InPhase Holodisks showing up HD-DVD and BR

[PC-Engine]

Sure Blu-ray has longer legs than HD DVD, but who cares when holographic technology is right around the corner?

I think you got this the wrong way around. Having a huge disc SUPPOSEDLY to launch in 2006 (though I doubt it actually will), will just work to push HD-DVD further into obsolescence compared to bluray. If you want to buy something large NOW, why would you settle for the most stop-gap-ish of solutions that offers the smallest capacity of them all? Makes no sense.

HVD's emphasis is on storage capacity, Blu-ray has a small advantage in capacity over HD DVD while having a huge disadvantage to HVD in capacity. People who care about large capacity for recording etc. will look at Blu-ray then look at HVD then pick HVD. It's like saying 300GB is better than 30GB vs 300GB being better than 50GB. Makes no difference at all. It's also like PSX trying to be two things at once and falling short. That's the position Blu-ray will be in ie trying to compete with a more simple 30GB format for movies and trying to compete with a 300GB format for storage.

 

[rabidrabbit]

So you say the holographic disc will be marketed at consumers at the same time as Blu-Ray, and at similar price?
That would be impressive, but I have a hard time believing the HVD will be anywhere near consumer prices until sometime 2007, plus they'll have a huge uphill battle convincing film studios to jump to yet another new format so soon after HD-DVD

 

[PC-Engine]

So you say the holographic disc will be marketed at consumers at the same time as Blu-Ray, and at similar price?
That would be impressive, but I have a hard time believing the HVD will be anywhere near consumer prices until sometime 2007, plus they'll have a huge uphill battle convincing film studios to jump to yet another new format so soon after HD-DVD

HVD is just a storage format, you can record whatever you want with it even HD movies. It's not necessarily competing with HD DVD/Blu-ray for movies since you can't play HD DVD movies or Blu-ray movies on HVD units...yet. That's where recordable Blu-ray discs will get squeezed on the recording capacity front.

SONY already sees Blu-ray's capacity disadvantage vs HVD, that's why they're scrambling to extend BR technology by getting HVD technology into a future version of BR. They want future HVD units to be able to read BRDs so they could make their own HVD/BR units and pretend they invented it.

 

[London Geezer]

[PCENGINE BRAIN]

Wait wait... something that makes BDROM look bad!!! YAY!!! Post post post!!!

[/PCENGINE BRAIN]

 

[PC-Engine]

[PCENGINE BRAIN]

Wait wait... something that makes BDROM look bed!!! YAY!!! Post post post!!!

[/PCENGINE BRAIN]

At least PCE has a brain.

 

[rabidrabbit]

HVD is just a storage format, you can record whatever you want with it even HD movies. It's not necessarily competing with HD DVD/Blu-ray for movies since you can't play HD DVD movies or Blu-ray movies on HVD units...yet. That's where recordable Blu-ray discs will get squeezed on the recording capacity front.

But for just recording, wouldn't people then look at hard disk solutions rather than the expensive and future unproven HVD technology :?

SONY already sees Blu-ray's capacity disadvantage vs HVD, that's why they're scrambling to extend BR technology by getting HVD technology into a future version of BR. They want future HVD units to be able to read BRDs so they could make their own HVD/BR units and pretend they invented it.

They are? Didn't know that. Well, that's just good then. I am not expecting Sony to stop developing new storage formats and improving the Blu-Ray after they've finished with current tech.

It's common practice in technology to integrate tech from others, you can't expect Sony to totally invent everything by themselves

 

[Guden Oden]

HVD's emphasis is on storage capacity, Blu-ray has a small advantage in capacity over HD DVD

I'm sort of amazed you admitted HDDVD being inferior to BR in any respect at all, but no, size difference is not "small" at all. I don't think anyone would consider 40% "small", or that those 40% represent more than a full dual-layered, doublesided DVD in raw capacity.

You seem to take it for granted these HR drives (and media) will be available in the same timeframe and price point as BR/HDDVD, something I consider almost an impossibility. If you have a six hundred percent storage capacity advantage compared to the next largest size disc (and even more compared to the others), you don't sell at a price that is equal to your much smaller competitor, that is completely not how market economy works.

Of course this is something you totally ignore just to continue your usual clueless fanatical sonybashing, but the rest of the world sees you as the clownish sort of fanperson you are...

 

[PC-Engine]

But for just recording, wouldn't people then look at hard disk solutions rather than the expensive and future unproven HVD technology

What's there to prove? If it could be used for mission critical data backup then surely it could be used by the consumer for recording. Why would you want to use a limited capacity non removeable HDD for recording? Why are people transferring recorded content from HDD based DVRs to recordable DVDs? Big HDDs are nice but they're not removable so you'd have to erase them or dump the data onto removable discs to fit more stuff on it.

It's common practice in technology to integrate tech from others, you can't expect Sony to totally invent everything by themselves

sure it's common practice but the point is SONY already admits Blu-ray isn't all that great in terms of storage hence the need to jump to something else before BR even gets off the ground.

I'm sort of amazed you admitted HDDVD being inferior to BR in any respect at all, but no, size difference is not "small" at all. I don't think anyone would consider 40% "small", or that those 40% represent more than a full dual-layered, doublesided DVD in raw capacity.

It's small considering what you'll be using it for and the ease of which you can get a second HD DVD for such needs. Just look at what's happeing right now. Do you see people scrambling over DL DVD-R vs SL DVD-R even though it offers double the capacity? You can buy two SL DVD-R to easily replace a DL DVD-R just like you'll be able to easily use a second HD DVD for recording whatever you'll be recording.

You seem to take it for granted these HR drives (and media) will be available in the same timeframe and price point as BR/HDDVD, something I consider almost an impossibility. If you have a six hundred percent storage capacity advantage compared to the next largest size disc (and even more compared to the others), you don't sell at a price that is equal to your much smaller competitor, that is completely not how market economy works.

That's not the point though. Point is the technology is real and WILL be available VERY soon much sooner than people thought whether it's cheaper than BR or not. Cost comes down like every other technology so it's pretty moot. I think it's very silly to talk about being able to record on 50GB discs when 300GB discs are just around the corner. Even SONY is smart enough to admit this.

 

[London Geezer]

That's not the point though. Point is the technology is real and WILL be available VERY soon much sooner than people thought whether it's cheaper than BR or not. Cost comes down like every other technology so it's pretty moot. I think it's very silly to talk about being able to record on 50GB discs when 300GB discs are just around the corner. Even SONY is smart enough to admit this.

Where does that leave HDDVD then, in your extremely unbiased opinion?

 

[PC-Engine]

That's not the point though. Point is the technology is real and WILL be available VERY soon much sooner than people thought whether it's cheaper than BR or not. Cost comes down like every other technology so it's pretty moot. I think it's very silly to talk about being able to record on 50GB discs when 300GB discs are just around the corner. Even SONY is smart enough to admit this.

Where does that leave HDDVD then, in your extremely unbiased opinion?

It has little affect on HD DVD because HD DVD was never about recording on very high capacity single recordable discs. It's about cost, compatibility, and easy transition from DVD. HD DVD-R/RW is just a bonus and was never designed to scale to hundreds of GBs on a single disc so there's really no loss in misplaced R&D when that format was created. SONY and the BDA has a lot more to lose from HVD since they designed it to be able to scale to more layers and invested a load of money on R&D spending.

 

[mckmas8808]

PC-Engine has got to be the biggest fanboy I have ever seen on a forum. The nerve of this guy. I can't even believe what I'm reading. Matter of fact I don't think he even believes what he's writing.

This guy is complaining about an optical medium storage before it is out. He's comparing technology that will be out in one year for consumers to a technology that will be consumer friendly (i.e. cost) in probably 3-5+ years away.

I bet that if Jesus himself came to earth with a Sony shirt on he would write in forums about how much he hates Jesus and say that Jesus sucks because of it.
________
Weed bubblers

 

[PC-Engine]

PC-Engine has got to be the biggest <bleep> I have ever seen on a forum. The nerve of this guy. I can't even believe what I'm reading. Matter of fact I don't think he even believes what he's writing.

This guy is complaining about an optical medium storage before it is out. He's comparing technology that will be out in one year for consumers to a technology that will be consumer friendly (i.e. cost) in probably 3-5+ years away.

I bet that if Jesus himself came to earth with a Sony shirt on he would write in forums about how much he hates Jesus and say that Jesus sucks because of it.

And we all know you're a PSP lover that got a nice beat down for spaming the boards with individual PSP threads over the stupidest ideas ever. Let me know when you get your PSP internet browsing HACK to work with your million PSP attachments. Me I'm gonna be using Palm OS on my stylus equiped DS to surf the internet when I'm near a hotspot away from home like Palm and PPC users.

Oh btw please contribute something relevent to this thread, like how PSP version 2 will have HVUMDs.

 

[wco81]

At least PCE has a brain.

What about credibility?

 

[PC-Engine]

At least PCE has a brain.

What about credibility?

Asking for credibility on the internet is like asking for proof God exists. If you don't agree then just walk away. Who are you anyway?

 

[London Geezer]

Way to go PC-Engine and the other guy

 

[ShootMyMonkey]

It's small considering what you'll be using it for and the ease of which you can get a second HD DVD for such needs. Just look at what's happeing right now. Do you see people scrambling over DL DVD-R vs SL DVD-R even though it offers double the capacity? You can buy two SL DVD-R to easily replace a DL DVD-R just like you'll be able to easily use a second HD DVD for recording whatever you'll be recording.

Yes, but because of price fixing, the cost of a DL DVD+R is extremely prohibitive compared to SL. Not so different from when DVD recording first appeared, and the movie studios were so spooked that they imposed this crazy price fixing that put blank DVDs in the range of $45 per disc. Similarly, DL media goes for anywhere from $3-8 per disc, which is far more than the cost of two SL discs. If the price parity were fairly even, or you could get more capacity for less money, you can bet that people would be lapping up DL discs for video purposes at least.

If the 40% higher capacity comes at a less than 40% cost difference to the consumer and this is a usable capacity, that pretty much decides it. Beyond that, if Bluray were to offer recording to the consumer before HD-DVD, that's a big advantage. I find it very hard to believe that the cost savings on the part of the movie publishers would ever be passed on to the consumer. No company in the world is that altruistic.

 

[wco81]

You would have some credibility if you could say just one positive thing about anything involving Sony.

Because no sane person believes they've never made one positive contribution to technology or that there are some positive aspects to their products.

 

[PC-Engine]

You would have some credibility if you could say just one positive thing about anything involving Sony.

Because no sane person believes they've never made one positive contribution to technology or that there are some positive aspects to their products.

There's a search feature you could use.

 

[rabidrabbit]

How much storahe does the HD offer, Terabyte was it?

What technology does HVD use, holographic?

What are the manufacturing costs of a HVD, is it really a viable option for next gen High Def content media? Blu-Ray already offers more than enough space for high def film, with current display tech the Terabyte space of HVD would go very largely to waste, so why should we wait for HVD and skip Blu-ray and HD-DVD, if other tech can not keep up.

HVD space is good for mass data storage, but for next gen media it's just overkill. It must be much more expensive to manufacture than Blu-Ray, so the discs would cost much more, is that what is wanted.

The Blu-ray makers and HD-DVD makers must have been aware of holographic storage tech, that it would someday replace current tech, but for next gen mass market media it just is not it, because of all the costs involved.

I can see HVD being used as mass backup storage, but as a consumer solution it won't be here for years.
While it is oofcourse good to have as much space as possible, it's a fact that most people do not need to carry a Terabyte of data around.

As for why I see a regular hard disc storage more viable for consumers that need more space than Blu-ray can offer. I only speak for myself and some I know, but I very rarely store anything for longer periods from TV. Actually I haven't done so for about 7 years. Timeshifting is the largest use for recorders nowadays. The content is so well avalable to buy you don't need to record those "rare" conserts etc. anymore.
And you can always store on recordable DL.DVD, HD-DVD or Blu-ray if you want.

So no, I don't see the HVD as a strong competitor to... anything on consumer market.

 

[Ty]

There is always new techology on the horizon promising to revolutionize the market space - too bad they never materialize as quickly as their proponents claim they will. It's almost as if they forget on difficult it is to get industry and consumers to line up behind their efforts. Perfecting it in the lab is but a small part of winning the battle.

HVD is hardly "right around the corner". BR is the superior format to HD-DVD (whether it will win is another discussion). QED.