How to sell next-gen consoles, Marketing, Positioning, and Pricing [2020]

[BRiT]

Isn't it a bit odd that none of the stuff showed is running on actual dev kits?

All except for the very latest revision of devkits, had some hardware bugs or limitations that impact performance such as with the decompression or nvme speeds. It was mentioned in the leaked GameCore Release notes. I'm not certain if everyone has received the final devkit hardware refreshes.

Edit: Just reread the release notes and they only say full performance requires hardware refresh this summer, with no specific month or hardware revision.

 

[Jay]

All except for the very latest revision of devkits, had some hardware bugs or limitations that impact performance such as with the decompression or nvme speeds. It was mentioned in the leaked GameCore Release notes. I'm not certain if everyone has received the final devkit hardware refreshes.

Edit: Just reread the release notes and they only say full performance requires hardware refresh this summer, with no specific month or hardware revision.

Is this related to the current general view of the PS5 being easier to work with?

 

[BRiT]

Is this related to the current general view of the PS5 being easier to work with?

No. This is just basic facts of development kit hardware going through the paces.

 

[eastmen]

This is where i think your wrong.

If your not interested in gamepass or a service, that in no way de-values the console in the way you could use it if there was no gamepass to begin with.

Now the underlying reason you feel like that I do understand.
The reason I always was for next gen exclusives, even if early ones people may see as glorified tech demos is to show what is possible.
Rachet did that, UE5 did it, we didn't get anything like that in this show.

People keep saying MS doesn't care if you buy next gen console etc, but I think this show proves people want to see reasons to buy next gen. So once again the overall feel about the show was that it underwhelmed.
If the show was any other year that wasn't a launch year, it would've been paised as an amazing show.

They should've even done split screen comparisons with gears and horizon 4 like they did with ori.(even compared it to 1S) Just not spend lot of time on it. Or do it with couple new games to show what you're getting, maybe as separate vids after show?

Where was flight simulator? Maybe next show but this one needed it.
So their not really marketing next gen apart from hollow words.
Like the 1X marketing its the most powerful, with little in the early days that showed it.

Flight simulator comes out next month on the 18th. I was actually surprised to see grounded to be honest

 

[eastmen]

This isn't isn't true.
They've discussed it on video before.

It's up to MS to demonstrate that their mantra how much games scale and the value of xsx. I don't think many people are seeing it at the moment, even fast loading was only shown in that one vid months ago.
If halo had the RT they would discuss it for example.
Once again this show was about xsx, trouble is for most people it seemed to just showed it can play 1X games.

was it ?

Pretty sure it was called Xbox Games Showcase . Xbox is more than just the xsx.



I just want to point something out

This spawned the xbox 360 is an xbox 1.5 memes of the day and everyone saying wait for ps3.

Nov 2005
https://cdn.gamer-network.net/2015/usgamer/WallGuy.jpg

Nov 2006

What a difference a year makes huh

 

[Jay]

Pretty sure it was called Xbox Games Showcase . Xbox is more than just the xsx.

Doesn't matter what it was called in that regards.

Based on the show and and what they said in it, it was about gamepass and xsx.
They only really did a good job demonstrating gamepass.

 

[dobwal]

I didn't get that at all. I think they were merely stating that ever since the XBX, MS was focusing on raw compute and so far they have don't have much to show for it with the XBSX. But now with the overall homogenous platform strategy of selling subscriptions it would seem MS is done chasing having the best hardware (which is a good thing since it was never the real issue with the XBO). They just have to make sure they will commit to making/fostering world class gaming software to keep the subscription business healthy because in the end thats all that matters to a platform.

One has nothing to do with the other. On the software side, MS doesn’t seem to want to abandon subscription paying customers who aren’t going to immediately jump ship to the next generation.

On the hardware side, they will put out a high performance console that any third party dev can take advantage of from day one.

Two different sides of the same business with different leadership hierarchies that report to Phil. The hardware side focused on delivering what hardcore gamers want which is powerful console. Whereas the software side is more focused on delivering software and services that appeal to the breadth of the user base.

It’s similar to Epic’s approach. They build engines capable of competing with best in class visuals. Yet their approach software wise revolves around fortnite whose visuals don’t come close to competing with AAA games that prioritize graphics.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

was it ?

Pretty sure it was called Xbox Games Showcase . Xbox is more than just the xsx.



I just want to point something out

This spawned the xbox 360 is an xbox 1.5 memes of the day and everyone saying wait for ps3.

Nov 2005
https://cdn.gamer-network.net/2015/usgamer/WallGuy.jpg

Nov 2006

What a difference a year makes huh

Halo Inifinite release is 4 months away, not one year.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

Watched the video, as I'ld only seen the halo trailer before

halo: embarrassment
forza: looks brilliant, if they can output that then will be the best looking racer, my only complaint is its looks too clean
everwild: love the miyazaki art style, still experimenting with the gameplay! well I can sympathize somewhat with my game currently
tell me why: meh
ori: looks good
outer worlds: bad
grounded: looks pretty bad, though fun, I want to play this one.
avowed: cgi
Matt Booty!!! wat
as dusk falls: interesting
hellblade 2: I have a feeling it will end up close to this in parts, which is the best looking xbox one game, but will have to see gameplay (scrub that, crossfire looks to be ahead)
psychonauts 2: brilliant graphics, doesnt look like an xbox game, very excited to see this
destiny 2: yes of course it looked better than halo but still not that good at all.
stalker 2: the last part where the person looks back, this is near chernobyl, its what the russians used to detect if the USA launched missiles, to me being there, its more impressive than chernobyl. if you get the chance go there!
warhammer: looks good, but CGI
tetris: I'ld have to see it
the gunk: looks to be fun to play
the medium: top 3 for graphics
fantasy star online 2: nearly as bad as halo
crossfire X: brilliant, better than hellblade, the faces were not as good though, particle effects were brilliant
fable: cgi

What happened to State of Decay 3 which in my opinion looked the best of the lot with Fable. Yes it was CGI but if the game could be rendered the same, it would look awesome.

Forca was all CGI too.

Most of the games you listed were 95-100% CGI/cutscenes. Halo was gameplay while Ori, The Gunk, Outer Worlds, Medium and Crossfire had a few seconds of gameplay which I would really not decribe as gameplay because people in this forum said the competitors games weren't gameplay i.e. Spider-man when it clearly showed gameplay in it for a few seconds.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

This is where i think your wrong.

If your not interested in gamepass or a service, that in no way de-values the console in the way you could use it if there was no gamepass to begin with.

I agree. I feel Microsoft are trying to walk a fine line between promoting GamePass - and re-enforcing that all he games shown on Thursday are coming to GamePass was great - and trying to make their new consoles appeal. On the latter front, Microsoft put in very little effort thus far but I think this will ramp up when they announce console pricing.

Despite Phil Spencer claiming he doesn't want to "force" people into a new generation with new hardware, Microsoft spent a lot of time and money on the R&D for Xbox Series X and they absolutely do want to sell as many consoles as possible. There are plenty of people who live in Microsoft and Sony's ecosystems and while there are clear reasons to get a PS5 (for PS5-only games) there are less reasons to get Series X or Series X unless you care about performance - sales of Pro and One X tell us this is only a fraction of each user base.

The risk of not making Series X/S appeal more, is people may just go PS5 for a while and, as you do with any new purchase, you spend more time with it and Microsoft do not want people with Xbox spending more time in Sony's ecosystem because they may find themselves questioning that monthly GamePass subscription until a game they do want to play comes out.

I think Microsoft have two strategies that are not completely synergetic. But this is more a communications/perception thing. What Microsoft have done, as others have commented, is hedge their bets very smartly.

edit: typos/grammer.

 

[eastmen]

Doesn't matter what it was called in that regards.

Based on the show and and what they said in it, it was about gamepass and xsx.
They only really did a good job demonstrating gamepass.

Game pass is made up of a slew of games that are all available on XSX so if they did a good job demonstrating game pass they did a good job demonstrating xsx

 

[eastmen]

Halo Inifinite release is 4 months away, not one year.

My point is that launch games are not indictive of what the console will ultimately go on to do graphicly.

Aside from that we don't really know what bugs were happening. One call out was there were no shadows on the enemies but there were shadows on the warthogs. So there are obviously still bugs in there. I'll wait till we are closer to launch and at the end of the day if game play and story is good I don't really care. I will be playing it on game pass

 

[Deleted member 86764]

This is where i think your wrong.

If your not interested in gamepass or a service, that in no way de-values the console in the way you could use it if there was no gamepass to begin with.

Now the underlying reason you feel like that I do understand.
The reason I always was for next gen exclusives, even if early ones people may see as glorified tech demos is to show what is possible.
Rachet did that, UE5 did it, we didn't get anything like that in this show.

People keep saying MS doesn't care if you buy next gen console etc, but I think this show proves people want to see reasons to buy next gen. So once again the overall feel about the show was that it underwhelmed.
If the show was any other year that wasn't a launch year, it would've been paised as an amazing show.

They should've even done split screen comparisons with gears and horizon 4 like they did with ori.(even compared it to 1S) Just not spend lot of time on it. Or do it with couple new games to show what you're getting, maybe as separate vids after show?

Where was flight simulator? Maybe next show but this one needed it.
So their not really marketing next gen apart from hollow words.
Like the 1X marketing its the most powerful, with little in the early days that showed it.

Microsoft want their games to be crossgenerational at the expense of their latest and greatest machine. Everything I saw (except maybe Forza and The Medium) looked pretty much like higher resolution or frame rate current gen.

I do not buy a next gen machine to play last gen games.

Microsoft did an incredible job at getting backwards compatibility working on the Xbox One. I have no doubt. They worked miracles getting that to function. It's just not what I'd do with a new console beyond curiosity.

Gamepass is also at odds with how I want to play since it seems like really blockbuster games won't be present - at least those that were shown. I have no intent to play everything that comes out, paying extra will not make me feel more inclined. It's just not meant for me. I tried PS Now for the trial period and realised that it didn't offer anything I wanted to play. The same is true here.

So beyond my interest in the technology, the new Xbox is deviating from my expectation of what a console (especially a next gen one) should be.

Despite all that there are some games that look interesting, as I've mentioned.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

Beats me man , i watched on mixer so i wasn't keeping track.

I wonder how the xbox 360 reveals were received vs the ps3 reveals. People watching online videos does not equate into sales. I thought we all learned that with Snakes on a plane

Sure but I would say that it does indicate how many could be interested in the consoles.

It also will explain why the rumour that Sony doubled the orders of the PS5 sounds believable.

I have no doubt XBox will sell consoles. However I have my doubts that most will be XBSX(Scarlett) and think most will likely be XBSX(LH). Of course the fan boys and people that can afford it and are knowledgable about the consoles will buy Scarlett.

 

[Arwin]

Let’s just say that this presentation was very weak in focus on what it wanted to present.

 

[PSman1700]

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/...q5Ru1oUnIWlxAjhRZ_uyTrT9ebtZKunmVlO3gbMkd1VRk

''Neither PlayStation nor Xbox delivered a slam dunk when making the software case for their new hardware launches this year.''

''We didn't get a decisive megaton announcement from either.''

So what was all the hype for the SSD's for since the beginning of 2019 lol. It's the slightest jump in performance/visuals since.... ever.

 

[Jay]

Flight simulator comes out next month on the 18th. I was actually surprised to see grounded to be honest

Not for Xbox it doesn't, same with gears tactics.

 

[HBRU]

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/...q5Ru1oUnIWlxAjhRZ_uyTrT9ebtZKunmVlO3gbMkd1VRk

''Neither PlayStation nor Xbox delivered a slam dunk when making the software case for their new hardware launches this year.''

''We didn't get a decisive megaton announcement from either.''

So what was all the hype for the SSD's for since the beginning of 2019 lol. It's the slightest jump in performance/visuals since.... ever.

I'm saying this since years.
There will be -hopefully- the 60 fps. Stop.

 

[Deleted member 86764]

I disagree. The PS5 presentation showed multiple games that looked "next gen". It'd be possible to pick out a bunch that most people have forgotten about, that look impossible on current gen without major adjustments.

There was even one game that showed things the competing machine is incapable of doing at the same speed.

 

[Karamazov]

GT7 (work in progress) already at 4K/60 fps with RT and dynamic TOD and volumetric clouds + a lot more trackside details over GTS, with gameplay showcased, seem not enough for DF i guess.
nor were almost instant worlds switch in ratchet.