'Free to play' - gaming enricher or scourge? *spawn
- Thread starter Shifty Geezer
- Start date
Yep
Sure, but you can just buy your way to victory and the design is to get you to do that.
Well... I think it depends on the players too. It's not determined solely by the game.
In Clash of Clans, some people came in and just spent big $$$ to buy their position into the game. They didn't even play the game first to decide whether it's worth it.
I surmise it's because their friends are also in the game, and they want to keep up. Or they want to be a clan elder. Or they hate to lose. ^_^
In Clash of Clans, some people came in and just spent big $$$ to buy their position into the game. They didn't even play the game first to decide whether it's worth it.
I surmise it's because their friends are also in the game, and they want to keep up. Or they want to be a clan elder. Or they hate to lose. ^_^
F2P isn't bad in itself, it just requires that developers/publishers to walk a fine line where balance and rewards aren't entirely or mostly based on how much one pays.
But those same people want to make money, and their need to make money will outpace their need to make a good game. Honestly F2P wouldn't be bad if you could choose to pay a reasonable price for a whole game upfront will no limitations, or if highly skilled free players can easily obtain almost whatever they want with little tedium in exchange.
The problem comes from too much temptation from a business perspective to make it work, and just testing out how much will people are susceptible to paying ridiculous amounts of real money for fake currency and in-game items only help highlight that problem.
But those same people want to make money, and their need to make money will outpace their need to make a good game. Honestly F2P wouldn't be bad if you could choose to pay a reasonable price for a whole game upfront will no limitations, or if highly skilled free players can easily obtain almost whatever they want with little tedium in exchange.
The problem comes from too much temptation from a business perspective to make it work, and just testing out how much will people are susceptible to paying ridiculous amounts of real money for fake currency and in-game items only help highlight that problem.
The fundamental issue is this in f2p you have a single trivially evaluated metric to optimize for and you get almost instant feedback when tweaking the system to optimise that metric.
Look at games like candy crush which is very popular currently, at some level it's a return to 1980's arcade design philosophy, N easy levels followed by one ludicrously hard one you have to spend to overcome. To me it was a huge leap when computer games stopped copying arcade games, I hate to see a return to pay to extend the game.
I guarantee the average player who puts significant time into a f2p game is spending more for IMO a worse experience.
Yes there are good f2p games, but it changes fundamentally the way you look at game design.
F2p doesn't equal pay to win though, that's just one mechanic. I played 146 levels of candy crush without paying to win, and I don't know anyone that did pay (or at least admitted to doing so). But I did end up hating the game because there was too much random about it, and you had to wait for other players to help you unlock the next level (or pay).
I still tipped one level of unlock in the jar as I certainly got that much money's worth.
And also important: a lot of regular games were made to be stupid because publishers were (too) risk averse, etc.
Make no mistake though, there is some serious math underlying some of these games, and the results can be really ugly.
Hopefully though we'll settle on something that allows the best of both worlds. I like for instance that many iOS versions of games have a free, ad-sponsored version as well as a pay version.
No Dust really is totally P2W.
It is true that you can obtain everything in-game BUT the entire game really favors those that have more isk and you can actually buy isk with real money and gear/vehicles bought with real money is better than in-game gear/vehicles.
Also there are in-game skill that improve your stats and you can actually buy XP boost so to "level up" faster which is really P2W.
Also unlike other F2P in Dust 514 you actually loose what you bought which is perfect to milk to death those that are willing to spend real money in it.
No really Dust 514 is the epitome of what's wrong in F2P: poor concept, poor execution, little content, unbalanced, P2W, disinterested and false developers.
Edit.
Oh and I don't 'say this for hate, I was actually looking forward to Dust 514 before the beta.
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I was looking for tips on a game my kid plays, and i found hacks for many of these pay to win games.
The server controlled games like GW2 (played it, even bought some credits to check the mechanism) don't have that hack option, instead there is bots that do the tedious job and gets the credits in another way, also "free".
Especially shooters is a turn off when they do this, you enter a server and everyone is loaded except you, that is where it's tempting to buy your way to a gear level.. i just drop them instead
what about a game that ask you to buy new DLC to finish the game?
Its not F2P, its not P2W. Its something like.. P2F? (pay to finish?)
And its different from episodic game like tell tales games games. (back to the future, walking dead, sam and max).
Asura's Wrath is a full retail game. But the last 3 mission are chopped out. To finish the game, you need to buy the 3 DLCs.
Its not F2P, its not P2W. Its something like.. P2F? (pay to finish?)
And its different from episodic game like tell tales games games. (back to the future, walking dead, sam and max).
Asura's Wrath is a full retail game. But the last 3 mission are chopped out. To finish the game, you need to buy the 3 DLCs.
No, You cant buy Your way to victory. You still have to do everything not-paying consumer does. Just check whats in the shop or play the game
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No, it does not, especially when normal MP games are designed in exactly the same way. And there are F2P games that arent designed around convenience, so how they are proving Your point about design?
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Thats actually good that items break, even bought one. Its not to milk people, but have meaningful economy, and about economy they know a lot as You would imagine.
Where did You get info that weapons/vehicles bought by AUR are better? I've read something opposite, that they are exactly the same, just weapon bought with AUR You can use one skill tier earlier.
XP Boosters are more convenience, but yeah it can called P2W
As i said, Dust 514 shouldnt be judged now. Its CCP, they will work on it for years and game will get tons and tons better, just dont get why they are still trying to stick to PS3
You are constantly driven past the option to spend real money to acquire better gear more quickly. Yes most things can be acquired without using real coin, but it is very apparent very quickly that you will get there faster if you do. ie. Buy your way to victory.No, You cant buy Your way to victory. You still have to do everything not-paying consumer does. Just check whats in the shop or play the game
To me is bad not to have permanent purchases.
In Dust you can buy the same single time unlimited times forever which it's a perfect money black hole if you ask me.
Well when I was in beta AUR items/gear/vehicles had better stats or more slots so it was really P2W.
just don't get why they are still trying to stick to PS3
Because console FPS are far more popular than EVE and so there are lots of "money wells" to tap
Also on PC there are far better F2P FPS , MMO and not, so Dust had more chances to win on console than on PC.
Sadly Dust 514 is a poor FPS and it should have come out last year when no shooter MMO was in sight on PS3, when it was the novelty, but now on PS3 there's Defiance and Destiny is coming so Dust lost its occasion.
In time Dust 514 will probably get better better but so its competitors that are already a step ahead of it.
IMO there is no audience for Dust on PS4 now that PalnetSide 2, Blacklight, Warframe are on PS4.
I didn't play many F2P but I played Hawken, Blacklight, Warframe and PS2 and even though I only played them briefly they IMO are good games.
If I have to name good F2P I would name these ones and Tribes Ascend but I heard it sadly went south.
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Did anyone seriously attempt episodic content other than Valve? And Valve is well ... a special case when it comes to releasing games in a timely manner.
The main problem with F2P is that it's wrong. The gaming industry is becoming filled with sleaze who use monetary success to claim legitimacy and drag everyone else down with them ... more and more it's becoming an industry only suited to sociopaths and people good at rationalization or self-loathing.
If there's no advantage to buying content, why does anyone buy any content?No, You cant buy Your way to victory. You still have to do everything not-paying consumer does. Just check whats in the shop or play the game
Yes, do you not remember Halcyon Sun came complete with tv series
http://www.muramasaindustries.com/fiction/halcyonsun/halcyonsun.html
Still plenty of people just buying costumes and such. Which doesn't necessarily hurt competitiveness, just 'boosts' your online in-game identity, visually.
