Digital Foundry Microsoft Xbox Scorpio Reveal [2017: 04-06, 04-11, 04-15, 04-16]

Discussion in 'Console Technology' started by iroboto, Apr 6, 2017.

  1. iroboto

    iroboto Daft Funk
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    FINALLY THE ANSWER!!
    waiting forever for this.

    That's why XBO has 2 Command Processors!
    1 that is customized for the microcode, and 1 that is not.
    Only one is ever used!
     
  2. Clukos

    Clukos Bloodborne 2 when?
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  3. Dave Baumann

    Dave Baumann Gamerscore Wh...
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    Fiji is already 64 CU's...
     
  4. ToTTenTranz

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    4GB for OS sounds like way too much bloat regardless of functionality. Never mind Windows 10 that runs on 2GB if needed. We now have smartphones/tablets running tens of apps in the background and giving away push notifications, and those do very well with only 2GB total. And 1GB dedicated to a 4K dashboard? Why?!


    No word on FP16 throughput, much less Vega's "Rapid Packed Math" that allows 2*FP16 and 4*uint8. News of 2*FP16 on the PS4 Pro actually came up some weeks after the console was in the stores, so they may actually be saving this for later.
    It'll be very weird if Scorpio doesn't have this, though. And it could bring the Pro uncomfortably close to Scorpio in ALU-intensive multiplatform titles.

    Also no HDMI 2.1, so no Variable Refresh Rate either...



    The claim is really "Native 4K on games that were 1080p on Xbone, and some games that were 900p."
    If you look at a pure specs comparison, Scorpio's GPU should indeed be able to do >4x more work than Xbone's.

    Of course, this would mean sticking with the same draw distance, same shader LOD, same AF/AA levels, etc.
    I'm not sure most developers will be very fond of this. Except maybe for the people with 70"+ TVs (a very tiny population among the already smallish amount of 4K users?), there may be very little gains in going full 4K instead of e.g. 1800p + upscale, while using the extra power to upgrade other stuff.


    To be honest, from their description of the "it sounds exactly like the Graphics Command Processor we've had since GCN2.
    I may be missing something, because I have no idea why Leadbetter made sure to mention it.



    I wouldn't be so sure about higher IPC.
    Latency reduction is a by-product of higher clocks, and the customization could simply amount to tweaking the architecture to allow a higher clock rate without breaking TDP limits.
    I would be convinced there was a lot of customization if they had changed the amount of L2 cache, or turned it into a full 8-core module instead of 2*4-core modules, or introduced some L3 cache.
    But given the info we have, it's just uncannily similar to what we already have in the PS4 Pro.
     
  5. iroboto

    iroboto Daft Funk
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    ahh, well. I'm running a 1070 and a corei5 and it's not easy to achieve 4K either. So at the price point Scorpio will sell at, as well as being couch entertainment, I think it holds well on it's own. Price performance value is going to be very good on Scorpio. Considering I paid $650 CAD for my 1070, I can't see Scorpio at worst, much higher than that.

    its' the cheapest platform for 4K and will likely have the largest library of 4K* games in the console space.
     
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  6. senis_kenis

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  7. iroboto

    iroboto Daft Funk
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    Continuation of their work I think, just pushing even further.

    #1803

    ExecuteIndirect allows for GPU generated draw calls, but it was limited in fashion, the XBO microcode helped make it more flexible, but it sounds like they've got nearly the whole GPU doing the draw call generation now with execute indirect.
     
  8. iroboto

    iroboto Daft Funk
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    yea I agree, it makes sense to have. I never understood why there was 2, or the purpose, now i the debugging bit. One is only ever used.

    it doesn't change the fact that only XBO has the micro-op code changes for executeIndirect though, DICE made that apparent in their slide deck.
     
  9. Goodtwin

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    Wait, so the new Scorpio isn't even using the new AMD Ryzen CPU? Its just an upgraded Jaguar CPU? Xbox Scorpio fail confirmed. LOL Kidding of course. Looks like a really nice piece of tech to me. In a way, It think the Scorpio and PS4 Pro deliver what consumers were expecting from the base models back in 2013. Not 4K, but the ability to deliver 1080p visuals at 60fps. I think a lot of people were surprised just how many games still run at sub 1080p and 30fps with the PS4 and X1. Im sure the core Xbox fans will be chomping at the bit to get their hands on a Scorpio later this year.
     
  10. Clukos

    Clukos Bloodborne 2 when?
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    o_O and i thought the prices in EU were f'd up.
     
  11. iroboto

    iroboto Daft Funk
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    tax =(.

    I thought i was getting a steal at $579
     
  12. DeanoC

    DeanoC Trust me, I'm a renderer person!
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    WTF?! Do you know what microcode is? Every CP program is called microcode. You really you should go read the ROCm kernel source code, if you want to understand our current architectures for PC parts. and see what a CP really does...

    And the GPU I was talking about that had two CP, wasn't in any XBox...
     
  13. iroboto

    iroboto Daft Funk
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    there's specific microcode that they implemented, I apologize, I was too excited, I was waiting years for the explanation of why 2 CP would be on a GPU.
     
  14. Gubbi

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    It's not the OS that takes up the ram, it's apps.

    IMO, it's one of the best features of the XBox One; The game I paused two nights ago is instantly available even though my kids watched cartoons on Viaplay, the wife watched Netflix and I watched NHL/Twitch TV in between.

    Cheers
     
  15. VGA

    VGA
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  16. Dave Baumann

    Dave Baumann Gamerscore Wh...
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    Because its early in the bring-up, life and potential software targets for the platform? We've seen many times these specs get altered and optimized as the platform settles, better to make a big reservation to start and refine down later rather than have to alter the developer specs later.

    Too early. HDMI 2.1 features have been announced but actually specifications are only just due, implementation (i.e. logic) and then subsequent chip development can only really begin now.

    http://www.hdmi.org/manufacturer/hdmi_2_1/index.aspx

    "The new specification will be available to all HDMI 2.0 Adopters and they will be notified when it is released early in Q2 2017"
    "The HDMI 2.1 Compliance Test Specification (CTS) will be published in Q2-Q3 2017."
     
  17. chris1515

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    This why I postponed buying a 4k Tv to next year...
     
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  18. mrcorbo

    mrcorbo Foo Fighter
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    To anyone who is basing their hot takes on just the videos, read the articles. They will likely clear some things up for you.

    @iroboto - credit where credit is due, you were clearly correctly evaluating the potential of offloading the task of feeding the GPU from the CPU.

    Also, I'm totally shocked they were able to go fast instead of wide to get to 6TF. I didn't consider 40CUs a possibility at all.

    Seems like this design will deliver exactly what was promised.
     
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  19. BRiT

    BRiT (╯°□°)╯
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    Wrong. Their WiiU OS reserved 50% of all available RAM. ;)

    I am disappointed they're using another GB for the OS, but I figure it'll be used for recording and broadcasting in 4K. Those buffers had to be increased too!
     
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  20. Clukos

    Clukos Bloodborne 2 when?
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    I assume they are using the new version of Polaris that runs at higher frequencies.
     
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