of "ATI fanbois" (or at least so pigeon-holed) are not really that at all; they are really "anti-NV fanbois", which isn't really quite the same thing, yet ATI and their community gets smeared with their tactics anyway. I suspect the # of "anti-ATI fanbois" in the NV community is much, much smaller and consists almost entirely of people who at one point in their gaming career had some really awful experience that they swore a mighty oath to never repeat (rotten drivers for the game they loved, broken card, RMA disaster, something of that nature).
For years, I followed a 18th century English foreign policy "support the 2nd strongest power", as I like to support competition continuing to exist in the market. So when 3dfx was king I was buying NV (Riva) and when NV became king I bought ATI (Fury, Radeon, R8500).
Then gaming became a little less compelling for me (didn't see any games I just *had* to play), and I actually skipped the 9700/NV30 generation.
By the time I bought a new card last fall for my AGP setup (finally just had to play FarCry, D3, HL2), the choice seemed very clear for my budget --6800GT. I could have afforded top of the line, but I tend to stay price/performancy, and that was it with really good performance for AGP. If X800XL AGP had been available 6 months earlier, it might have turned out differently.
Certainly right now from a "company strength" position, it is very hard to pick a "second strongest power" right now --talk to me in a couple months.
I certainly have grown accustomed to, and really missed, ATI's MMC when I went back to NV.
And, yeah, I do think NV plays the game with sharper elbows, on average, over time --even if one totally excludes the NV30 fiasco. This is a matter of degree, I mean --I've never tried to fit ATI for a halo. And I've never been real comfortable with NV doing that.
I do get amused by "ATI didn't kill 3dfx" reasons tho --war neverending, amen.
And I do think that kind of thing plays into over-heating some of the rhetoric when things are at the marginal spot where folks have a choice of cranking down a notch to preserve peace and dialogue, or cranking up a notch over the line into vendetta. But then clearly the NV30 thing still has resonance for people too, and will for many years (particularly if they bought one!).It would be interesting --tho I don't think it can ever be really established-- to try to figure out what percentage of "ATI fanbois" (or at least so pigeon-holed) are not really that at all; they are really "anti-NV fanbois", which isn't really quite the same thing, yet ATI and their community gets smeared with their tactics anyway. I suspect the # of "anti-ATI fanbois" in the NV community is much, much smaller and consists almost entirely of people who at one point in their gaming career had some really awful experience that they swore a mighty oath to never repeat (rotten drivers for the game they loved, broken card, RMA disaster, something of that nature).
Whoa, what a question!
My preference is for whichever card is kickass for the amount I am willing to spend. Currently, this Radeon 9500 (softmodded to a 9700) has to be the most amazing 145.00 card ever produced (sorry Gefoce 4200!).
Yes I have been guilty of participating in a brawl every now and then. But it's not because I have a fascination for some ihv. I would rather listen to posters who don't have an agenda (why they have an agenda anyways is beyond me!) when posting. You will never find an anti-ihv statement out of me unless it was meant to illustrate that Nvidia and ATI really aren't different! They both want our money. They have both cheated in benchmarks. And they both have tried to screw someone at one time or another.
My experiences with both vendors from a consumer standpoint has been nothing but good things. Each ATI/Nvidia card I have used performed well at a great price. I don't know how much parity there will be with this next gen, but I do know that when WGF2.0 hits, we will really see who is producing the best card.
My preference is for whichever card is kickass for the amount I am willing to spend. Currently, this Radeon 9500 (softmodded to a 9700) has to be the most amazing 145.00 card ever produced (sorry Gefoce 4200!).
Yes I have been guilty of participating in a brawl every now and then. But it's not because I have a fascination for some ihv. I would rather listen to posters who don't have an agenda (why they have an agenda anyways is beyond me!) when posting. You will never find an anti-ihv statement out of me unless it was meant to illustrate that Nvidia and ATI really aren't different! They both want our money. They have both cheated in benchmarks. And they both have tried to screw someone at one time or another.
My experiences with both vendors from a consumer standpoint has been nothing but good things. Each ATI/Nvidia card I have used performed well at a great price. I don't know how much parity there will be with this next gen, but I do know that when WGF2.0 hits, we will really see who is producing the best card.
I've generally avoided NVIDIA cards mainly due to reduced accountability for flaws, poor delivery and poor components. Such is life for an IHV without a 'standard of quality' for their individual board manufacturers.
On the ATI front, I have *ALWAYS* purchased "Built by ATI" (yah yah.. they are really Powercolors, right?) cards as ATI, in a way, puts their brand, logo and neck on these boards being the baseline of quality/standard.
On the NVIDIA front, I grew tired of scouring a half-dozen different board manufacturers.. and also hated how this changed from chipset to chipset (Gainward one chipset, then Leadtek.. then Asus.. then etc.etc.). I'll happily fork out an additional 5-15% on price to get a known 'good' combination of memory, rf unit, cap's, hs/fan, etc.etc.
Like right now- if I'm going to buy a 6800GT, I've got Asus, AOpen, Prolink, eVGA, XFX, Gigabyte, MSI, BFG, PNY, Chaintech, Elsa, Leadtek, and like a half-dozen others to choose from. I may have to go through 3-4 to get one with a STRONG video signal, good memory on it, nice HS/FAN combo, not finicky about power (poor caps/shielding), etc.etc. I had an XFX 6800GT and it was the biggest POS I've ever owned. Flakey, poor hs/fan (ran hot), poor video signal (ghosting around chars at higher resolution/refresh on a flat panel), etc.etc.
If I run into complaints, is it XFX? Is the NVxx chip on it? Or is it I just have a bad board revision? Too many loopholes.
Driver issues? Is it the reference drivers on a 3rd party board or the drivers? No real assurance here either.. more convolution.
Say I find one I really, really like.. when it comes time to upgrade this can change totally. I owned Leadtek GF3 and GF4's and loved them dearly (only after a dozen returns/exchanges to "find" them as the best of the herd for my setup)... maybe Leadtek's aren't the real leader anymore with newer chipsets at the next upgrade? I'm staring at likely another 5-6 returns to get my head over water for a quality board... which might be from Asus or Gigabit this round.. who knows? Again, I'll easily pay 5-15% more just for that assurance and inability to deal with that. Website reviews are untrustworthy also since they may get the 'cream of the crop' revision from a particular manufacturer.. or just slap the thing in, run a bunch of 3dmark's and never hook the thing to a 20" CRT @ high hz + 1600x1200 and run Word on them... ever. They may also not use them for a month to learn the gap on the hs/fan will start having corruption from normal use/heat damage.
I like ATI for this reason- I can buy the true-blue ATI boards and know there is a level of quality assured for that product. I also feel it places direct driver accountability on ATI as they have no "use the drivers off the website from maker XYZ" that NVidia support requests always denote to. I've got a "Built by ATI" card and the drivers they provide/develop are accountable for their line of cards. This is worth the extra price to buy their own, true-blue "Built by ATI" cards... and takes many of the headaches away for the consumers focused on quality and ease of experience over saving a few bucks. (I also buy Retail boxed cards for this reason..).
It takes a hell of an edge from an NVidia product nowadays to make me adopt one of their cards... it has to outweigh that convenience to make me change. If NVIDIA starting making "Built by NVidia"- even if simply adopting their preferred manufacturer to put their name on the boards, I'd early adopt every one of their product lines without a flinch.
Just my $0.02
On the ATI front, I have *ALWAYS* purchased "Built by ATI" (yah yah.. they are really Powercolors, right?) cards as ATI, in a way, puts their brand, logo and neck on these boards being the baseline of quality/standard.
On the NVIDIA front, I grew tired of scouring a half-dozen different board manufacturers.. and also hated how this changed from chipset to chipset (Gainward one chipset, then Leadtek.. then Asus.. then etc.etc.). I'll happily fork out an additional 5-15% on price to get a known 'good' combination of memory, rf unit, cap's, hs/fan, etc.etc.
Like right now- if I'm going to buy a 6800GT, I've got Asus, AOpen, Prolink, eVGA, XFX, Gigabyte, MSI, BFG, PNY, Chaintech, Elsa, Leadtek, and like a half-dozen others to choose from. I may have to go through 3-4 to get one with a STRONG video signal, good memory on it, nice HS/FAN combo, not finicky about power (poor caps/shielding), etc.etc. I had an XFX 6800GT and it was the biggest POS I've ever owned. Flakey, poor hs/fan (ran hot), poor video signal (ghosting around chars at higher resolution/refresh on a flat panel), etc.etc.
If I run into complaints, is it XFX? Is the NVxx chip on it? Or is it I just have a bad board revision? Too many loopholes.
Driver issues? Is it the reference drivers on a 3rd party board or the drivers? No real assurance here either.. more convolution.
Say I find one I really, really like.. when it comes time to upgrade this can change totally. I owned Leadtek GF3 and GF4's and loved them dearly (only after a dozen returns/exchanges to "find" them as the best of the herd for my setup)... maybe Leadtek's aren't the real leader anymore with newer chipsets at the next upgrade? I'm staring at likely another 5-6 returns to get my head over water for a quality board... which might be from Asus or Gigabit this round.. who knows? Again, I'll easily pay 5-15% more just for that assurance and inability to deal with that. Website reviews are untrustworthy also since they may get the 'cream of the crop' revision from a particular manufacturer.. or just slap the thing in, run a bunch of 3dmark's and never hook the thing to a 20" CRT @ high hz + 1600x1200 and run Word on them... ever. They may also not use them for a month to learn the gap on the hs/fan will start having corruption from normal use/heat damage.
I like ATI for this reason- I can buy the true-blue ATI boards and know there is a level of quality assured for that product. I also feel it places direct driver accountability on ATI as they have no "use the drivers off the website from maker XYZ" that NVidia support requests always denote to. I've got a "Built by ATI" card and the drivers they provide/develop are accountable for their line of cards. This is worth the extra price to buy their own, true-blue "Built by ATI" cards... and takes many of the headaches away for the consumers focused on quality and ease of experience over saving a few bucks. (I also buy Retail boxed cards for this reason..).
It takes a hell of an edge from an NVidia product nowadays to make me adopt one of their cards... it has to outweigh that convenience to make me change. If NVIDIA starting making "Built by NVidia"- even if simply adopting their preferred manufacturer to put their name on the boards, I'd early adopt every one of their product lines without a flinch.
Just my $0.02
I take it by the rolleyes that you missed my point.ondaedg said:ERK said:ondaedg said:
A mass-murderer and a fibbing child are both just sinners.
Uhm, true I guess?
So would I be correct to assume you find Nvidia's and ATI's past transgressions (that you list above) to be nearly the same, by degree for each company?
What you wrote in my original quote was, uhm, true I guess, but surely you have to admit that one company could in principle be 'worse' than another?
Or are you one of these extreme relativists or something?
I think most people on these boards would admit that neither company is perfect, but there is a line that should not be crossed, and one example of crossing that line is Nvidias behavior regarding 3DMark03.
And please don't start a semantics argument with me.
I don't think this is the place for an argument at all. What I will say is perception is the key word. How do you perceive what a "sin" is? As a consumer, I find what Nvidia did in 3dMark unethical. However, as an active stock trader, I find what ATI did equally unethical. If you are not active as a stock trader, then perhaps you do not perceive ATI's "sin" as being note worthy. For example, who do you think hates Enron worse: A person with no financial ties to Enron, or the school teachers who lost a significant amount of their retirement pensions?
You feel like the victim because you were almost duped into buying a 300.00 video card that performed poorly in shader intensive games. What about ATI's shareholders who almost lost thousands of dollars in stock value, IRAs, and mutual funds due to cooked books? If ATI's execs were willing to cook some books to make millions by selling their shares, do you think they would think twice about misleading a consumer?
Like I said, it's all about perception.
You feel like the victim because you were almost duped into buying a 300.00 video card that performed poorly in shader intensive games. What about ATI's shareholders who almost lost thousands of dollars in stock value, IRAs, and mutual funds due to cooked books? If ATI's execs were willing to cook some books to make millions by selling their shares, do you think they would think twice about misleading a consumer?
Like I said, it's all about perception.
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