Insomniac to go cross platform?

[zed]

I agree going multi-platform is a risky move for Insomniac.

Not to mention bad timing,
IIRC based on data in 2009 the ps3 sold ~15% or something more software than the xbox360 worldwide, and in the first three month of this year its sold ~40% more than the xbox360. From 2006-2008 it was the opposite, i.e. the xbox360 was selling a lot more software than the ps3.
Then again perhaps natal will boost the xbox360 software sales but I feel most of those sales are gonna be in the casual game genre which I believe Insomniac arent exactly known for.

 

[DuckThor Evil]

Not to mention bad timing,
IIRC based on data in 2009 the ps3 sold ~15% or something more software than the xbox360 worldwide.

Can you dig up a source for that?

edit:

I found this

http://www.playstationuniversity.co...rip-xbox-360s-ps3-attach-rate-up-to-8-1-3807/

PS3 had a pretty good year.

 

[mrcorbo]

Not to mention bad timing,
IIRC based on data in 2009 the ps3 sold ~15% or something more software than the xbox360 worldwide, and in the first three month of this year its sold ~40% more than the xbox360. From 2006-2008 it was the opposite, i.e. the xbox360 was selling a lot more software than the ps3.
Then again perhaps natal will boost the xbox360 software sales but I feel most of those sales are gonna be in the casual game genre which I believe Insomniac arent exactly known for.

Assuming your software figures are correct; (X360Sales*1.40) < ((X360Sales*1.40)+(X360Sales)). I fail to see your point.

 

[Ruskie]

Dont know why some of you guys say that maybe someone from EA should port it.Insomniac are great developers,360 is sweetheart to work with and they are used to Edram.I dont see any problem.

*4A Games ported Metro 2033 on 360 in 19 days

 

[dobwal]

Dont know why some of you guys say that maybe someone from EA should port it.Insomniac are great developers,360 is sweetheart to work with and they are used to Edram.I dont see any problem.

*4A Games ported Metro 2033 on 360 in 19 days

If you believe the 19 days then you must believe that Metro 2033's engine was built from the ground up to be multi platform based (Its the main argument for why the engine isn't X-Ray based).

Hardly the case with Insomniac.

That whole 19 days seems very fradulent when you consider a small company would typically develop a game and engine in conjunction with each other. Basically wrap the development into one big project.

 

[zed]

Assuming your software figures are correct; (X360Sales*1.40) < ((X360Sales*1.40)+(X360Sales)). I fail to see your point.

But it doesnt work that way.
I believe this has been discussed many times in the past
Would gears of war 1 sold the amount it did if it was released on xbox360 + ps3. No its practically certain it would of sold less than xbox360 alone.
Lost planet 2 just released for xbox360+ps3 based on its early sales looks certain to sell less than LP1 did when it was xbox360 exclusive
etc

 

[(((interference)))]

PS3 owners get whatever Bungie IP, MS decides it doesn't want to publish. While I guess with Insomniac, (if the multiplat transition proves to be successful) they will target their most promising IPs for multiplat unless Sony provides incentives for exclusivity, which I think is smart because Insomniac will have a better leveraged position from which to negotiate with Sony.

In the end, unless MS and Sony totally misses the boat, the best IPs will come out exclusively on the consoles these devs are traditionally known for.

Bungie did not want to publish with MS because they would not be able to bring their new IP to a larger audience than just the 360 like they could (and did) if they went multiplatform with another publisher.

And I don't think Insomniac is going to have as tough a job writing code for the 360 as Bungie will have with the PS3.

Also, it looks like Insomniac is going to be juggling three different franchises now while Bungie only has one after Reach launches

 

[aselto]

But it doesnt work that way.
I believe this has been discussed many times in the past
Would gears of war 1 sold the amount it did if it was released on xbox360 + ps3. No its practically certain it would of sold less than xbox360 alone.
Lost planet 2 just released for xbox360+ps3 based on its early sales looks certain to sell less than LP1 did when it was xbox360 exclusive
etc

There's little to none extra hype coming from a game's exclusivity - only rabid fanboys care about it. LP2 sales failed because it's an uninspired sequel to a game that disappointed many of its purchasers. Not only that, but the new selling point was (coop) has already been well taken of by games like L4D etc.

Meanwhile, if you look at the real stars of HD consoles - Cal of Duty and Assassin's Creed - they outsell exclusive games easily, only with Halo 3 being at somewhat similar level. I bet that their multiplatform nature in fact helped their sales - you could share your experience with all your friends, regardless which platform they own, rather than only to those who own 360 or PS3.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Dont know why some of you guys say that maybe someone from EA should port it.Insomniac are great developers,360 is sweetheart to work with and they are used to Edram.I dont see any problem.

Insomniac's prior eDRAM experience probably won't have a great deal of relevance as XB360's setup is quite different to PS2's.

But it doesnt work that way.
I believe this has been discussed many times in the past
Would gears of war 1 sold the amount it did if it was released on xbox360 + ps3. No its practically certain it would of sold less than xbox360 alone.

Uh...yes. And if Wii had only been launched in Europe instead of Europe and NA and Asia, it'd have sold even more tha it has. We all know smaller markets mean more sales...

 

[DuckThor Evil]

But it doesnt work that way.
I believe this has been discussed many times in the past
Would gears of war 1 sold the amount it did if it was released on xbox360 + ps3. No its practically certain it would of sold less than xbox360 alone.
Lost planet 2 just released for xbox360+ps3 based on its early sales looks certain to sell less than LP1 did when it was xbox360 exclusive
etc

I think you're over simplifying the equation there. I'm sure for every Lost Planet you can find a counter example. Lost Planet 1 was released on PS 3 later on also, what if also Gears would have been released 6-12 months later on PS3 and at a time of the X360 release it wouldn't have been know that it's going multi? Would games like Modern Warfare or Assassin's Creed have sold better on a single platform?

Also comparing how some game did in Jan 2007 and other in May 2010 is problematic for multiple reasons. Looking at Imsomniac's numbers outside of bundles, going multiplatform seems like a good choice for them. Their games haven't really light up the fire within PS owners and quite likely their success with PS2 had a lot to do with the huge installed base.

I think you put too much faith on recent PS 3 gains in momentum on making X360 hardware and software sales fading away at a faster rate than is happening in reality, because it corresponds well to your failed marketshare prediction

edit: took so long for me to post due to a telephone interrupting me, that everybody and their grandpa already said the relevant stuff

 

[dobwal]

Bungie did not want to publish with MS because they would not be able to bring their new IP to a larger audience than just the 360 like they could (and did) if they went multiplatform with another publisher.

And I don't think Insomniac is going to have as tough a job writing code for the 360 as Bungie will have with the PS3.

Also, it looks like Insomniac is going to be juggling three different franchises now while Bungie only has one after Reach launches

MS has right of first refusal for games that comes out of Bungie. Bungie has a multiplatform title because MS didn't want the IP but Activision did.

Activision has plenty of internal devs that can help facillitate the transition.

 

[ban25]

Based on the sales figures, I would guess Insomniac's games were paying for themselves but not generating a real profit. There's a serious opportunity cost for a quality studio like Insomiac to target a single platform exclusively when there is effectively a three-way split in the market. I've enjoyed all their games since Spyro, so I look forward to what they have to offer.

 

[zed]

I'm sure for every Lost Planet you can find a counter example

name some other games this generation that first came out on one platform gameX , and then gameX 2 comes out on multiplatforms?

Also comparing how some game did in Jan 2007 and other in May 2010 is problematic for multiple reasons.

oh sure, well install base is hugely bigger for a start, thats why LP2 sold better than LP1 (oh wait )
OK true the only way you can tell is if you had a time machine.
But honestly I dont think anyone can deny that gears of war wouldnt of sold 6million if it wasnt hyped so much by MS, (hype is the single most important factor for a games sales, not quality etc) they wouldnt of hyped it if it was also coming to the PS3

 

[draconian]

Based on the sales figures, I would guess Insomniac's games were paying for themselves but not generating a real profit. There's a serious opportunity cost for a quality studio like Insomiac to target a single platform exclusively when there is effectively a three-way split in the market. I've enjoyed all their games since Spyro, so I look forward to what they have to offer.

They were leaving money on the table by being exclusive, but I bet they were pretty profitable because of there 1 game per year schedule.
150 people x $80,000 annual salary = $12 million

I would imagine insomniac got something like $15 per game sold. $12 mil divided by $15 is 800,000 retail copies needed to break even. Divided that by 3 territories, making a profit doesn't seem that hard.

It's all about taking only 1 year to make a game.

 

[DuckThor Evil]

name some other games this generation that first came out on one platform gameX , and then gameX 2 comes out on multiplatforms?

There aren't too many games like that. Call of Duty 2 was only on X360, but PS3 wasn't out yet. Lost Planet was also on PS3 although a year later. If you stretch the time period to previous gen, then we have plenty of games, that were PS2 exclusives that are now multiplatform and selling pretty good. The point was that even if your argument holds true for Lost Planet, it fails when considering some huge multiplatform successes. I agree that in some cases exclusives could do better, but for every game like that, there is atleast one game that would sell more as a multiplatform.

oh sure, well install base is hugely bigger for a start, thats why LP2 sold better than LP1 (oh wait )
OK true the only way you can tell is if you had a time machine.
But honestly I dont think anyone can deny that gears of war wouldnt of sold 6million if it wasnt hyped so much by MS, (hype is the single most important factor for a games sales, not quality etc) they wouldnt of hyped it if it was also coming to the PS3

There is so many things different with Lost Planet 1 and 2 and the gaming environment, that I don't really even want to analyze the situation, being multiplatform on day 1 is just one of the differences. I would still say that since Lost Planet 1 gamers have had better gaming experiences from other games and have somewhat lost interest to that three+ year old game and thus to its sequel.

Gears of War was released at a time when it clearly stood out from any other game out there, and was a rock solid on top of that. It wasn't just hyped by MS, pretty much everybody was paying attention to since the beginning. I'm sure Gears of War 2 would have sold really well, even if it was multiplatform.

 

[aselto]

For what it's worth Saint's Row 2 well outsold the first one and it even came out after GTA4, so it no longer served as a GTA substitute.

 

[dobwal]

They were leaving money on the table by being exclusive, but I bet they were pretty profitable because of there 1 game per year schedule.
150 people x $80,000 annual salary = $12 million

I would imagine insomniac got something like $15 per game sold. $12 mil divided by $15 is 800,000 retail copies needed to break even. Divided that by 3 territories, making a profit doesn't seem that hard.

It's all about taking only 1 year to make a game.

If Sony published the game, they probably financed the development, with the understanding that Sony gets to recoup that cost before Insomniac even sees a dime. So if R2 took 1 year to develop and cost 12 million, Insomniac would have to wait for that first 400K to sales to start see any profit. Given that Sony probably needed to additionally recoup things like marketing costs, you can see that its very possible an awful lot of games needed to sold before Insomniac started to see actual revenue from sales.

As a developer you generally aren't making money until the publishers has insured they recouped their investment.

 

[zed]

There aren't too many games like that

come on there must be a few(*), Wait Ive just thought of another big title, bioshock.
bioshock 1 when xbox360 exclusive sold better than bioshock2 (xbox+ps3)
thats 2/2 theres something wrong in the state of denmark here folks

(*)After all it makes better business sense according to posters here, so all the companies must want to do it.

 

[obonicus]

Isn't the usual trend for sequels to sell slightly less?

 

[(((interference)))]

MS has right of first refusal for games that comes out of Bungie. Bungie has a multiplatform title because MS didn't want the IP but Activision did.

Activision has plenty of internal devs that can help facillitate the transition.

No, that just means they had to show it to MS first, they weren't obliged to let MS publish it, MS was probably interested but Bungie said we want this game on PS3 and PC as well and MS wasn't willing to go through with that.

As far as looking into the future and our next big IP, we did talk to Microsoft as well as some other publishers and, like Joe said, ultimately after all discussions were said and done, Activision was really the only publisher that ultimately met all of the conditions and things that were most important to us. And we get to own the IP, we're still independent, we have creative control, and Activision brings to the table the ability for us to explore multiple platforms and multiple devices,

Microsoft — and Sony — were among the companies that bid for Bungie's next title, but the studio opted for a partner that would publish to all game platforms, said Bungie President Harold Ryan.

"We had agreed with Microsoft awhile ago to let them have first look at our game, so we did that," Ryan said. "But we retained the right to negotiate for the best deal for the studio."

http://www.joystiq.com/2010/04/29/interview-bungie-discusses-activision-its-new-universe-and/
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/businesstechnology/2011740770_bungie30.html