GT4 in Game Cube, how it could be this version?

[London Geezer]

Do you really think they make 100% profit on each game sold?

"breaking even" means recouping whatever they spent without profit.
So, to repay whatever money they spent on the game, they need to sell $80M/$50 = 1600000 copies. Anything more is a profit.

 

[Devourer]

If RE4 is possible on GCN then GT3/4 is possible on it too.

Yes, letterboxed, 30 fps and 16bit texture with lots of dithering I think it would be more than likely.

Congratulation for comparing two radically different game engines.

To anser the question: GT4 is of course possible on GC. Just the pixel fill rate may be a concern to 60fps at 1080i.

 

[DuckThor Evil]

Do you really think they make 100% profit on each game sold?

"breaking even" means recouping whatever they spent without profit.
So, to repay whatever money they spent on the game, they need to sell $80M/$50 = 1600000 copies. Anything more is a profit.

Yes but they don't get 50$ when they sell a game to retailers.

 

[London Geezer]

Do you really think they make 100% profit on each game sold?

"breaking even" means recouping whatever they spent without profit.
So, to repay whatever money they spent on the game, they need to sell $80M/$50 = 1600000 copies. Anything more is a profit.

Yes but they don't get 50$ when they sell a game to retailers.

Well it has to be seen if the 80million figure takes into account all the expenses involved into releaseing the game itself.
In the end, GT4 already sold around a million copies in Japan alone, i think it's safe to assume Sony will make quite a big profit once the game is released in the US and especially Europe.

 

[Control_Pad]

I think that Poliphony Digital it's like Rare when this stays in Nintendo, we seen games very impressive like Donky Kong Country (Snes), Goldeneye or Conker on N64... games beyond of our imagination in these machines.

With the correct development team, a machine can be better of other most powerful machines.

 

[Almasy]

Well it has to be seen if the 80million figure takes into account all the expenses involved into releaseing the game itself.
In the end, GT4 already sold around a million copies in Japan alone, i think it's safe to assume Sony will make quite a big profit once the game is released in the US and especially Europe.

Do you have a link confirming the $80 million budget?

 

[London Geezer]

Well it has to be seen if the 80million figure takes into account all the expenses involved into releaseing the game itself.
In the end, GT4 already sold around a million copies in Japan alone, i think it's safe to assume Sony will make quite a big profit once the game is released in the US and especially Europe.

Do you have a link confirming the $80 million budget?

No, i wasn't the one bringing it up...

 

[Almasy]

No, i wasn't the one bringing it up...

Neither did I...someone else did. Why? Maybe because that guy wanted to explain how GT4 is able to look that good.

Being serious, I can´t believe some people dismiss the game´s graphics due to some "PS2-enhancing" budget. Forza doesn´t look nowhere near as good, and neither does PGR2 (both have better than ok budgets I presume), so I like to think Polyphony is doing something great somewhere in that old machine.

 

[Evil_Cloud]

Well it has to be seen if the 80million figure takes into account all the expenses involved into releaseing the game itself.
In the end, GT4 already sold around a million copies in Japan alone, i think it's safe to assume Sony will make quite a big profit once the game is released in the US and especially Europe.

Do you have a link confirming the $80 million budget?

I don't have a link, but I got the estimate (60 - 80 million dollars) from Fishie, the European correspondent for The-Next Level and Got-Next (and others). He did interviews with all the big names in the industry, and he wanted to ask Kazunori how he felt about GT4 not making a profit at all, so I would take this figure as realistic.

 

[London Geezer]

No, i wasn't the one bringing it up...

Neither did I...someone else did. Why? Maybe because that guy wanted to explain how GT4 is able to look that good.

Not a prob, i mean i can believe that GT4 cost a lot to make, you have to think about the amount of work behind it.
People seem to stop at the surface, they seem to think that the budget of a game is spent on graphics and sound... Obviously most of the money is spent of the content itself, not on the technicalities.
700 cars to model, 50 tracks to model and texture, all the physics data which is different from car to car, all the cars mechanics... That's where most of the money went, not on how pretty it is or on 1080i.

 

[Almasy]

Yes, I am aware that most of the budget goes to the content itself (IIRC, I even mentioned it before in the thread). However, a figure of $60-80 just seems unreal (I wonder how that journalist came up with that figure) and Sony would need what? 5 million copies sold to make a decent profit?

It just sounds slightly stupid to not profit from your biggest property.

 

[London Geezer]

Yes, I am aware that most of the budget goes to the content itself (IIRC, I even mentioned it before in the thread). However, a figure of $60-80 just seems unreal (I wonder how that journalist came up with that figure) and Sony would need what? 5 million copies sold to make a decent profit?

It just sounds slightly stupid to not profit from your biggest property.

5 million copies would be a revenue of around 250million dollars (exchange rates will mess the figure up), more or less, which is a very good figure if you ask me.
I think that Sony knows that they need GT4 to boost their image, not to make a profit, if you know what i mean.
It's a given that GT4 will sell like hotcakes, but i think Sony's main priority is the impact the game will have in people's minds and in PS2's image, more than any profit they will make out of the game itself.

 

[V3]

700 cars to model, 50 tracks to model and texture, all the physics data which is different from car to car, all the cars mechanics... That's where most of the money went, not on how pretty it is or on 1080i.

You got it wrong, they spend the money on high octane fuels and track time for them to race each other.

Now you know why GT4 arrive so late

 

[London Geezer]

You got it wrong, they spend the money on high octane fuels and track time for them to race each other.

Now you know why GT4 arrive so late

I was gonna mention that!

PD: "Ken, we need more data on this new Viper model handling and maximum speed"
Ken Kutaragi: "OK, but hurry up! We've already delayed the..."
PD: VVVVRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOMMMMMMMM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! "YEEEAAHHH GUYS CHECK THIS OUT, WE GOT ANOTHER MONTH!!!!!!!"

 

[talyn99]

Thanks Phil, you said alot of things better than I can, due to my lack of 'jargon-tech' skills. I respect what Li has to say as well, but will always ask questions.

Yeah, Capcom is far from the best at getting anywhere near the full power of the PS2, that is one thing that is for sure. BUt who can deny the Dynasty warrioer scene involving Jaques. There was soe slowdown, but it was incredible. SIgh, let me name some games:
GTA
Killzone
Wanda and the Colossus
Cold Fear
(Looks the same on X-box as it does for PS2, and it rips off certain RE4 elements)
God of War
Jak3

To name a few, like I said, Li said on another post they do not share secrets, but what I see unisoft doing makes me proud to own my 'aging' system. Bottom line is this, with all this late flexibility the aging PS2 is showing, and still is not 100% tap. SOme of you should have more faith, as well as the fact that a few MB of RAM is in PS1 chipset in PS2's and can be used as spare RAM in the PS2 in-game processes(read that few years back)
The weakness lies in Capcom, so some of you should stop sounding so frickin self righteous, cause you can accurately describes what makes us all fart. But yeah, capcom, need to swallow their pride and instead of a crappy port, beg some top developers for some tech help, to make a PS2 proud port of RE4.

 

[Evil_Cloud]

Yes, I am aware that most of the budget goes to the content itself (IIRC, I even mentioned it before in the thread). However, a figure of $60-80 just seems unreal (I wonder how that journalist came up with that figure) and Sony would need what? 5 million copies sold to make a decent profit?

It just sounds slightly stupid to not profit from your biggest property.

3 - 4 years in development.
706 licenced cars
Licenced parts, brands, properties,...
Licenced soundtrack
Equipment/Technology
Large staff cost
Photosessions around the world
...

Also, if I were to follow London-boy's logic, Shenmue should've been profitable as well. After all, the total cost was about 35 million dollars, and it sold + 2 million units in total, at $50 a game = 100 million dollar profit. Not.

I think that Poliphony Digital it's like Rare when this stays in Nintendo, we seen games very impressive like Donky Kong Country (Snes), Goldeneye or Conker on N64... games beyond of our imagination in these machines.

With the correct development team, a machine can be better of other most powerful machines.

Only difference being Polyphony Digital making only two games in 5 years time.

 

[London Geezer]

Yes, I am aware that most of the budget goes to the content itself (IIRC, I even mentioned it before in the thread). However, a figure of $60-80 just seems unreal (I wonder how that journalist came up with that figure) and Sony would need what? 5 million copies sold to make a decent profit?

It just sounds slightly stupid to not profit from your biggest property.

3 - 4 years in development.
706 licenced cars
Licenced parts, brands, properties,...
Licenced soundtrack
Equipment/Technology
Large staff cost
Photosessions around the world
...

We have to think that there is also a lot of advertising involved in GT4. I'd think Sony got quite a lot of money from all the names present in the game, in the end it's all publicity for them. NOT talking about the car manufacturers, not sure about their deal, but there is a lot of adverts on recent racing games and i'd think a lot of companies were more than happy to give Sony some cash to appear on a huge game like GT4 on tracks billboards and stuff.

Also, if I were to follow London-boy's logic, Shenmue should've been profitable as well. After all, the total cost was about 35 million dollars, and it sold + 2 million units in total, at $50 a game = 100 million dollar profit. Not.

No, that's YOUR logic.
50x2M=100M REVENUE. Not Profit. Very different.

 

[Evil_Cloud]

No, that's YOUR logic.
50x2M=100M REVENUE. Not Profit. Very different.

Alright, alright revenue, but it's still not profitable. ;p

 

[Li Mu Bai]

If RE4 is possible on GCN then GT3/4 is possible on it too.

Yes, letterboxed, 30 fps and 16bit texture with lots of dithering I think it would be more than likely.

Congratulation for comparing two radically different game engines.

To anser the question: GT4 is of course possible on GC. Just the pixel fill rate may be a concern to 60fps at 1080i.

It's not even true 1080i, nor 720p for that matter. (4mb of VRAM cannot display true HDTV resolutions.) It's displaying 640x1080i internally and then stretching it horizontally x3 (basically showing the same pixel 3 times in a row horizonatlly). That's far from true 1080i (1920 horizonal pixels). It's not even rendering as many pixels as 720P (1280 pixels x 720 pixels vertically).

In a single frame (60th of a second), GT4's "Hivision" potentially has to crank out 345,600 new pixels (640x540), while a true 1080i 60FPS game would have to crank out 1,036,800 new pixels (1920x540), and 720P 60FPS game would have to crank out 921,600 new pixels (1280x720).

345,600 vs. 1,036,800. That's only a third of true 1080i. (just in case you missed the discussion) Though still quite a feat acheived by Polyphony. And btw no PS2 games have dithering, shimmering, IQ problems, etc.?

 

[Tysan]

Spending as much time developing/optimizing the game as Poliphony has done with GT4 [¿3+ years?] I cant see why GC could not have a similar racing engine [Similar=some shortcomings and some nicers bits].

That said I do not see right now another developer that can put so much effort in a racing game as Poliphony, well maybe Namco...